Quote from Scawen :

...
The arrows changed when I added a circle for objects (well suited to the football) and at first it was an oval, so I adjusted the code to produce the 'correct' shape for the object.
...

(now people will think I'm all over minimap arrows, haha )

Another thing I noticed are "smudges" on the right all of the arrows (when pointing straight up, its on the right of each arrow). They do travel with the arrows, so I suspect they are part of the arrow shape somehow. In the attached image, the yellow ones are more visible, mainly between T1 and T2 on the map - zooming to 200-300% shows them clearly.

/pitins and /liveset commands work fine and are really useful! Will update LFSManual once released, to note the new options and give examples.

Minor thing: I just noticed the arrows on the minimap are elongated, compared to 7D. I guess this was introduced with the new arrow coloring (by nickname), somewhere before 7D8, but not sure it was intended. For me personally, I'm so used to the old arrows and would prefer having the old shapes back I mean it is a really small thing, but on crowded minimaps (during races or busy cruise) it is just wasted space and lowers readability. Attached 7D (usual arrows) and 7D8-14 screenshots with the elongated arrows.

For some reason, /status F12 does not enable the F12 panel. All other commands work properly, can also scroll to F12 using
edit: gives no error message like /status F13 or any other invalid parameter would.

Last edited by MandulAA, Tue 7 Mar 2023, 20:05.

Quote from KingOfIce :

...
But if I use this same script on the FXR, it changes the type of tyre (because of the different number of lines!)
...

I agree, a more sophisticated system would be better (to have global script commands to adjust for example ARB specifically), but this might be a workaround for the car difference issue you have:

There are script files named {car}.lfs which are automatically run when you join the track with the selected car. You could edit these files to add your code, and these will only run when you use the specific car. That way you could use the correct amount of up/down commands to match the available lines for each car. Sure you would have to edit one for all the cars, which is much more work, but still, a workaround for now.

(script chaining is still possible using the "run" command)

LFSW name: MandulAA
In-game name: RG^Mandula
Full team name: Race Green Autosports
Nation: Hungary

Hi! I wanted to finally try it out for today's FBM Saturday, but noticed some kind of a bug:

The combo (track/car) is recognized wrongly, even though I am on official combo of AS3R/FBM. That causes several problems, including no fuel info and wrong RPM redlimit. See screenshot. This happened online, on the MRc FBM Saturday server.

Using newest version, 1.2.0.8. Restarted app once, while I kept LFS running and on server, didnt fix

EDIT: I looked at the logs, it seems that it recognizes AS3R/FBM internally, but widgets don't reflect that


EDIT 2: during the race, I noticed the combo was suddenly right (AS3R/fbm), but still had no fuel data, so they might be irrelevant, dunno.

Last edited by MandulAA, Sat 17 Sep 2022, 19:54.

LFS Manual is still unknown to the majority of the LFS community, it seems Anyway, this might help get you started: https://en.lfsmanual.net/wiki/Script_Guide

Quote from jammy1 :

Do you know when that statement was made? I'd love to be part of any beta testing for this new build.

18th August, 2022. If there is any test patch released, I'm sure you will get to know about it

Quote from Sirmais1 :

Thank you. And what about !ex ?

!ex is a command of Airio as well, but it is collecting data for Airio globally, so all Airio instances use a global experience database. However, since the developer of Airio no longer maintains the software and its website, the Airio experience database is no longer available, unfortunately.

Quote from Sirmais1 :

And why in some serveres I can see from witch country and what licence have other drivers,but my own showes demo? I am asking for my father,i dont know anything about this game,but he dont speak english,maybe these are stupid questions,but he needs to know😄

I suspect you used the Airio command !pl, which displays a list of connected players, with various data with them (country, license, etc.). I'm not really sure why it would show Demo for you since you have an S3 license.

I see previous discussion here, but could you please check again?: on the main menu, in the lower right corner, does it say "Demo license: Sirmais1", or "S3 license: Sirmais1"? If you see the former, you need to unlock your LFS client in S3 mode. This sounds worse than it is - just click on that button, and on the following screen, click the green "Unlock" button on the lower right corner. You should get a message saying "Welcome to Live for Speed S3", which means you unlocked all the content (tracks, cars). Now you should see yourself as licensed, in the !pl list on the server as well.

One thing if I may, to ease feedback and lower the amount of off-topic posts in this thread in case you have further questions:
feel free to join the LFS Discord community server, where you can probably get help and answer to your questions faster and in more detail (there are 2,700 members joined on the server, most of which I'm sure are willing to help). Use this invite link: https://discord.com/invite/wZrUTJN, or click the same on the bottom of LFS.net (Discord logo, lower right corner).

Last edited by MandulAA, Thu 8 Sep 2022, 16:29. Reason : fixed !ex, it is not a server specific command, credits to smart3k

Quote from Sirmais1 :

Hi,I have S3 licence,but cant see any stas and records in servers from past,where can be the problem??is it problem with licence or something with servers?

If you miss the stats on individual servers (like !top, !tb, !pb tables etc.), those are recorded by a software called Airio, which is running on that specific server. It is up to that server to keep the database - if they purged it in the past, it might have gone, but that has nothing to do with your S3 license, or LFS in general. Only that specific server manages that data.

(note: also, Airio might not be running on some servers at all these days, since the hosting changes, because server owners dont really have another server to host Airio on)

If you mean your LFSW stats and data, that you can always browse at https://www.lfsworld.net/ . Those don't get wiped (except when the laptimes for a specific track/car are wiped due to updates, but that wipe does not happen often) and are tied to your LFS account.

Quote from johneysvk :

you can export it from within LFS under the colours tab

I did that, if someone prefers them in a single .zip

Looks great!

I agree, would be great to have these as "native" button-mappable functions in Settings/Controls, like other functions like Speed Limiter and such.

Of course, not an optimal substitute for the time being, but I've made a short and lazy script to adjust Brake Balance at least, using buttons on my wheel. It's basically mimicking the button presses you would make on the keyboard (F11, left/right to adjust, F9 to go back to tyre temps overlay). See: https://en.lfsmanual.net/wiki/Script_Guide#Brake_balance_adjustment_.28increase.2Fdecrease.29

Scripting in LFS opens up a lot of possibilities and I really think it's awesome, however, I agree that functions like these should be present natively and more accessible. Seasoned LFS players can probably manage to make scripts like this work, but someone who just joined LFS will spend a lot of time searching for a basic brake balance adjustment function.

Quote from nexttime :

The problem is when people make suggestions they think you copy paste the code, and voila, LFSlazy integrated.

Actually, no. I'm quite aware what goes in coding to make something work, even though I'm not a high-level developer. As for my long(ish) post explaining the racing-related features, since more info was requested about them and noone was willing, I decided to conduct an overview that could be referenced later. As far as I see, nobody demanded these features here right away, just exchanging ideas and sharing what is there in these 3rd party software, that someone not regularly racing might not be aware of.

I think Gabor didn't demand a test patch right away, just wanted to hear what the dev(s) think about the features. And he got that. That's it, no need to point fingers.

Happy birthday !

Hope to see the project evolve for another 20 years, if not more! The screenshots look great, can't wait to experience the new graphics (especially the day/night cycle) on all the upgraded tracks and the new tyre physics. The experiments (1000 Hz and multithreading) are some long-requested features and those could really be advantageous for the future - not sure how tied up these experiments are with the newly developed tyre physics/graphics systems, if they could be released separately, after the new tyre physics/graphics systems are out.

(sorry for the longer post, reflecting on a previously mentioned topic: )

Quote from Scawen :

I'd be interested to read a more detailed description of this [edit: Gábor's (Viperakecske) sector timing] request.

I'd like to post a by-no-means comprehensive, but exact overview of what hugely racing-focused features there are in the server-sided Airio and the client-sided LFSLazy that we use in online racing daily and actually miss, when one of these applications are not functioning (while Airio works fine these days, except handling mods names weirdly, Lazy has not been working since LFS version 0.7A). I saw some posts here already tried to explain the missing "sector timing" feature, but there is a lot more to it. Of course, this doesn't want to become an "improvement suggestions"- or a "demands"-type list, but since it was requested, I think it would help a lot to shed some light on these features, describing what is there in these software (without having to fire up both and start exploring what racers miss from native LFS).

• Server best, race session-based SECTOR times tracking (and database)
  [server-sided feature in Airio | commands: !sc, !sc 1/2/3/4]
  !sc (combined race tb's, using best individual sector times): https://i.imgur.com/5lSdh75.png
  !sc 2 (best sector times for sector 1/2/3/4): https://i.imgur.com/liif5aE.png
  • I'll start with the already mentioned feature. Airio (on the server-side) tracks all individual sector times (that is, time spent between split checkpoints, for example Sector 3 is the time spent between split lines 2 and 3), for all racers, within the current quali or race session. These sector times are accessible with the !sc commands, which compiles a list of the theoretical best laps for each racer on track, consisting of their best sector times in each sector (with these best sector times visible). Also accessible with !sc 1/2/3/4 for only specific sectors. These both help racers discover and pinpoint a sector by looking at others' sector times, which could be improved by them ("oh, there is still time in sector 2, I gotta watch someone faster do sc2 and learn from them"). Important, these commands only work with the current race session, and are nulled after a session ends.
    
• Server best, race session-based SPLIT times tracking (and database)
  [server-sided feature in Airio | commands: !sp 1/2/3/4]
  • Basically the same as the previous, just with split times. This gives less of a spatial reference of the potential improvements towards the ends of the lap, but is still popular to check and analyze in racing. Same as before, only race session-based, nulls after sessions ends.
    
• Server best recorded laptimes list tracking (and database)
  [server-sided feature in Airio | commands: !top (current combo); !top xfg (other car, current track)]
  !top (AA Blackwood GTi, and since XFG and XRG are the current allowed cars, list consists of both cars' times): https://i.imgur.com/B2nhiY5.png
  • This is a global, permanent database tracked by Airio and stored on the specific server, populated with finished laptimes (completed laps) and the split times in that lap. Now, since we have LFSW, there is potential to track all laptimes done online, and make servers automatically upload all laptimes like it does PBs and populate global lists for combos. This does seem like a lot of data to process and store, also, it needs to stay easily and quickly browsable, especially from within LFS. Currently, like all of the server-sided features listed here, the data is stored on the server, within Airio's database files, and it does make sense to keep it this way (so all servers keep their own databases of times/sectors etc.).
    
• Server best Theoretical laptimes tracking (and database)
  [server-sided feature in Airio | commands: !tb (current combo); !tb xfg (other car, current track)]
  !tb: https://i.imgur.com/pNrIZfR.png
  • Since best sector times are stored while the cars do their laps, these sector times are also used to compile a list of server-specific theoretical best laptimes. This !tb list is permanent on the server (not race session specific), so if someone did a great sector 2 half a year ago, it still has a footprint in this list and the sector time can be seen. Also, if someone practiced a lot on the server, put together three awesome sectors but in separate laps, they will top this !tb list, but not !top. For a racer, it is quite encouraging seeing the "potential" exploited not only by others, but by themselves, too ("I did a great sc2 and sc3, I just need to sort out my sc1, cause the potential is there in me to do a good lap").
    
• Highest speeds in race
  [server-sided feature in Airio | commands: !sd, !speed]
  !sd: https://i.imgur.com/9Z6Pr1L.png
  • Lists the highest speeds individual drivers achieved in current race. As I understand it (see picture), Airio measures speed at 2 places (this was BL1, I guess at split 1 and 2), and averages them to build up the list. In practice, it could be measured at speedtraps only, or only the highest speeds achieved any time. Matter of discussion how its calculated, but some speed-relevant tracking is useful: "all others have much higher top speeds, maybe I should lower downforce on my car setup?".
    
• Real-time differences relative to cars around (either by current race position or absolute track position)
  [client-sided on-screen widget in LFSLazy]
  Lazy widget in-action: https://i.imgur.com/cQMOs7I.mp4
  • LFSLazy has a position list widget, with real-time differences shown (with hundredth precision). It shows 4 players ahead and behind you. Of course, diff is already shown in LFS in the lower-right corner next to the position list, but that only displays differences calculated at the split checkpoints, and is not visible at all times. Also, that list disappears when having the F9 tyre temp overlay open (which I'm sure 90% of racers has open while racing - that is the default, go-to info overlay). Upgrading the existing LFS position list to have real-time diff info at all times would be great, but only if it can be visible while also having the F9 overlay open.
    
• Real-time delta, speed compared to personal best lap
  [client-sided on-screen widget in LFSLazy]
  • Lazy records PB's locally, but somehow (I guess) it must store spatial data with those time and speed measurements during a lap. It has 2 widgets, which, using these data, shows real-time time delta (with thousandth precision (?) ), and also a speed delta (with hundredth precision) compared to the personal best lap done in the past (faster as green, slower as red). These can easily indicate a turn done great or poorly, or a braking point missed or done early.
    
• Predicted next split time
  [client-sided on-screen widget in LFSLazy]
  • Based on and using the data mentioned in the delta feature, it can show a predicted next split time, given you do everything the same as your personal best lap recorded. I'm not entirely sure about the methodology it uses behind the scenes, but it works great and is useful during a race, just to see and get a glance of your current pace, compared to your own best.
    
  The last three LFSLazy features can be seen in-action in any of my onboard livestreams, for example: https://youtu.be/riOnLRULzR4?t=5429 . Notice the position list on the left, and the speed/time diffs, pb time and split predict widgets of LFSLazy at the top, lower row of the two. (the upper row is displayed by Airio server-sided, and it basically is the same information, but only updates upon reaching splits)
  
  Not race timing related:
  
  
• Engine damage, clutch slip quantified
  [client-sided on-screen widget in LFSLazy]
  • Lazy can (with or without some memory-tinckering) read the current engine damage %, which affects the race pace of course. Also can read the current clutch slip %. Not high on the priority list, but still, would be great to see these values someway.
    

Most of the server-sided, timing related stuff is also echoed in the server chat, for example when you do a Best sector 1, a Great split 2 in the current race, or do a server-best lap (kind of like the message from LFSW upon a PB). Not of the utmost importance, but it's great info to have when you are in the middle of the race and want to have some info of your competitors' paces.

Since these features and their potential deployment vary greatly in terms of server- and client-sidedness and complexity (given if they are integrated in LFSW in some way, they would require more work), there isn't a "kill two birds with one stone"-like solution, of course. Since there is lots of data to be tracked and shown, I imagine it could get quite complex quite quickly. However, if these features would slowly start trickling into LFS natively without having to rely on 3rd-party software and their constant maintenance by a single person (who might or might not be reachable), I'm sure the racing scene would be very thankful in general!

Looking forward to any upcoming news of the development progress, even if technical!

Last edited by MandulAA, Mon 22 Aug 2022, 19:37. Reason : added more detail

Quote from gu3st :

A i7-4770 is somewhat old but not completely useless. Would be quad core and hyperthreaded. I had one with a 1660Ti and it was ok in VR but not ideal. A 1060 will definitely be on the lower capabilities of VR. *snip*

I had absolutely no issues running LFS with my 1060 3gb in VR, using Rift CV1. I basically have the same pc as RacingSOUL, except with a bit stronger cpu (i7-6700k, which has 8971 pts vs. the i7-4770 with 7029 pts on PassMark) and the same amount of DDR4, 3000mhz RAM. The slowdowns might be caused by that cpu difference, or maybe the PSU? It doesn't seem like you would hit the 330w mark with that setup, but no psu likes to run close to its capacity, let alone lower-end psu's that can't hold 12/5/3.3V voltages stable due to their lower quality components, especially over long time running on the limit.

Not sure, but thought I might add my findings using a similar setup

Looks great! Great job with this and also with Detect, some of the most imporant racing-related features of Lazy trickling down to new software - nice! Keep it up

The unfortunate thing is LFSLazy hard-checking for the LFS version, instead of, lets say InSim version that if changes, could really make it incompatible. It sure would be a bit riskier and make the app more prone to malfunctioning with a new LFS version, but on the other hand we could still use Lazy in these cases, when no major things changed after 7A (7B-C-D) that could break it.

(of course, the appearance of vehicle mods was major, and not something this approach could substitute)

Gadgets like Lazy has would be very welcome to LFS, though. If not that, creating a community-developed, open source alternative would be the way (which we mentioned on the LFS Discord server many times already). Of course, that would need huge contribution from lots of people to build up from scratch, but in the long run, it would make sure the app doesn't just "stop" working.

Yeah, that is exactly what I was afraid of... Can we even use the word "YouTube" legally?

All is well here! FFB-wise I wasn't affected by that issue, but still works fine here, nothing went wrong. The online player counters appeared next to server names, I already found it quite handy. Great job!

One thing came to my mind is, - and since I have little to no clue about trademarks etc. -, if its required, make sure you have a disclaimer to use YT/Twitch logos somewhere. Again, I have no idea how these logos are copyrighted, attribution might not be required at all, I thought I just mention it just in case.

(couldn't see the lock icon next to any servers, but I guess it's just bad luck since no event servers are passworded right now - will check tomorrow, when the FOX Friday server gets locked for the quali)

Cyan looks nice. Didn't even think of using colors to differentiate between the name and numbers, great idea! Might be worth to change the color to yellow if only ~10 spots are available, and to red when full. Might be overthinking now

I really appreaciate the feature, thank you! Hopefully that provokes a little bit of encouragement of joining in people who are interested in an event, but don't want to practice alone. I will be interested to see it live, once it's implemented on the web side.

Quote from Scawen :

..
I've removed that extra space now in the attached image. What do you think? When the next character is a 1, I can see what my family were worried about.
..

Ah yes, I see it's a bit weird with 1 being the next character, although I think the one on your image still has less of a visual imbalance than with the current version C3 (and will only be close(r) while next char is 1, which will only happen for 10+1 minutes anyway ). Or, another way, put the word "in" between the blob and the livestream countdown. Not sure how it would look with char "i" next to the blob.

Quote from Scawen :

..
About the racers online, would it matter that the number isn't live, and only updates when you refresh the page?
..

Thanks for considering the feature! I think it would be more than sufficient to have it static, especially if that makes adding the display much easier and faster. After all, there is a refresh button, and I also guess the panel refreshes itself many times already (any time we go into the main menu, either when launching LFS or coming back from a session (?) ).

Brackets for the numbers would be great! Whichever looks best

Last edited by MandulAA, Wed 13 Apr 2022, 12:10.

Tried the changes in C3, they work great!

A really small, visual thing (see attached image):
seemingly there is a double spacer between the date/time field and the • character that bugs my eyes.

Even though I understand C2 and now C3 are just hotfix-like patches that should be released as soon as possible (due to the keyboard/brake bias thing), I can't resist suggesting a little addition to the upcoming events list:
Would it be possible to show connection count next to the server names, given they are online? I suspect it would encourage people to join, if they see someone practising for an event they are interested in as well. Something like this:


or

Quote from Scawen :

..
I think this is intended and has always been this way.
..

Oh, I see! One learns something every day! I didn't know about this, always entered the F11 panel first, and adjusted there. Now I'm using a script mapped to a button on my wheel to adjust bias, but seems like I overcomplicated that as well, since that does press F11 first - now I know it shouldn't need to and I can simplify the script a bit more (though only for FBM/FOX/FO8 then).