This thread cracks me up 
people just keep posting their views without even reading the responses properly and taking a moment to consider another point of view 
a forum is for discusion and that implies at least stopping a moment to listen and understand what others are saying 
people just keep posting their views without even reading the responses properly and taking a moment to consider another point of view a forum is for discusion and that implies at least stopping a moment to listen and understand what others are saying I could contend, it would be more game like if it was totally even, because that is then simulating an "ideal" racing environment... this rarely exists in real life
. F1 is the extreme example where the race is won, more often than not off the track, in the teams ongoing development of the car.
Even in classes of race cars where they endevour to maintain an even field it is very rarely even, the V8 Supercars here in Australia is suposed to be even, but the top teams are always trying to get one up on each other (within the rules) and one team is envariably stronger than another for periods of time, until the next breakthrough or rule change
So the fact that there are things there to "exploit", as you say, and the top drivers/teams endevour to find them before others, makes it more closely approximate real life racing than if the field is kept totally even
I am not saying I agree with bug exploits or not, I'm just making a point. I personally would like to see some leagues where the rules are quite specific, and others that are more open (as they mostly are now), gives more variety which only makes it more interesting...
There has been improvement suggestions that would aid this and hopefully we might see some of them implemented at some stage... (i.e. setup restrictions, ballast, server info screens for house rules, etc...)
But in the mean time there is nothing stopping us from setting up servers or races where we all use a type of set (i.e. no locked diff or hybrid tyres on GTi
) and as a condition of racing there, you must pass your set to the moderator to check it is within spec... this would require a moderated server though and there lies the problem. Also there's nothing stopping people lobbying league organisers to have setup restrictions (just be a pain to organise
and enforce) or setting up your own...Finaly, while you wait for a new patch to fix the glaring bugs that a being exploited, there will be others that are eagerly awaiting a new patch because it will invariably have "new" things to find and exploit.
In my opinion it's not about having a perfect environment, but better managing the environemet you have... which is why I believe some extra features that will enable better management should also be a priority.
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Time is a very relative thing
ask an 80 year old if 8 months is a long time for me 8 months is like 2 months when I was 18 or like 3 weeks when I was 12 
Yeah thats fine for real life, but every time you change gear ratio's the RPM references you may have go out the window, and also in the absence of a true sence of speed, the speedo is the only way to go imo
Infact it frustrates me that the virtual speedo or Rev counter for those that like that, is stuck down in the bottom corner of the screen... I'd like it to be custonizable in size and positioning
And Nick if thats all that was in the patch it's fine by me
but I predict it will be abit sooner in that case 
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Good to see people going nuts over LFS
I don't see a problem with bumping a thread each time you put up the sever for a week or so, but it would be better kept to the events section, and don't make lots of threads Alot of us used to have alot of fun with the slick mod in S1 days in the GTi, and I agree it can be good for something different, infact back then I used to find I'd do faster times when going back to normal mode after using the slick mod
the mod just gave you a different perspective, because often you just end up getting in a rut and don't see any significant improvement for awhile so it is good to have a change every now and again Another trick I learnt in the early days which works quite well, is if your doing consistent laps (can hit within a tenth or two of your pb most laps) but are stuck at a level and don't seem to be improving... try "over driving" for about ten to twenty laps i.e. brake latter and carry more speed into the corners than you normally do. After ten laps you may find that on some corners its possible to do abit better than what you previously thought
just don't do it in a race (this tip is really for those that have already got good lines but are stuggling to improve there times beyond 1-3 sec of the WR times, it want help those with poor lines much )I'll jump in with a few team mates some time, just got to get my internet connection sorted in the next few days though
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If you could go faster what would it mean anyway, 5 less minutes maybe so what, thats bugger all
I live 65km from my work place and the difference of driving 5-10 km/hr below the posted speed limit all the way and 5 - 10 km/hr above the limit is a sum total of about 6 or 7 minutes illepall if I drive upto 30 km/hr over the speed limit then i could maybe get there 10 - 15 min earlier but really why do it? It cracks me up that almost everyone I see speeding to get somewhere is only going 5km or so down the road, so the sum total of time they save by driving recklessly is what? 30 sec or maybe a minute I think most of us would be lying if we said we have never gone over the speed limit, and some of us including myself have done some very stupid and dangerous things in our time... but I have lived through it and now am far more sensible and self restained.
Unfortunately I have seen some friends and have heard of many others that were not so lucky! So my strong views aren't unfounded they are based on harsh reality, believing that you are a good driver can get you killed and as several have said already the reality is, is that your most likley are no where as near as good a driver as you think you are and even if you are, driving close to the limit gives you no room for error and a public road has no room for error, so the result is death or serious injury to your self and innocent bystanders... its only a matter of time and the more you race or drive recklessly on public roads the more likely you are to become another statistic.
I've lived in some country towns where 50% of the young men have been killed in cars going fast believing they were good. Hey they could drift around a bend at 180km/hr so they must have been awsome! but they are now dead! Just because you can do some awsome driving doesn't mean you will never come unstack, it's far better to have that experience in a race car on a race track than on a street corner or bend in the road with trees on the outside. Take a look at road races in the early years before safty became an issue, many drivers died and many bystanders died also. If profeesional race drivers frequently become unstack, what makes you think you can race on the streets and never have an incident? It's only a matter of time.
I personaly love speed, fast cars and the rush of racing, wouldn't be here otherwise, but I know its place... dang! I was going to make a post that lightened the atmosphere a little, cause I thought there was too much flaming going on I guess I just can't bring myself to do it, because it is such a prevailing attitude amoung the young now and it scares me what type of horsepower and cars young people are getting now days, and I know that until you have a serious accident your unlikely to realise how fragile life really is and think it will never happen to you!
Unfortunately I have seen some friends and have heard of many others that were not so lucky! So my strong views aren't unfounded they are based on harsh reality, believing that you are a good driver can get you killed
and as several have said already the reality is, is that your most likley are no where as near as good a driver as you think you are and even if you are, driving close to the limit gives you no room for error and a public road has no room for error, so the result is death or serious injury to your self and innocent bystanders... its only a matter of time and the more you race or drive recklessly on public roads the more likely you are to become another statistic. I've lived in some country towns where 50% of the young men have been killed in cars going fast believing they were good. Hey they could drift around a bend at 180km/hr so they must have been awsome! but they are now dead! Just because you can do some awsome driving doesn't mean you will never come unstack, it's far better to have that experience in a race car on a race track than on a street corner or bend in the road with trees on the outside. Take a look at road races in the early years before safty became an issue, many drivers died and many bystanders died also. If profeesional race drivers frequently become unstack, what makes you think you can race on the streets and never have an incident? It's only a matter of time.
I personaly love speed, fast cars and the rush of racing, wouldn't be here otherwise, but I know its place... dang! I was going to make a post that lightened the atmosphere a little, cause I thought there was too much flaming going on
I guess I just can't bring myself to do it, because it is such a prevailing attitude amoung the young now and it scares me what type of horsepower and cars young people are getting now days, and I know that until you have a serious accident your unlikely to realise how fragile life really is and think it will never happen to you!It's not just your skill you have to think about 
if you race others you are responsible for their actions too and even if you never crash it could be the other guy your racing that takes out the bus shelter and slams into the power pole killing himself instantly... (happened here just this week)
Ok so your a better driver than most of the looses on the street, if you know that why do you have to prove it?
if you race others you are responsible for their actions too and even if you never crash it could be the other guy your racing that takes out the bus shelter and slams into the power pole killing himself instantly... (happened here just this week)Ok so your a better driver than most of the looses on the street, if you know that why do you have to prove it?
I have 0 demerit points and can't remember the last time I was pulled over
Your goals on a public road should be rather different to those on a track
I.e. on public roads it should be to stay as far within the limits of the car as resonably possible to allow for emergency or unexpected cercumstances, in racing it is to be as close as you can to the limit at all times while still remaining in control of the car and allowing for safty of your fellow racers (which still doesn't indicate reckless abandon)illepall
But having said that many of the skills you learn in racing aid in driving safely i.e. thresshold breaking, self control, reflexes, car control in emergency situations, etc...
But hey I'm 39 and I'm over my hoon phase in life had you asked me the same question when I was 20 the answer would be a little different
Also note that road cars have rather inferiour safty features compared to a race car, not to mention public roads aren't known for there gravel traps and safty barriers
Your goals on a public road should be rather different to those on a track
I.e. on public roads it should be to stay as far within the limits of the car as resonably possible to allow for emergency or unexpected cercumstances, in racing it is to be as close as you can to the limit at all times while still remaining in control of the car and allowing for safty of your fellow racers (which still doesn't indicate reckless abandon)
illepall But having said that many of the skills you learn in racing aid in driving safely
i.e. thresshold breaking, self control, reflexes, car control in emergency situations, etc...But hey I'm 39 and I'm over my hoon phase in life
had you asked me the same question when I was 20 the answer would be a little different Also note that road cars have rather inferiour safty features compared to a race car, not to mention public roads aren't known for there gravel traps and safty barriers
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I have no problem whatsoever with an Xbox controller and I remove all the dead spots (and can't imagine it much different to a PS2 type controller ) I have played with wheel turn compensation and analog steer smooth alot and that helps some, but the thing that helps me most with a gamepad is to reduce the max steering lock in each setup to between 12-16 deg , for those that are over turning (i.e. turning the wheel too much) in corners even lower it more on blackwood in the gti I was using 9 deg max steering lock for a long time quite sucessfully
So as a starting point put wheel turn on 180, wheel turn compensation on 60, analog steer smooth to 50 and max steering lock to 12 and then tweak to taste...
As for dead spots, if you can possibly do with out them, its much better as it increases your prescion which is critical in a sim
I think most people feel a gamepad is too sensitive only because its hard to judge how much lock your applying, and therefore tend to overturn all the time, which is then no better than keyboard control 
(and can't imagine it much different to a PS2 type controller ) I have played with wheel turn compensation and analog steer smooth alot and that helps some, but the thing that helps me most with a gamepad is to reduce the max steering lock in each setup to between 12-16 deg , for those that are over turning (i.e. turning the wheel too much) in corners even lower it more on blackwood in the gti I was using 9 deg max steering lock for a long time quite sucessfully So as a starting point put wheel turn on 180, wheel turn compensation on 60, analog steer smooth to 50 and max steering lock to 12 and then tweak to taste...
As for dead spots, if you can possibly do with out them, its much better as it increases your prescion which is critical in a sim
I think most people feel a gamepad is too sensitive only because its hard to judge how much lock your applying, and therefore tend to overturn all the time, which is then no better than keyboard control Welcome
Alot of aussie teams, leagues and just general racing sim forums as well as LFS specific forums can be found here
http://arse.norbtech.com/phpBB/
It's just the angle of the sun if you look at some small trees nearby they also have similar shadows so my guess is, it's a hot day and that's a Mr Whippy van selling icecream
if you look at some small trees nearby they also have similar shadows so my guess is, it's a hot day and that's a Mr Whippy van selling icecream That really sucks m8
Agreed onboard graphics are normaly cheap and nasty and shared memory really sucks ... wgooden asked what I thought about a system today also, it had onboard graphics immediately I said to him look for another one without onboard graphics illepall
If you can, take it back! and either get one without onboard graphics or get a refund Alternatively if you can't do either of the above disable the onboard graphics and put in a nvidia 6600GT or better (hopefuly the PC has an AGP or PCI-E slot or you really did get a lemon)
And in future ask before you buy or atleast take LFS on a CD and tell them you want to see it running before you buy
P.s. the fps you listed for the new machine, was it with the 9250 card or the onboard graphics? And did the 9250 card improve it over the onboard? Also what was the 9250 card connector type (PCI, AGP or PCI-E) if PCI it wouldn't be much different to the onboard...
Agreed onboard graphics are normaly cheap and nasty and shared memory really sucks
... wgooden asked what I thought about a system today also, it had onboard graphics immediately I said to him look for another one without onboard graphics illepall If you can, take it back! and either get one without onboard graphics or get a refund
Alternatively if you can't do either of the above disable the onboard graphics and put in a nvidia 6600GT or better (hopefuly the PC has an AGP or PCI-E slot or you really did get a lemon) And in future ask before you buy
or atleast take LFS on a CD and tell them you want to see it running before you buy P.s. the fps you listed for the new machine, was it with the 9250 card or the onboard graphics? And did the 9250 card improve it over the onboard? Also what was the 9250 card connector type (PCI, AGP or PCI-E) if PCI it wouldn't be much different to the onboard...
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The problem here I think is that you do that sort of thing with guys you know well, not with people you don't What alot don't realise is that here down under most racers, even the best, fool around alot more than most other places it's not that Aussies don't take racing serious, they are very competitive and serious in an out and out race. But they also enjoy fooling around alot If you join a few Aussie servers you will see this very quickely but one thing you will also see is that everyone respects each other as well
What alot don't realise is that here down under most racers, even the best, fool around alot more than most other places it's not that Aussies don't take racing serious, they are very competitive and serious in an out and out race. But they also enjoy fooling around alot If you join a few Aussie servers you will see this very quickely but one thing you will also see is that everyone respects each other as well 
I can see it now you log onto multiplayer and drive to the nearest track for a race but no ones there they are all to busy driving around the virtual world taking there wifes on sunday drives In this virtual world will you of course have to stop for fuel
which means you need to pay for it so will we have virtual jobs too oh silly me we will be paid for racing so we will have to win races to drive around in the virtual world, finally something for the 20k credits or more that most of us have Instead of wreckers at turn one though we will see hoons and street races endangering the innocent sim driver lives
Will there be virtual Cops as well?Well I agree it shouldn't be possible, as to why someone would do it
think enduro, you have a 3-4 sec lead over the next guy on the last 10 laps but he is catching you a quick check of his tyre condition can tell you if you need to be too worried or not and enable you to decide to start pushing harder, or keep your tyres in good nick for a few more laps and just drive consistently fast I would agree with getting rid of information you normally don't have in a race. I've heard of a driver for example that on a straight uses tab and shift tab with F9 to check out his oponents tyre condition
While your suggestion would make the cockpit view look "real", there is just no way that it will be realistic
limitations of technology For a start we have a relitively small rectangle (monitor) which is our view of the virtual world, this is extremly limited to what we would have in RL even with a helmet on, so there is limited screen realestate which means the images of the LCD display would be smaller than RL so harder to read with a quick glance, etc...
I personally don't think it's the aim of a sim to recreate exact replication of everything, but rather create a virtual world where the same skills that would enable you to win in real life also apply to winning in the sim
but thats just my opinion. I'm not against the idea of imersion into a sim, but just feel that is better acomplished by other means other than acurately rendered cockpit detail. What I would love to do one day is build a sim racing cockpit with real working dials and a and a large screen or monitor with forenzal lens
I've read a thread about a guy attempting to get real dials working through an outsim program at the moment Oh one other thought I'd like your idea if we could say put the dash and LCD screen in its own window so we could then place it on another monitor (like MS Flight Sim but Scawen has already said thats too dificult) but I don't like it for the same window (monitor) as the main screen, thats just me though and like Vain said if they did implement your idea it wouldn't worry me as long as they had options as the do now for different views
And the reason I like the HUD even more configurable by the user is because in a sim we have to rely on some things more than real life because of the lack of sensory input. Biggest one for me is sense of speed, in a real car I can judge it to 3-5 km especially on corners I know well, in the game I need to look at the speedo as I can't judge it anywhere near as accurately as real life. The other "help" I rely on much more in the sim than real life is skid sound volume, this again is because of the lack of seat of pants feel. You can say this is unrealistic, but I say it makes up for the shortcommings of the technology we currently have
true enough I think Tweaks avtar is enough of a clue I could be wrong
but isn't that just two 7800's in SLI configuration on one card? If so I don't think it will do what we want it too...:iagree: I think the same as Vain on this one, even would like to see the HUD even more configurable by the user
Yeah jtw62074 I also trust in Scawen's ablility and believe he will refine the tyre models greatly and I 100% agree about the best multiplay part
From your past posts it's obvious you have done a great deal of research yourself into this topic and know alot about it, so it's good to hear of your continued support of the LFS developemnt process, considering also you are developing your own sim
Would also love too see how you little project develops in the future too, I looked at several of the videos you posted there, it's obvious you put alot of work in already and does look promising
I'd like to see a vid with the same setup as 13a but with grip levels similar too wet weather or maybe even ice, just for curiosity sake
http://www.performancesimulations.com/files/toofast.jpg
and I 100% agree about the best multiplay part From your past posts it's obvious you have done a great deal of research yourself into this topic and know alot about it, so it's good to hear of your continued support of the LFS developemnt process, considering also you are developing your own sim
Would also love too see how you little project develops in the future too, I looked at several of the videos you posted there, it's obvious you put alot of work in already and does look promising
I'd like to see a vid with the same setup as 13a but with grip levels similar too wet weather or maybe even ice, just for curiosity sake
http://www.performancesimulations.com/files/toofast.jpg
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That does sound very low, but some people do earn very little compared to western countries I lived and worked in a third world country for several years so know this first hand where I was there were people earning about A$50 a week which the average person earns in a few hours here in Aus and that country was better off than most otthers around it... even Uni grads there only earn about A$600 per month.
Alot of us take for granted what we have and really have no idea whatsoever how a very large portion of the world actually lives, so I for one empathise with you Dupson
Also I like your idea, as demo for LFS is abit different to other games, as even alot of S2 Lic drivers return to the demo mode looking for some races when the S2 servers are a bit sparse
I lived and worked in a third world country for several years so know this first hand where I was there were people earning about A$50 a week which the average person earns in a few hours here in Aus and that country was better off than most otthers around it... even Uni grads there only earn about A$600 per month.Alot of us take for granted what we have and really have no idea whatsoever how a very large portion of the world actually lives, so I for one empathise with you Dupson
Also I like your idea, as demo for LFS is abit different to other games, as even alot of S2 Lic drivers return to the demo mode looking for some races when the S2 servers are a bit sparse
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I vote that as server admin you can change the message they see when trying to connect
then you could put "your no longer welcome here, have a nice day" if you wanted to be polite or you could put "FFS you moron, grow up! don't remain a wanker all your life... oh btw you've been banned for 999 days!" for a stronger message FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG