Yeah sorry I forgot to add “in my opinion”
And also by the term lag crash I mean every crash that doesn’t seem right making the LFS’s collision detection worthless.
I didn't said anything about advertizing. all I said is just about "feel".

Well 0:22 lag crash , 0:31 lag crash , 0:33 the outcome of a lag crash
0:26 unfair bump 0:43 unfair hit on the straight

No matter how well made the video is, those shots don’t give a nice feeling about the competition.

Nicely made clip but I would prefer less crashes especially the “lagged” ones.

Nice work. Inspired script (I loved the UF1 part)
Well I think that in some spots the speed up playback was noticeable (eg at the ending of the first part) but that’s not enough to effect negatively the fun concept.

All aspects are really well put together. Good job.
(HQ vertions would be nice :tilt

You could choose to show us one good battle moment from every one of those who raced and still give the idea of the crowded field. but that’s really hard work to do.

Don't take me wrong, I am not willing to underestimate your work but separating the thrillseeker from the organized race fan isn't the solution there.

(PS I still have in my faivorite LFS movies folder that 302ΜΒ 10min movie of Imphenzia TR S1 )

Last edited by kaynd, Sun, 1 Jun 2008 11:25.

The movie is good generally
Some nice cameras, enough effects, good synchronization etc
But there is not so good flow of the action.
There are some noticeable repetitions in some scenes and some really long-not so interesting shots. eg 00:43-1:06 - 1:07-1:30

Indeed it acts like damping when the amount of feedback steps exceeds the wheel’s capabilities.
When I had the DFP I had also strength values that low. (something like 35% from the driver and 75% from the game) and the FF step value lower (not 64 though)

Now since about 8 months ago, I am using a G25 and I found out that there is no much difference between 128-256 ffsteps regarding the feedback crispness from the bumps, curbs etc.
(yeah… I have changed my mind some time after this thread and maybe I wouldn't notice the difference in the first place, if the default FF step num hadn't chance from 128 to 256 back then at patch U days)
I also understand that, with that high feedback force I am using (100% drivers & 65% in game), I don’t have accurate feedback at all… just clipping and on-off forces when going over bumps…
But in that way I have enough wheel “weight” around the center and that helps me feel the car’s dampers easier while changing directions. (Really useful in fine tuning the suspension)


Thanks for the reply, but as you can understand it's difficult to change settings that you have got used to, even if they might theoretically be more realistic.
Since the feedback hardware that recent wheels have is far away from produsing realy convincing forces, comparing to a real car's wheel, what setting values feel right is a subjective matter.

Last edited by kaynd, Sun, 1 Jun 2008 06:40.

UFR rolls way to easy just because of high traction and power (using a locked diff)

You can easily flip UF1 using nothing more than weight transfer.
Just keep the suspension as higher as possible and much harder to the heavy end of the car, because that’s where you need to have the grater weight transfer in order to flip.

[edit] I now downloaded savboy's set and saw that we used the same spring stifness.
I just set the front stifness to max and gave it some damping to avoid frequant hops that reduce the already low UF1 tire traction.
The rear stiffness was a lucky strike. I just set it there so I have similar ride height front-back with the same maxed out spring length.
Then just full negative camber - lowest pressures, 0 toe and that's it.

Last edited by kaynd, Sat, 24 May 2008 06:47.

Quote from Clownpaint :

... And a quantity increase. We aim to have setups for every combo in hotlap, sprint and endurance forms. This requires a higher quantity.

fair enough

Yeah I did read the rules… but I mean.
If 5 competitors upload 40 setup each. Who is going to check them all?

And who defines the “inaccurate” setup? It doesn’t have to bounce like a ball to be inaccurate…
I have 977 setups in my setup folder, many of them are made by me and most of them seem to be valid… but I know they are not competitive anymore.

Anyway I understand that this competition is a smart and fun way to fill a bit faster the setup grid.
But to my in my opinion it’s not the best way, knowing that massive setup upload will cause quality drop.

Nice promoting move there.

Too bad I am not so active at setup making or general racing for some months now, or else I would give it a shot, but now I don’t stand a chance and there is no point uploading useless setups… (most of them are outdated (before patch Y))

One question though.
What is going to prevent someone from uploading random crappy setups? or someone else’s work?

This is what I made and I used it for both qualify and race.

I got down to 02:00.630 with very little practice during some races before the event at the F1rst server.

Quote from Chriskart :

Reversing the whole gread might seem a bit much, but never the less it really offered some excitement for the overall win..

You gotta be smart and wait for the right moments, looked like there were a few who got especially nicely rewarded for this

Yeah unless you are at the front and the one who is folowing has not so mutch patience

Anyway that wasn't the case with me, it was just a bad day for me.

I actually felt jealous because I knew that especially during the first race there were some really good battles, and Ι was far away from that cause of my stupid refuel pitstops:banghead:

Actually I don’t think reversed grid is a good idea in such a crowded race with not so even trained racers.
It’s realy easy to become a destruction derby because of the faster “back-markers” pushing the front, not leaving any room for mistakes.

Anyway I was in a bad day so it doesn’t matter that for me not having fun. I forgot to add the right fuel amount and then pitted 2 times,+ causing a drive through penalty during the second pitstop.
As for the second race, I lost my temper right from the beginning because of many bumps, so I disconnected to avoid causing trouble.

At least I was lucky enough to enjoy some racing at the official event’s server before the start.

I was just "/waiting"

Apart from the «hacked» account.

There is a problem in that replay too.
The first time I opened it, I saw OΟS error but I forgot to grab a screenshot…
Then I run the replay again and again… no error.
Then I restart LFS and I see the OSS error once more.
Don’t have a clue how is that possible but for some reason I don’t think it’s a game’s bug.

(misspelled error "oss" @ screenshot file name)

Last edited by kaynd, Tue, 22 Apr 2008 11:47.

Ok there is no traction whatsoever at the corner exit with open diff.
It is easy to make setups that are nice to drive but not competitive at all.
With the cplsd it's a bit better, and it could easily get more lock at the power side.
Generally the setup needs a bit more attention; there is no need for such overseer in the ARB settings. (even in real life there is no way you will find in a road sports car, the front ARB 12 times softer than the rear comparing the absolute stiffness value… let alone stiffness/mass)
Also the suspension travel is not enough for that spring stiffness and the front bottoms out while cornering, which is not that good for traction over bumps. If you want it that soft you need to make it higher.
After you reconfigure the suspension settings, take a look at camber values cause you need a bit more at the rear... Ass dragging in an FWD car is = lots of traction lost in both sides, unless you want it to go fast around hairpins or certain autocross layouts.

I personally can easily detect understeer through LFS’s feedback…
The wheel does become a bit lighter and for sure less informative while using excessive steering lock.
The only reason you will experience extreme feedback drop in a road car, is the condition of a road with low and uneven traction, and the ability of a normal road going car to steer more than 36degs, going far away of the optimal slip angle.
Don’t forget that still the tracks have constant grip and there is no rain or anything else that could affect grip levels and the effective slip angle of the tire so drastically.

It is really possible though that LFS’s slip angles are a too wide… already the tire load sensitivity is not working properly so maybe the whole model needs improvement.

Anyway LFS’s feedback works brilliant, even though it is limited by some inaccuracies that it is logical to exist (for now) in any racing simulator.

It’s just that some other developers try to exaggerate some effects to give the immersion of a real effect but it feels fake.
Unless you get used to that “turn off feedback while being in understeering mode” that most ISI sims produce and then anything else feels wrong…

It is logical that when the engine is hot, it’s hard to start with such high advance in low revs, for the reasons you have already mentioned. With already high temperature in the cylinders (after a spin that causes a stall), the combustion and the expansion of the gases happens much faster, comparing to a cold start.
So actually with that high advance you may not have problems in cold start, but in hot conditions it’s more likely that you have.
I think you are heading to the right direction by setting the advance lower at low rpms. Anyway you don’t need power down there.
Also richer air fuel mixture would help the combustion happen a bit later, hence the increased advance as you press the throttle.

Take a look to those older threads mister KiNG DoM
http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=33943
http://www.lfsforum.net/showth ... &highlight=arab+drift
and if you search the words Arab drift you can find many more threads.

I can’t be bothered to write my opinion again.
Victoor, and other Arab “drifters” in LFS have already reached a descent level at video editing but it’s still the content that does not please us. Sorry…

Maybe you should see some proper race driving and some proper car controll while drifting, to see what LFS is all about.
"View and learn!" oh yeah...

Last edited by kaynd, Sat, 19 Apr 2008 00:37.

As I see the grid is already full so I’d like to join the waiting list.
Unfortunately I didn't have time to check this out earlier :ouch:

kaynd , kaynd

Even though the above general principles about ARB stated by Tristan are correct, we have to mention some inaccuracies that the LFS TLS model introduces, making the ARB bars not to have so accurate effects on FWD cars handling.
If you make a search you will find many refers to that problem.
Here is one of my last explanations to that effect.
http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?p=769616#post769616

Well my only problem about iRacing is the price and still they don’t seem to be bothered about that factor.
I am really curious to see how this system is going to perform… and how long it will last.
It has to be something really groundbreaking new and well designed to last for long with that kind of pricing philosophy…

Or it is designed in that way so it can survive in a small market such us club racers that are interested in those very cars and tracks the game supports.

Quote from Ahriman4891 :

• The dude from iRacing really doesn't look like someone I'd like to work/do business with. Just not a likeable guy.

Now that's a usefull comment illepall

Quote from Glenn67 :

What the aim of the extreme high ARB whichever end it is on is to cause one wheel to lift on turn in (turning towards the appex under braking) thus causing oversteer when you would expect understeer.

It’s causing oversteed only when you apply throttle and that because of the high power locking factor of the diff.

The problem here is the tire physics that allow the outside tire hold such a high amount of pressure giving the appropriate grip so you don't need the inside tire at all...

I have tried many times to make a FWD setup with a proper amount of overseer in both springs and ARB.
In that situation both front wheels work together (still the ouside is way more loaded but there is sufficient load on the inside too) but the grip you have on corner exit is clearly lower than what you have when you fully load the front outside tire with a hard front ARB... despite the "understeer" you get at corner entry... (the grip generated buy the inside tire is not enough to replace the lost grip by the less loaded outside tire (cause of the softer front end) and that’s not the way it really is IRL…)

The tire model lacks attention on the load sensitivity curves and unfortunately this is greatly spotted on the fwd cars because simply by accelerating you unload the front wheels making that great force transfer that the front ARB causes to the front outside wheel really advantageous on the corner exit…

Nice race anyone in pool2.
Spesial thanks to FRH Shim for being a clean & fair driver. He could easily destroy me at that spot I overtook, but he kept the car in full control.
Also [ZION]Achim tried hard not to cause trouble despite his unfortunate accidents.