The online racing simulator
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Scawen
Developer
Or maybe that amazing 3D view of cities on Google maps where everything is a 3D model?

https://goo.gl/maps/nBo7zx4kE2s

Not possible but would be cool! Big grin
Scawen
Developer
Quote from avih :There could be other scenarios, like if the setup is on a read-only media. In general, I'd think it should be considered an LFS issue, as it's LFS itself which imports the file and expects the result to be writable (apparently) but doesn't take steps to ensure it.

Agreed:

Quote from Scawen :I think it can be fixed by writing my own version of CopyFile. It would read the file and save a fresh copy of it with default attributes, disregarding the source file attributes. Only trouble is I don't want to get back into test patches now so it could be a long wait.

Scawen
Developer
Well, as I said, it's a topic that creates strong feelings. Those who promote the "fixed to horizon" method can't seem to understand the way it is "wrong". I just want to give one example, you drive along a road and beside you is a 45 degree grass slope. You then drive your car along so that the car goes sideways up that slope (the left wheels are on the slope while your right wheels are on the road). Now stop your car. In the real world (in your office) you are sitting there and the wheel is in front of you. But the wheel in VR has moved around 45 degrees to the left. And your hands in the game are no longer in the same place where your real hands are. To many of us this would be a serious problem. We don't have the motion sickness problem and just want to be in the cockpit, the same way as you would be in a flight simulator. When a plane does a roll, you see the ground 'up' above and the sky 'down' below. This is the same method many (I believe most) people want it in a car simulator. But I do understand that other people are more susceptible to motion sickness so they want the view fixed to horizon even if it means they just have to live with the steering wheel in game moving around while the real one stays in the same place. What will never happen is that either of these groups of people will believe the other method is better. But what they can do is understand the reasons for different people wanting a different method.
Scawen
Developer
Locking camera to horizon is something I would like to try at some point, for people who have the motion sickness issue. But it is a very 'wrong' solution in a sense. It's the sort of thing which creates strongly opposing views. Locking the camera to the cockpit (as in LFS and, I'm sure, absolutely required for a flight simulator if you were doing loops and rolls) means your steering wheel and seat can be in the same place where you see it in VR. Locking to horizon means that your in-game steering wheel and seat will seem to move around while your desktop steering wheel and seat stays in the same place.
Scawen
Developer
Quote from Kova. :Guess it's related with the 0.6T, since it happened after i updated the game... But when the FPS or time are set to be shown on the left, nothing appear, but when it's set on the right, it's working. Any way to fix that?

I think you need to switch off the LFS logo. At the bottom of Options... Misc.

I think you have it set to be displayed, and that hides the FPS/Time but the logo is in turn hidden by the InSim buttons.
Scawen
Developer
Quote from Sobis :Though it is interesting that the problem was noticed only after the new patch!

In 0.6R I did have my own code in there that did the job. But I just came across that CopyFile Windows function one day and thought it would be good to use it. I guess for no real reason than to save a few lines of code.

Just for interest:

For comparison, here's the old function:

int copy_file(ccs src, ccs dst)
{
FILE *fin = fopen(src, read_bin);
if (fin==NULL) return 0;

fseek(fin, 0, SEEK_END);
int size = ftell(fin);

if (size==-1)
{
fclose(fin);
return 0;
}

fseek(fin, 0, SEEK_SET);

byte *mem = new byte[size];
fread(mem, 1, size, fin);
fclose(fin);

FILE *fout = fopen(dst, write_bin);
if (fout==NULL)
{
delete [] mem;
return 0;
}

fwrite(mem, 1, size, fout);
fclose(fout);
delete [] mem;
return 1;
}

And here's the new one which is very compact but causes that issue:

int copy_file(ccs src, ccs dst)
{
return CopyFile(src, dst, FALSE);
}

Scawen
Developer
OK - I've reproduced that too. When selecting "Open with Live for Speed" in Firefox's download dialog it is copied with read only attributes.

I wonder why that is. I suppose that temporary copy held by Firefox is read-only for some reason.

EDIT: I think it can be fixed by writing my own version of CopyFile. It would read the file and save a fresh copy of it with default attributes, disregarding the source file attributes. Only trouble is I don't want to get back into test patches now so it could be a long wait.
Last edited by Scawen, .
Scawen
Developer
OK, I don't know why they are converted to read-only when they are copied from your download location into data\setup by LFS.

It's not something LFS is doing, at least not deliberately. I'm on Windows 7 and that doesn't happen on my computer.

LFS is using the CopyFile function.
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/desktop/api/winbase/nf-winbase-copyfile

From the documentation:
File attributes for the existing file are copied to the new file. For example, if an existing file has the FILE_ATTRIBUTE_READONLY file attribute, a copy created through a call to CopyFile will also have the FILE_ATTRIBUTE_READONLY file attribute. For more information, see Retrieving and Changing File Attributes.


I don't see any reason why it would change the attributes. Uhmm
Scawen
Developer
Are they set to be read only files for some reason?
Scawen
Developer
Good to hear it was busy at the last event and that you have some more booked! Smile

Quote from SimulatorRental.com :The forum shows me as being the last to reply here, and I did reply to this, but my reply is not showing up.

That forum bug is fixed now and that original reply is now visible.
Scawen
Developer
That seems very unusual! I think it looks as if the unfinished image is being presented as a completed frame.

Somehow I feel it's a driver fault. I suppose we'll wait and see if anyone else gets this.

Random thought: Is it the same if vertical sync is enabled / disabled?
Scawen
Developer
I removed the img tags in your post as they forced every visitor to this page to download huge image files.

For some reason your attachment has disappeared in the process, which I did not intend. Maybe a forum bug?

Anyway, obviously we provide patches and updates with working shaders. If you use modified shaders maybe you should keep the originals backed up so if there is a change you can install a working set until your custom shader developer updates his or her shaders.

We are going to update the shaders sometimes, it's part of the development process.
Scawen
Developer
Of course not. There is no way on earth we would drop the far improved editor to go back to the old fatally flawed one. Please try to understand how to use the updated editor. It does everything the old one did and quite a lot more.

Reasons, explanations: https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/92152-The-layout-editor-changes
Scawen
Developer
I suppose so but just to be clear this was done more than 10 years ago, it's nothing new, so I'm not regarding it as a priority for now.
Scawen
Developer
That's the result of the special code which reduces the pit-out glitch. It deliberately avoids loading the textures of the car of a player who joins while you are driving, because doing so can cause a glitch. Then when you stop your car or the race restarts, those textures are loaded.
Scawen
Developer
Wizard, I have one idea for you to try. I wonder if your computer could be slowed down when people join by massively full skins_x or skins_y folders. Then Windows could take a seemingly long time (fraction of a second) to search the list of files.

So a possible solution to try is to temporarily rename those folders to something else (before you start LFS). Then LFS will create an empty folder when you start it and Windows won't be searching through hundreds of files to see if a skin is available each time someone joins. Of course, this is quite irrelevant if there aren't many files in those folders.
Scawen
Developer
I don't actually think VOB mods affect other people, because the mod is only on their computer, not yours. On your computer you just see the unmodified car - loading happens in the same way as usual. So if the mod is constructed in such a way that is has the same physics bounding box, then it passes the OOS check and all is well and collisions take place as normal.

We don't support such mods in any way. They are only 'wrong' in the sense that all cars of that type look different on the modded computer. But I don't believe they are harming other players.
Scawen
Developer
Quote from x25xe :how the indicator will close?

https://www.imagevisit.com/images/2018/07/08/Adsiza38af4ebb6ee9416.png

Quote from Yukesekai :Updated to 0.6T. Someone above already asked this but it was not answered properly. How to remove the lfs.net logo/watermark from the top left of the screen while in game?

Before the update it wasn't there. I had my FPS showing on that side but now I can only set my FPS to be shown on the top right.

This can be switched off in Options - Misc.

This option is only available for licensed users.

The idea of the demo is to try out Live for Speed, and if you like it we hope you'll buy a license which we think is great value as you get all future updates with no extra charge. If people buy a license then we can buy food, clothes, pay our taxes and so on, to allow us to continue developing LFS. We think it is a good idea to show demo racers the website address to remind them in case they forget! Smile
Scawen
Developer
Quote from Scawen :I'll look at that crash address later and see if I can get any info from it. Thanks.

Quote from 3T- :Thank you Tongue

I've narrowed this down quite a lot.

As far as I can see this can only be when:

1) You are driving.
2) A certain car joins and you haven't seen that car since joining the server.

Then it uses the "use blank textures to reduce pit-out glitch" code and that is the only time the function where the crash occurred is ever called.

To cause the crash in that case:

3) The car that joined has a texture without a name.
4) The material being created is of a type that we haven't used in any of our car models.

I've loaded the 20 LFS cars to check and in theory this situation cannot come up. So that makes me wonder if you have installed one of those 'safe' VOB mods that is purely visual and doesn't create any advantage or out-of-sync in multiplayer.

Obviously I don't hold it against you for using such a mod - it's not cheating in any way, but it would be great if you could confirm if you do have any VOB mods in your data\veh folder. In that case it would explain why most people aren't getting the crash and if you replace the official .vob files problem would then go away.
Scawen
Developer
I'll look at that crash address later and see if I can get any info from it. Thanks.
Scawen
Developer
Quote from Litro :Yesterday I updated my LFS, but when i went trough all startup options, when i clicked on last `Go` button, it freezed on that screen. There were 2 LFS on that computer, so the same happened with other version of lfs also. I had to `end process` in task manager.
Somehow AVG antivirus also deleted lfs.exe for LFS, so i cant run it anymore Big grin

I can't deal with faulty anti virus software, of course. I don't know what could have gone wrong when you clicked Go. Do you get better results if you install a fresh version?

Quote from 3T- :Hi Scawen, im getting the following error after about 20 minutes of play,

Fault bucket 2243263143867943033, type 1
Event Name: APPCRASH
Response: Not available
Cab Id: 0

...

Thanks for the info. Just at the moment you are the only one to report a crash and we didn't get one in any of the recent test patches (other than one in early test patches that happened at startup and I believe we found the cause and fixed it). So I'm wondering if your computer could possibly be overheating as it is so hot. It could cause the CPU or memory to do something funny, so maybe you could open it and check for dust?

Quote from Flotch :indeed, same here, did not receive an email this time.

We haven't sent one. I'm not sure if we will or not, actually haven't discussed it with Victor yet.
Scawen
Developer
Quote from Jonzu95 :Am I the only one who finds the Layout editor extremely difficult to use? I've noticed few things when trying to build one.

...

Might take a while to get used to all this, I just prefer the old layout editor.

I have to say there are few positive things about it as well, For example:
- When holding ctrl you can choose objects just like shortcuts on your desktop
- Undo & Redo
- Marshall circles can be now 0 meters.

I think mainly it is a case of getting used to it. I did include input from experienced editor users. It can do everything you could do and more, but with some confusion removed. Occasionally there is an extra key press though.

In the test patch forum I wrote an explanation including the reasons for some of the changes:
https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/92152-The-layout-editor-changes
Scawen
Developer
We don't have any predictions for other things. The graphical updates are really important and I still have some more work to do on them. Eric still has some tracks to update. Depending on the timing, maybe I can get the tyre physics updated to a good state in time for the graphical update, although it is possible to release the new graphics with the old tyre physics. The long awaited tyre physics update is also really important because we'll be able to move into the future and consider car updates and so on. We'll see how the timing works out.
New Version 0.6T - More robust multiplayer system
Scawen
Developer
Hello LFS Racers,

Today we have released a new update. After some disruptive attacks that took place recently we were forced to make our website and multiplayer systems more robust. As an update was needed, we took the opportunity to do a few more improvements, including some extensive changes to the layout editor.

Over the last year and more we have been working on some major graphical improvements in Live for Speed. These are not included in this update. We plan to show some pictures of the improvements later this month.
EDIT: We now plan to show pictures in August as you can read in a later post.

Read all about this update and how to install it on the 0.6T information page.

- LFS Developers
Last edited by Scawen, .
Scawen
Developer
New version 0.6T is now available!

Thank you for all your help testing! Smile

https://www.lfs.net/patch-6t
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG