You can count me as new, even though I spent quite a bit of time around Blackwood a while back.

Now with a VR setup I tried out some contenders and the plucky ol LFS currently feels best to me over iRacing, PC2 and whatnot. I am stunned and bought a bigger license to try and compensate for those earlier hours spent

Quote from gu3st :

Depending on how your eyesight is, VR might still be fine without glasses for you. If you can see clearly up to about 2~ meters, then you shouldn't need glasses for VR. Personally I wear contacts for VR because it's just.. that much better.

From about 50cm onwards stuff already gets blurry... I’ve been looking at VR, some sites say they can be used with glasses, but it’ll probably also depend hugely on the type/style/size of glasses you wear. But it’s just way too expensive, even the ‘cheapest’ ones they have...

Quote from sermilan :

You don't have to go for a 1.000 EUR comp if you want it primarily for LFS, as it is now, I don't know what will be required when the upgrade comes (and it'll not come that quickly).

I've got:
Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-2600 CPU @ 3.40GHz, 3401 Mhz, 4 Core(s), 8 Logical Processor(s) (about 50 EUR)
GPU R9 270X (about 50 EUR)
8 GB RAM
SSD 240 GB (about 35 EUR), but for LFS you can use HDD easily

LFS runs flawlessly at 1920 X 1080

Most GPUs that are 10 years old now, have HDMI, so no worries about it.

So, if you are on a really tight budget at the moment and just want to play LFS, go for something like this and start saving money for when the upgrade comes.

The webshop I’m looking at buying from has a filter system where you can select on the typ of use you plan on using the pc for and they give you a ‘medium class’ and ‘high class’ systems, usually €1000 and up for high and €500 to €800 for medium. But the thing it they assume you’ll be playing high end games for the last year or so I probably shouldn’t be too worried about that and just focus on the ‘lower classed’ machines and maybe get a new gpu when the upgrade/update arrives, which can possibly be a couple years from now especially being familiar with the development speed of LFS. Not to ‘slam’ the devs for being slow, but knowing they want it to be perfect and not half baked just for the sake of giving the people a update.

Quote from lfsrm :

Budget ?

That’s a bit unknown at the moment, but from some of the research I’ve done, somewhere between €500 and €700 should get me something decent, but obviously I’d prefer to spend as little as possible

Quote from Sponge :

Thanks for the reply

DX11 support is definitely a feature to look for in a gpu, will keep that in mind.
I’m most likely not going to be using vr, it’s still waaayyy too expensive imo and as I wear glasses, a vr headset might not fit at all or be comfortable to wear over them.

Depending on how your eyesight is, VR might still be fine without glasses for you. If you can see clearly up to about 2~ meters, then you shouldn't need glasses for VR. Personally I wear contacts for VR because it's just.. that much better.

Thanks for the reply

DX11 support is definitely a feature to look for in a gpu, will keep that in mind.
I’m most likely not going to be using vr, it’s still waaayyy too expensive imo and as I wear glasses, a vr headset might not fit at all or be comfortable to wear over them.

Hello!

Welcome back to LFS!

Scawen said that the future big DX11 update for LFS will not be as demanding as it was now in terms of hardware. So if you play on screen, you can play with a mid-range PC that will not cost you much.

Just be aware of that you need a graphic card that can handle DX11 if you want to play LFS with the DX11. And from what i understand, the DX9 and DX10 graphic card will no longer be supported.

But if you are looking for play in VR, (with i recommand you as i'm concerned because it gives a wayyyy mooooree immersive experience with 3d mirrors and real time helmet moving i suggest you for minimum an Intel I5 or I7 with a minimum of 3ghz and an nvidia RTX 2070.

Hi to all,

i found this game on the oculus rift forum. I can only say awesome! It blew me away! I never had a better VR experience before. It feels like you are sitting in that fuxxx race car. It is hard to explain. This game is absolutely perfect for VR glasses.

Is this game still in development? I hope so! Is it possible to create mods for the game or add new cars and features for us developers?

Thanks

Last edited by luckejuin, Sun 26 Jul 2020, 15:56.

Quote from gu3st :

What does properly developed even mean?

It means actually developing the game rapidly, adding new features and content to it. Like it used to be it the first couple of years of development of the LFS. For the last decade (10 years it is) LFS had 1 new track, no new cars, and 1 new feature added - VR support. That's pretty much it. You call this development? I call it a joke.

Ped7g, you sound like one of these aggressive hobos on the streets who not just begging for the money, but demanding for it. Like we owe them, or something.

Quote from bishtop :

Needs to be remembered that whom are new to LFS and are potential license buyers are happy with current product as it's all new to them. Obviously people will be even more happier once the updates are released and while for us that use VR we can say that LFS had some major updates which started to bring LFS forward, everyone might not use VR but it certainly has brought more people to liveforspeed and for those that had already been here for a while it brought more joy to racing here.

Yep, i've tried all the mainstream simulators (Rfactor 2, Raceroom, assetto corsa ans so on...) and no one can match the Vr experience delivered by Live For Speed. The physics + Vr optimisation (stereoscopic mirrors and helmet) is a blast and i definitely can't go back to another sim since i discovered LFS (March 27th 2020, still remember that day

If you have direct drive wheel + motion system and buttkiker it's a very intense experience, very close to real life!

The only sims i continue to play time to time other than LFS is dirt rally 1&2 because it's rally...other than that, i definitely uninstall all the sims i used to play before...

Last edited by Pistolero 667, Mon 27 Apr 2020, 17:12.

Quote from manran :

Totally agree, i love LFS even the interface is unique and straightforward. Few developers is no longer an argument. You deliver or not, there are many sims in 2020, many choice available, they are all good. And if you say "we do what we want" so good luck. I see so many ironic statement all around the web about LFS "will never ship anything new". In my opinion the studio should work in some way to get more money and hire more team member. It's a vicious circle. No update means no interest from players means no money.LFS need to make a step forward to show that it's still in da game. Many time myself and many friend wanted to upgrade the game but there is an "abandonware" feeling in the air.It's hard to define where we are with this game. I know that the sim is still updated but too slow in my opinion. We see the update progress news so frequently but no release at all.

This game should have a beta program to allow players to try the new updates like dx11. With or without steam it's not an issue. Thus workshop items would be very useful...Many studio have released half baked game versions nowadays but it's not an issue for the user as long as the game has something in its core. It's better to deliver something incomplete vs being perfectionist and release nothing or take too long.

Needs to be remembered that whom are new to LFS and are potential license buyers are happy with current product as it's all new to them. Obviously people will be even more happier once the updates are released and while for us that use VR we can say that LFS had some major updates which started to bring LFS forward, everyone might not use VR but it certainly has brought more people to liveforspeed and for those that had already been here for a while it brought more joy to racing here.

Quote from Scawen :

... I hope to release the new tyre physics with the graphical update.

This is one of the best news I've heard this year!
In any case, when building a new system in the future, when choosing VR, I will proceed from how cool it (VR) works in LFS.
Health to you, Scawen.

nothing happened, it's like this since the start. The ideal refresh rate for VR headset would be 100Hz, and none of the headsets has that one. (they are IIRC 75Hz, 90Hz and 120Hz).

One year info is as good as fresh info, Scawen is currently working on huge graphics update moving to DX11 from DX9, adding dynamic shadows and night mode, so VR will stay "as is" for some year.

But he is aware of the issue and plans to resolve it in the future - either by creating extra layer doing interpolation between renderer and physics state, or by rewriting physics simulation at higher refresh rate like 1000Hz instead of 100Hz), but don't expect this any time soon, would take probably few months of work after the graphics update (which seems highly unlikely before this summer, and I wouldn't be totally surprised even by hitting 2021, but hopefully it will not reach 2022).

The praise for LFS VR implementation is probably coming from the fact, that you usually don't see that mild stutter as long as you look in the direction of your movement ("forward"), with drifting style you probably look "sideways" lot more than regular drivers.

Hi there, Im using a Rift S for LFS drifting. There's just this one big problem- as I look around while driving, it seems as though the game stutters. Very straining for the eyes and brain haha.

Ive tried researching, but it seems that all the info is at least a year old. It was also mentioned multiple times that the game's physics engine is just not compatible with the refresh rate of the VR headsets?

But there are hundreds of videos and experiences that show the compatibility of VR and LFS. What happened?

I'd love to use VR in LFS, but with the lack of display smoothness its almost impossible.

Quote from Dygear :

I only game on Linux now.

with VR? Because its still the main goal behind this. I question the level of support for this specialized hardware on Linux and if so, what the performance will be. Too much hassle to figure out, costs way too much time. Linux needs to adapt, not the other way around.

Test Patch U11 is now available with a minor improvement for VR and you can now control the strength of the Horizon Lock.


Changes from 0.6U9 to 0.6U11:

VR:
- Using latest update for OpenVR
- Improved timing of obtaining view each frame

Views:
- Horizon lock now has a strength slider option

Small improvement for ultrawide monitors:
- LFS now assumes 3 screens when aspect ratio is 4:1
- previously assumed 3 screens when aspect ratio was 3:1

Some more updated translations - thank you translators!


DOWNLOAD: https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/93185

Hello John,

I 'm agree! As a begginner, i have to learn with IA before multiplayer sessions but after a few laps with IA, i'm 2 sec faster than any Pro IA whatever car. Plus their racing line is always the same and sometimes IA is too agressive when overtaking and sometimes too slow.

It needs some adjustments.

Scawen works on it as he works on the the new tyre physics? He said IA will improve. Go to "Vr update U9 fix thread"

Quote from Vulgar :

I just wish that the average population would stop following the masses, grow a brain, learn to be an individual, go with the better option, rather than the current fad. Not the one that everyone is pushing, which is rarely the best. Most people are followers not leaders, yet they believe differently.

Hi Vulgar,

I totally agree on your overhall statement.

I must confess that i was one of the "masses". I was thinking that maintstream so called simulators rF2, Asseto Corsa, Raceroom) are the most realistic ones. Fatal error! I was thinking that rFactor 2 is the ultimate simulator. rF2 is still "the best of the others" but once i gave LFS demo a try ( March 27th 2020) and the very first time i tasted LFS in VR+ direct drive+ motion, i was litteraly and immediately blast away for hours. I discovered what is a simulator that pretend to be one. Thanks to LFS and his devs.

In terms of physics, natural feeling, inertia, grip, FFB and so on...no one can compete. Very Intense, and for me the closest to reality simracing experience yet.

Even rF2 is harder than LFS IMO, it's less realistic. Many people think a harder simulation is more realistic. I think it's absolutely not true. In real car (road car or racing car), you don't struggle as much as some simulators because you have this sense of grip, inertia and weight of the vehicule (precisely what gives LFS and the others don't) that gives you all the informations you need and you feel immediately connected to the car and his behaviour.

Since i tried LFS, i honestly can't go back to another sim. I really mess a lot of informations and feel i drive a soap and not a car (especially Asseto Corsa and Raceroom).

Plus i really don't understand how big companies with millions of dollars can't (or dont' want) even reproduce real 3D stereoscopic mirrors in VR and a very small team do it brilliantly!

LFS is very challenging too, a small error can be unforgivable. With LFS, you immediately understand why and from where a mistake is coming.

I still have a lot to learn as i'm a begginer. My only complain right now is that i'm too fast for the IA and too slow for multiplayer!! But it's another subject.

Long Live For Speed !!

Last edited by Pistolero 667, Fri 10 Apr 2020, 22:43.

Thank you for the VR test, Pistolero and Drifteris.

Quote from Pistolero 667 :

For exemple the weakest IA like it is right now and the strongest (120%) close to world record.

It's hard to make the AI faster because they are using the same physics and same grip, so it's difficult to give them the skill level of an experienced real driver.

But I have worked on them in the new tyre physics system and I think they are more challenging now. I need to work on the tyre physics after finishing some more graphical updates. I hope to release the new tyre physics with the graphical update.

Quote from Scawen :

It seems to be OK for me now with the new DLL, in old and new LFS.

Happy to keep get a smooth Vr with DX 11 update

As i'm new racer, i'm not ready with the multiplayer (the multiplayer racers are sometimes 5 sec faster than me!). So i'm using the IA to progress, it helps a lot! But very frustrating with the IA, because i'm rapidly 2 seconds faster than the fastest Pro IA since i learn the car and the track...

I know you are doing a lot and it could takes time, but is it possible to plan a IA strengh based on percentage and agressivity? For exemple the weakest IA like it is right now and the strongest (120%) close to world record. It could help a lot of new drivers to progress and enter progressively in the multiplayer sessions...

Again, this simulator grows like a good wine! Really the most realistic simracing vr experience!

Quote from Scawen :

If you have a few minutes at some point, please could you try the new DLLs 4 posts up?
https://www.lfs.net/forum/post/1954876#post1954876

I've tried the new dll.

Good news! It's much more smoother vr than the U610 !! To me, equal or maybe a little bit better than th U6.9 dll's. Constant 90 fps except a very few stutters in pit exit with 22 IA or on starting grid. Already have this ones with the U6.9.

Damn it's not compatible with the 0.6U9! So no LFSLazy with VR!!
Someone got it work with the 0.6.U9 ?

Thanks for the test. I've now removed the link to U10.

In my D3D11 version, I got good results in VR recently with the Rift but for some reason the OpenVR version does not work well. I'm looking into that. If I can fix it, I don't know if the results might help the Public version but I will check that.

I also use the last version of Steam VR (1.10.32).

In video menu, You have to go to video parameters per application (or video settings per application or whatever it calls, i'm using the french version). In there select LFS (only works when LFS is running) and then, say yes to "use ancient reprojection system"

Hope it helps

Hello Scawen.

First of all, i'm glad to join this LFS community. I just discover this simulator (1 week ago) and i'm very impressed by the physics. To me, by far superior than any mainstream simulators. Thanks a lot for that.

I previously build my rig on those maintream simulators, and never feel that realistic "grip" provided by LFS. LFS + VR, Direct drive wheel and motion is a blast!! Best simracing experience.

I also have VR, and i can confirm that i have more stutters with this update than the previous one. I returned back to 6U9.

A suggestion to valve index owners : use ancient reprojection system in steam VR may help : constant 90 fps except very few stutters in a beggining of a race (Steam VR 100%, LFS reprojection 225%, I 9 9900Ks, RTX 2080 Ti)

Keep going Scawen!

Thanks for the test. It's odd that a higher end computer can perform worse with LFS in VR. I can't come up with a sensible suggestion yet, but we can try another stab in the dark.

Attached to this post is a new LFSOpenVR.dll which works a bit differently.

How to use it:
- Rename the existing one in your LFS\dll folder
- Save this one there then start LFS

This DLL copies the render target submitted by LFS into an intermediate texture each frame before submitting it to the VR system. It's more like the way it works with the Rift. I don't really expect it to help but think it's worth a go.

You can use this DLL with the U9 or U10 patch. I guess U9 is a better choice as the thread-based submit probably does some good.

I don't understand this. Your PC specs are more than capable of running LFS in VR flawlessly... It could just be that the Index just asks too much. Have you tried it with other games on your PC? Edit: I noticed you said you tried it with AC and it worked fine in 80Hz mode... Hmm...

@Scawen: Just FYI, with worse specs than Drifteris (GTX 1070, Ryzen 5 1600X), I have used the Valve Index with LFS and it ran just fine with a decent number of cars. That wasn't on the current round of test patches though. Edit again: It might have been on the current round of test patches actually...

Last edited by mbutcher, Mon 6 Apr 2020, 12:06.