Quote from amp88 :

I thought Surrogates was really bad. It's the same old clichéd story of "too much tecnhology is bad" meets "loose cannon cop with a dead child" meets "revolutionary genius". I, Robot did it much better, IMO. At least with Will Smith there wasn't any terrible Bruce Willis acting.

Should have mentioned that Surrogates was a download (naughty ) so I didn't pay to see it which might have changed my view on it a little. Yep, I, Robot was much better.


Rest were on the big screen though.

For a change I have seen a load of films and all have been good

Avatar 3d - wow, just wow

Sherlock Holmes - Great story and takes Sherlock back to the original concept

Zombieland - hahahahahaha f**king great. Good Bill Murrey cameo Rule #2 - double tap

Surrogates - Not best film but good story

District 9 - Not what you expect. Good dark story


All worth a watch but Zombieland is a must. Up there with Shawn of the Dead in Zombie movies

Last edited by Woz, Wed 30 Dec 2009, 10:37.

I got S.T.A.L.K.E.R Clear Sky. Good fun so far. Hard to go wrong for $5US

Quote from BlueFlame :

No, it's not like that at all, if LFS made a completely parallel game with 1 extra car and track and claimed it to be completely different game and charged money for it. Then it would be the same as Left for dead and L4D2

lol. You logic is flawed.

LFS S2 costs another 12 over S1 yet in S1 you still get all the physics updates etc so S2 is just some cars and tracks. New S3 is starting and it is just more cars and tracks because S1 and S2 will get all the other updates that S3 gets.

You are just Pi**ed because you have to buy L4D2 and you think it costs too much. Get over it.

L4D2 has a very different feel to it. There is loads of extra weapons. New special. New uncommon common infected new far bigger levels. extra stuff the AI director can control than in 1 such as weather in Hard Rain campaign, the storm is amazing to play through when it reall picks up. Melee weapons. New game mode types. The gfx in 2 are far more demanding on hardware than 1 also with more gore etc.

L4D2 is a far better with more depth. Carry on bitching though while we all enjoy L4D2

Quote from Bob Smith :

I think we should just mince up 100 million spammers per year as meaty compost for trees. Should balance it all out nicely.

rotflmao nice

Quote from Crommi :

This just looks like one of those threads from a clueless citykid who has no idea what they're talking about. Trees are renewable resource and forests get planted over and over again to produce wood over a long period of time. Granted, that doesn't always happen in countries where it's probably cheaper to buy more land to harvest than keep using what recycle the old land. But it's the same old problem with you have with industry in 3rd world countries due to lack of regulations and control.

Citykid is not a word I would use to describe myself lol

I live over 50Km from my nearest Town in the sparsly populated Canterbury Plains. I help in the slaughter and processing of my own lamb-mowers when the grass runs out in the paddocks and they moved on to their new homes in the freezer. Like many in NZ I use re-newable wood for heating instead of the coal/gas powered heating (You do realise your electric heating is probably coal/gas powered don't you). I can fell trees and hand split them with an axe and have hand split well over 20m3 of wood this year. I have not lived in towns for many many years and would only do so being dragged kicking and screaming.

If you read what has been said you will see that you are not the first person to raise renewable forests and I have said many times this is not the issue. What is the issue is all the resources wasted in processing and then moving the trees in their journey to the landfill sites unopened for less than a 1% response rate. Unlike the trees cut all the different fuels and resources used transforming said renewable trees into junk mail are not renewable

I also understand the junk mail industry from the inside as I know people that used to spend $millions for clients on such mailing. So I know what it costs them, how they collect their mailing lists, the responses they expect and what it takes to turn a mailing from profit into a disaster for them.

For example if you are not careful with the opt-in/opt-out checkbox on forms you fill in you actually give companies to share your details with other companies. In other words they can (and do to help pay for their mailing) sell your details to anyone that wants them. Result is more junk mail in your letter box.

In the end if you don't like junk mail don't just ignore it but post back the envelopes. The more that do the more it harms them and once enough people learn this simple truth the less junk you will get. The only thing that makes companies act is profit!

I am bored of people that want to start a fight so if you have an interest fine if not just leave the thread alone for those that might actually be fed up enough with junk mail to take simple steps that cost you nothing. Lets face it no government will do anything.

Hope that helps clear things up for you.

Have a good new year

Last edited by Woz, Wed 30 Dec 2009, 06:21.

Quote from BlueFlame :

The point was that the people behind this article/subject don't even know the correct numbers. I guess the average human only sees a fraction of junk mail but it annoys me, 100million trees are not cut for junk mail, they are cut for paper. Putting junk mail businesses out of business isn't going to stop the same trees in the same quantity getting cut.

Guess we agree to disagree on the impact as I believe it would reduce the paper created. Supply and demand at work

As for junk mail. If you don't like it you know how to cost them money so use the knowledge if you want, if not don't.



Thats me done for this year. happy new year

Quote from BlueFlame :

I searched high and low for stats of house figures. They say on average 4 people share a house together. Population divided by 4 is 1.5-2billion

You have under estimated how much paper 1 tree makes and it is a hard figure to quantify as it depends on paper quantity and quality. You figure over estimate the trees cut by a huge amount.

But as you say we waste paper in many other ways. I know I do what I can to minimise my waste in life in general so I am happy with how I live and the resources I take.

A no junk mail sticker is normally free from you local council and will save you getting all the advert flyers. Direct mail is my key beef as I know how the industry works internally and what they think of as acceptable practice.

If you believe its a pointless waste of resources then posting back pre-paid envelopes does your bit and costs them cash and lowers profit. Profit is what drives junk mail pure and simple.

Doing something about it when it comes to junk mail costs you nothing and takes little of your time. So do as you see fit

Quote from flymike91 :

getting rid of junkmail would be nice. Facebook dreamland won't do it tho. Facebook has created large groups of environmentalists erm, people who think problems can be solved by clicking a button on their computer screens. It is the same reason our governments are taking control away from the people because most are too lazy to actually do anything about...anything!

As said above it costs you nothing to hurt them so do as you see fit. Don't care what others do, it is what you do

Last edited by Woz, Fri 25 Dec 2009, 09:17.

Quote from CSU1 :

...

Sigh.

You should ask you council how much junk mail ends up in the landfill. Might change your mind. If not there is nothing else for you to see here.

Nothing that will be said will mean anything to you and I know you will not look up any of this online so move on. Leave people who care about pointless waste to care.

I assume you also think the climate talks went well?

Can't be arsed to argue with you tbh. Your mind is set and you do not care so go back to your own little world

Quote from BlueFlame :

..

Out of interest... Do you agree that junk mail is a pointless waste of resources?

Last edited by Woz, Fri 25 Dec 2009, 08:40.

Quote from CSU1 :

WTF are you talking about?

Trees are renewable and have a turn around of months?

Who in their right mind throws paper in the landfill?

Paper get's RECYCLED

recycling does consume some resources but it creates JOBS

YOU FAIL

Rotf again you just failed to read didn't you.

Where have I said that trees are no renuable. I have not once and I have already stated there are managed forests. What is you point.

Read the following again slowly.

Fuel is required to.

- Cut the trees.
- Transport the logs to paper mills.
- Transport paper to printing.
- Transport printed products to assembly areas.
- Transport mailing packs to post office.
- Transport post through the postal system.
- Finally transport to the dump.

Estimates put that as the same as an extra 9 million cars on the road burning fuel!

Also electricity is required in almost EVERY stage of the process which is coal and gas powered mostly. And still that does not include all the power and resources required to create all the inks, track all the post etc etc. The NON RENEWABLE resources are bit.

So how does a managed forest help with the oil, coal and gas used then?

Again all for less than 1% response rate. Can you not see what a waste that is or are you just that small minded?

Cant wait as this will be so funny

Last edited by Woz, Thu 24 Dec 2009, 20:15.

Quote from CSU1 :

..bunch of raving crackheads the lot of you.

Any paper used is replaced by plantations.

If industries fail to plant what they've taken the Gov. comes down on them with fines for loss in ability to sell their carbon credits back into the market.

Trees are as good as money today more than ever, so if anything junk mail could actually help stop global warming through demand for new trees.

lol. Another person that didn't read my orignal post

I KNOW there are managed forests. You are correct. Well done. You are so smart yet SO DUMB!

What about the RESOURCES required to get from tree to landfill site.

I guess the managed oil fields replace all the oil burnt transporting all that crap around. And the managed coal mines replace the coal burnt to generate the power. You have so many things that have to happen between tree and landfill it is not funny.

How do we replace all that then?

Again <1% response rate is expected on junk mail!

Quote from CSU1 :

Maybe if the South Americans stopped trying to blackmail Europe with the proposed "We won't chop the trees down if you pay us" adiition to the Kyoto treaty(carbon credits for standing forest)we would'nt have to worry about the small things such as mail!

Anywho, wtf are junk-mail producers doing using expensive wood derived paper for?...I thought all their materials were bought from recycled crap on the cheap....guess it depends on who you ask(paper producers?)

You should read about what it takes to recycle paper!

Last edited by Woz, Thu 24 Dec 2009, 19:56.

Quote from Dygear :

1. How many trees are on the earth?
   
2. Where are you getting these numbers from?
   

Or to put it another way:

lol if you think there are less than 100 million trees on the planet you have a strange view on the actual size of the planet? 100 million trees is about 750000 acres, which is a tiny fraction of the forests on earth but still a sizable amount to cut and process just to send to the rubbish dump.

I have read many pieces of information around zunk mail and know people that used to work in the industry. Here is some good reading http://www.donotmail.org/article.php?id=119 but just use google, it is your friend

The number of trees required to produce X amount of paper is WELL KNOW. Humans have been making paper for a couple of years now you know, well since the printing press was made

In the end if YOU are happy about all the waste generated by junk mail DO NOTHING. If you think it is a pointless waste DO SOMETHING. The great thing about junk mail, as stated, is they send out the tools for you to protest at NO cost to yourself.

So think of me as a crack pot or go educate yourself, your call

In the end YOUR children will inherit the planet from YOU!!!!

All that needs to be said.

Quote from mookie427 :

Forget just mailing back the letters to them if you are lucky enough to get an addressed envelope. Cut out the address from the envelope, fill a box with cut up tyres, engine parts, bricks etc and send it to them, will cost you nothing as it's 'postage paid' but they still have to pay, and then dispose of it.

ROTF. Would be nice to send house bricks and the like but I think there is limits to what postage paid allows you to send.

In the end though numbers matter. 100000 people sending postage paid envelopes or calling 0800 numbers costs them serious cash. It needs to be things that takes little effort for people.

Its like a people powered ddos attack. Join the group and spread the word

Last edited by Woz, Thu 24 Dec 2009, 07:40.

Quote from DarkTimes :

Well I can only talk from my own experience, the C# editor is not any slower than in VS2008 for me, and the WPF editor is much, much better. That being said, the WPF support was awful before. I can understand that other potions of VS may not be all hugs and puppies, but for what I mainly use it for I'm pretty satisfied. Of course it is still a beta, and it does have a few bugs, but then that's what betas are for.

Depends how aggressive your are with your use of intellisense

Quote from BlakjeKaas :

Hooray facebook[/obvious sarcasm]

sigh

Quote from Dajmin :

I expect the best thing you could do would be mail all of their junk straight back to them. Can't you mark it "return to sender" and get that done for free? If enough people started doing that they'd definitely need to rethink their marketing strategy.

You only need the postage paid envelope to cost them the postage fee and the cost of someone to open all the returned envelopes. But yes "return to sender works as well". I even swap the junk mail contents so companies get other companies junk.

The main thing is cost. The whole junk mail industry works on apathy of millions of people to do nothing. Think of all the crap you get in the post. No multiply by every house that has a post box and you see the scale of the problem

It is a pointless watse for less than 1% response rate!

Quote from Gil07 :

Most of the junk mail isn't really mailed per se, it's just put in every mailbox.

You are on about flyers. These will normally have a freephone number to call. So for every piece call them and in a polite tone say "Thanks for your junk mail", each short call can cost them up to $1 when call centre fees and the like are taken into account.

Quote from Dajmin :

So those "no unsolicited mail" signs actually work? I understand there is a legal case for them, right?

Here in NZ they work. If not every phone call to the 0800 number on their costs them upwards of $1 for phone charges and call centre charges. All it needs is a polite "Thanks for the junk mail" then hang up.

Quote from Intrepid :

Hmm.. 100 million trees a year? I somehow doubt that figure. Either way stop junk mail and you'll be putting a whole lot of people out of jobs. But good luck, let's just hope the people employed by this trade haven't got young mouths to feed.

The figure is probably an under estimate that has been published and ratified by a number of sources if you start to search. JOBS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! omg lol. How about we pay people to hover the sidewalk as that would create more jobs

Quote from Becky Rose :

One of my favorite tricks is to take some rubbish out of my bin and put it in the envelope along with a covering letter stating the following:

"Thank you for your rubbish. Please find enclosed some of mine."

Thats the spirit



In the end this is down to numbers. People recycle so should just make this part of your recycle activity. The less junk mail the less you have to recycle.

Each time I take a few seconds to cost a junk mail sender some cash makes me smile because I know I have done my part to effect their bottom line. The ONLY thing they care about!

Last edited by Woz, Tue 22 Dec 2009, 19:15.

Quote from sil3ntwar :

I work for Foodstuffs and i used to work for Progressive. Wonder if putting flyers up at work would get a response

lol yep let them know.

Responsible advertising is fine when I have asked for it but every time one of their flyers comes through my "No Junk Mail" box it will cost them at least $1 in 0800 number fees

If the group gains enough momentum I will also not be the only one

Just try to rememeber 100 million trees every time you see all the crap in the letter box we all get! Foodstuffs and Progressive are as much to blame with their pointless flyers as the direct mailers.

Last edited by Woz, Tue 22 Dec 2009, 09:10.

I am looking forwards to the DLR integration with C#.

Covariance and contravariance are the big things I want as they really P me off being missing from C#

Why I could not cast

List<ClassA> to an IEnumerable<IMyInterface> when ClassA implements IMyInterface was beyond me. The hoop jump to solve was just dumb.

Quote from sil3ntwar :

This is your facebook group? Might want to link to it. Never noticed any envelopes being sent as well.

Link added. Yep, my group started once I found out about how much the industry wastes of the planets resources each year.

As you are in NZ like me it is more common here for stuff like the Bunnings and Foodstuffs flyers. If you have a No Junk Mail sign on your post box just ring the 0800 number on the sheet and tell them to stop. Once for each piece. I did this today, the lady on the other end was not happy but hay, cost them a few $

All mailings normally have what they term "call to action". To be effective they normally need a way to contact the sender that is free or the response rate drops well below the 0.5-1% required to mail a mailing profitable. (Knowing people that were involved in direct/junk mail in the past gives helpful inside knowledge )

So they either include a postage paid or a free phone number. Both of these only cost the sender when you post back or phone them and they rely on apathy to avoid the costs of the 99% of the people mailed that just bin the stuff they send.

Anything you can do to cost them lowers the profits on the mailing so every bit helps

Last edited by Woz, Tue 22 Dec 2009, 07:30.

The other day I found out the shocking fact that over 100 million trees are cut down a year to support the junk mail industry.

To put that in perspective that is over 750000 acres or 400000 football pitches of forest cut down a year. I know there are managed forests that take some of the strain but that ignores all the fuel and energy used to

- Cut down.
- Transfer to paper mills.
- Print
- Transported to where mail shots are put together.
- Transported to post office
- Transported through the post system
- Put in the bin
- Transported to landfill

I have come up with a way to use junk mail against the industry that sends it that will cost you NOTHING to hurt them but requires people power.

As junk mail assumes less than 1% response rate that leaves billions of $ worth of postage paid envolopes that cost the junk mailers nothing UNLESS you post them back.

So every piece of junk you get keep make sure you take out the envelope and post it and tell everyone you know to do the same. It should be like part of your recycle practices

I have started a Facebook group (Only 2 days old at the mo) called DIE Junk Mail DIE. Join and spread the word.

It only takes a few % of the unused envelopes to go back for the cost to combat the profit made from the mailing.

No profit = no more mailings.

If these is no envelope look for the 0800 number and call and simply say somethings like. "Just to let you know I got your junk mail, please stop" then hang up.

Both these cost the sender of junk.

Just to state again... 100 million trees

Last edited by Woz, Tue 22 Dec 2009, 07:21.

Quote from obsolum :

I'm strange then I loved the original CS and played the shit out of it, but I became so fed up with all the cheats and cheaters that eventually I gave up on it. I haven't played any other shooter online since then, as they all tend to be infested with cheating ****s.

5€ is a good deal, though

You need to find the joys of L4D (1 + 2) Never really encounter cheating, wall hacking or aimbots because its just pointless to use them.

4 player coop that works and works well and is good laugh

I believe it was removed a while back to block exploits that people were using where they hacked in negative force to make the car go faster.

Locking it solved that. But anyway, its a handbrake so as long as it holds the car on a hill that is all thats required in a race sim

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

Fnar.. I don't know how to read flags... Sorry

That really sucks, I have manually went into the "censored" version (as I was in a public place, I enabled the low violence startup switch), and I can tolerate it, although the disappearing bodies was the only thing that really pissed me off.

Still sucks that the Aussie government is so ****ing stupid, Germany I can almost understand the censorship as they're scarred from a few wars and such.

That sucks that you get lumped into the Aussie servers though.. maybe starting a group of NZ players so you can avoid the Aussies would be a good idea... Or you can try conquest and just make Australia a state of New Zealand

also, I played realism mode.. I didn't find it to be terribly difficult, even when I was playing with 1 person + 2 bots. Maybe I'll give it a try later on expert.

And another edit: The L4D maps have been hacked into L4D2.. probably not good for mainstream use yet, but it does work. Hopefully valve will come through on something they said earlier, about letting the maps get transfered into L4D2, either for free, or even a couple dollars.

I think its the lack of outlines. Bots prob helped as they would aim (well) for heads and know where to look. Once you have 4 people you really need good voice coms as its easy to get split up. THe other thing with realism is when you die there is no respawn until next safe room, apart from paddles, and the witch kills you by a touch.

I mostly play with people I know so I don't suffer censored really

Quote from theirishnoob :

it looks like the managed to make one worse then the first.

L4D2 >>>> L4D

Far more subtle and complex. The new areas are great and the new special infected really change the game. Just wish they would have allowed L4D campaigns run in the 2 engine, that maps should not need much work from the sounds of it.

Anyone played realism mode? Played last night.

Very different game. Becomes a far more serious game where you will only make progress with good team players. Not a mode to play with randoms.

I prefer to standard. Becomes scary when you are dragged off etc as other have no idea where you are unless they are in line of sight.