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Scawen
Developer
Quote from Gutholz :However all buttons were set to "none" in options.
Restarted LFS and everything was okay again. (all buttons worked, rotation okay)

In N3 there is a refresh button on controller setup screen so you should never need to restart LFS any more for controllers.

Quote from Gutholz :When I adjust rotation (going from roadcar to formular etc) I always set it in all places 'just to be sure.' Looking

You don't need to do that, because LFS does that automatically.

Set it like this:

Logitech settings : 900
LFS "Wheel Turn" : 900 <-- This must match the game controller's wheel turn!
LFS "Wheel Turn compensation" : 1.0

Now don't change anything at all when you change car. You will find the wheel turns exactly the same as the in-game car wheel, regardless of which car you drive. That's the easy way.

Of course, Logitech driver will then not stop your wheel turning past the limit of the in-game car. For me that's no problem. But if you want your wheel to hit the stoppers then you'll have to change it in Logitech settings and LFS "Wheel turn" to match.
Last edited by Scawen, .
Scawen
Developer
I've been on the case, making various improvements.

One thing: As I knew the axis calibration system was a bit annoying and usually forgets calibrations (e.g. if you ever started without your wheel connected) I started to try and code it so it saved a separate calibration setup per controller file. I ran into a little difficulty because of the way it was coded. Then I thought, why not just delete the calibration system? I am thinking that the wheel / gamepad / joystick / pedal manufacturers probably do calibration, so there is no need for the extra annoying calibration code in LFS.

So now I've commented it out of existence and it just assumes the full pedal range is available from the outset. So you don't have to move all axes to their full extent or click calibration lock.

Thought I'd better run this by you first, in case I'm missing something. In short, my general thought is that may be code that was needed in the past but is just a little annoying now.

Updates so far (in my version) :

Combined brake / throttle axis now defaults to correct direction
Controllers with 5 axes now default to combined brake / throttle
Automatically set Clutch setting to axis if wheel has clutch pedal
Automatic preset is now attempted on first of multiple controllers
Arrow keys can now be assigned to wheel buttons (default D-pad)
Default 900 degrees turn for Logitech G25 / G27 / Driving Force
Attempted sensible presets for Thrustmaster steering wheels
Removed axis calibration system that didn't work well
Scawen
Developer
Quote from T3charmy :Since we're working on the controller, Would it be possible we could add something for the steering axis similar to what you can do with keyboard(steer rate/return rate) for those of us playing with handheld controllers such as PS4, Xbox controllers.

I think this goes a bit further than what I can get into this week. I feel time is short because we need a full version up there that supports the new Rift. Many people can't or don't want to install a test patch so I think we need to go for a full version next weekend.

Quote from T3charmy :Edit 2: and if possible on top of the first point(which at that alone would be very much appreciated!), possibly add it to where we are able to adjust the multiplier/sensitivity for all axes not just the steering. kind of like how Mouse X and Mouse Y work where you're able to.

This sounds a bit like the existing "Thr / brk centre reduction" option.

Quote from T3charmy :Another thing that could be useful would be to map the right joystick to being the look heading, but being able to set a limit for it, like all the way left is 90, all the way right is 90, and pressing the joystick down would be look behind

I thought some more about this, and I'm not sure if this is just obvious or not (maybe is how it is in other games, I don't know) but I thought the two axes of the right stick could be useful to make a full 360 degree look system.

How it could work :

- X and Y axes are assigned
- A new "joystick" look function (probably default)
- Centre dead zone, nothing happens up to around 25% movement
- Moving stick to the edge in any direction will look that way
- Moving stick partially will provide an intermediate position

This way, moving the stick left or right would look 90 degrees left and right. You could look more forward or back from that position by moving the stick forward or back. I think you could quite quickly or smoothly look in any direction you wanted to. I haven't tried it yet but it seems the combined use of two axes to control look heading in this way could work well.
Scawen
Developer
Thanks for the info. I'll be working tomorrow and will try some Thrustmaster presets.

Thank you everyone for the testing. It is a great help.

I could do a little better with multiple controller setups, with a small change. If I put the wheel device at the top of the list, followed by game pads, and put "unknown controller" further down the list, then it could do the standard automatic setup on the wheel or game pad. So e.g. Cargame's setup would automatically be reasonable for the DFGT wheel and he would then just have to set up the axes on his external pedals and some preferred buttons.

So what I'm saying is it should prioritise them a better and do the auto setup on the first device in the list. It can ignore the other devices as it really wouldn't know what to do with them.
Scawen
Developer
On the DFGT subject, I wonder if you see the same bug I see with the G27. And do G27 owners get this bug too? The BUG: unplug the wheel's USB before you start LFS. Start LFS, plug in the USB. The wheel does its centering thing and when it is done, I can click "refresh" in LFS to get access to the wheel. All is good but one thing. The wheel only turns 90 degrees each way. The only way to get the full range is by clicking on another window. Suddenly the wheel can turn 900 degrees again and I can click back to LFS and all is OK. This happens regardless of the "input when window is inactive" setting, so it doesn't seem like an LFS bug. I couldn't find any way round this other than doing the window clicking...
Scawen
Developer
Quote from T3charmy :Yep, only 5, Just bought the controller + wireless adapter for windows from the store about 3 weeks ago. LFS reports "Controller (Xbox One For Windows) Gamepad". Only have 5 axes. X axis, Y Axis, Z Axis, RX Axis, RY Axis. Also using the auto-installed driver. Running Windows 10 1511 at the moment. (Also see my previous post about an issue related to windows 10 tech preview).

Strange that mine has the RZ axis as well, separately. Maybe Windows 7 is better. Wink

Anyway, now I'm setting it to dual axis if the controller has 6 axes, combined axis if it has 5 axes.

Quote from Flame CZE :Could it be done so the Clutch setting is set to "axis" by default for steering wheels with a clutch pedal?

Good suggestion, thanks. I recently noticed the axes have a name when they are enumerated, and one of them is "Clutch" on the G27. So I've now used that and set Clutch to "axis" in this case.

Quote from cargame.nl :Hhmm if we start to talk about DFGT then I cannot resist to stay silent ...

Thanks for the info and screenshot. In the multiple controller case, LFS isn't going to be very helpful at the moment.

Anyway, for single wheels, I've now set it to default to 900 degrees wheel turn if the wheel name contains "g25" or "g27" or "driving force". For other wheels the default is 270.

Quote from Eclipsed :I also have DFGT,so I tried to connect after renaming old .con file. The name is shown as 'Logitech Driving Force GT USB' and most controls are like they should be - that is steering,pedals and shifter buttons behind wheel. Also look left/right buttons are assigned pretty logically and horn,handbrake,speed limiter and TC buttons are set to buttons,which have playstation cross,circle,square and triangle symbols. VR click is set to center button and virtual keyboard to small button below. For some weird reason gears 1 to 6 are assigned to few buttons and the shifter stick...
But for better overview I made a little grafical button chart,hope it will help.

Thanks for all the information and picture with numbers.

The gears are assigned because of the G27 shifter. I have now set it to only assign the shifter buttons if the name containts "g25" or "g27".
Last edited by Scawen, .
Scawen
Developer
Quote from Ripley :I have a Logitech DFGT wheel if that serves.
I can report back its buttons and such in 10 hours or so...

I was thinking about this. Sorry about my slow reply. Was a bit busy getting my head around the other things.

I could add an auto-setup for the DFGT. I wonder how similar it is to a G27. On finding an unknown wheel, LFS natively does G27 style button and axis assignments.

Please could you try renaming the .con file before you start LFS? Then start LFS and try the controls to see if anything's wrong with them. I guess there will be something! Smile

Also, what is the name as displayed at the top right of the controller screen? So LFS can identify it and apply special setting.

If you want to report axes, please use 0.6N3 which displays the correct axis names.

Thanks!
Scawen
Developer
Quote from Eclipsed :Oh dear,careful with such messages - unpatient kids will start to flood the forum with "where is the promised free stuff" already in summer... Looking

Thanks, yeah, don't try to read time estimates from vague comments. I just mean months rather than years. We're on the case and want these things out as soon as possible, but there are always complications.

Quote from Eclipsed :The problem is that many wants to join server with 20+ racers already in it,otherwise it's not worth it for them. Shrug

Yeah, but this is a mistake. People must try to understand that for a server to become populated, people must join it first. It is silly to be scared to be the first or second person. Others will join. Be brave, do a couple of practice laps while you wait. Smile
Scawen
Developer
Obviously I agree it is a pity there isn't more choice of licensed racing servers at the moment. We are working hard on things to improve the situation. We're beyond that slow period we went through a few years ago. I'm sure the new track and tyre physics will help, and some new types of vehicle, though these are still some months away. I've been trying to make sure LFS is the best VR sim racing experience to get some more people in that way.

One thing though, people could help by actually going online. I see a LOT of people saying, this would be fun if only there were people to race with. Well... guess who can do something about that? Smile It's no good looking at the list of hosts then not joining. Instead, pick one and go there, even if it's empty. At least one person has to join or it obviously will be empty! The next person who comes along might just join you. Thumbs up
Scawen
Developer
Quote from bobloblaw :Xbox 360 controller: all axes are correct, but throttle/brake are reversed. It defaulted to throttle/brake invert 1, while invert 0 gives correct setup. (assuming we want throttle on right, brake on left)

Thank you for the test and feedback.

Quote from bobloblaw :Did some laps without sound, its amazing how much immersion breaks when the car starts to slide (or, how important sound is in immersion). I'm sure you were already planning on it, but I think updating the tire sound process while you're in that rabbit hole will provide a huge boost to immersion, especially for new VR users that may not have a FFB wheel.

I was a bit confused at first but I think you mean when I get stuck into the tyre physics again?

Quote from T3charmy :Since we're working on the controller, Would it be possible we could add something for the steering axis similar to what you can do with keyboard(steer rate/return rate) for those of us playing with handheld controllers such as PS4, Xbox controllers.

Thanks for your suggestions. I'll pass them through my mind but I don't really expect to dive deep into controller support at this time.

Quote from T3charmy :Edit: Xbox one controller doesn't get the Accel/Brake settings correctly. Mine are reporting as combined, and the default setting is separate. Changing to combined causes the correct axis to be selected, but invert is set to 1 by default, which as bobloblaw is the opposite of what you'd expect. All other settings seem reasonable

I am not sure why your XBox one controller doesn't have separate axes. Mine (a wireless one that came with the Rift engineering sample) does have separate axes, just using the Microsoft auto-installed driver. I'm not sure how I can distinguish between the two. Does yours report only 5 axes? Mine reports 6.

Quote from Skytrill :I can confirm what bobloblaw is saying about the throttle and brake being reversed (on a PS3 controller) after renaming the .con file and starting LFS again.

Thank you for this test. Actually I got that inverse setting from your original post (see below) also stated by K0Z3L_43V3R, though I think he was doing a copy / paste + edit of yours. Big grin I'll set invert to 0 for the next update.

Quote from Skytrill :
L-Trigger axe RY Axis +
R-Trigger axe RY Axis -

I guess you got the L and R the wrong way round. Anyway, LFS now reports the correct axis names and you should see those triggers with Z axis now, instead of RY (LFS displayed wrongly all these years).
Scawen
Developer
Thanks for the help. 0.6N3 is now available.

Controllers may now be plugged in or removed after LFS has started, and there is a refresh button on the controller setup screen. Multiple controller support is much better and should not lose your settings depending on which USB ports you use, etc, but multiple controller setups will need to be reassigned this time.

Some of you with a single game controller, please could you test the automatic controller setup? With LFS not running, look in data\misc and move or rename your controller's .con file, so LFS can't see it. Then when you start LFS it should try to set it up automatically, in a way that is similar to some other games. In particular, does it get the triggers right?

Thanks.

Changes from 0.6N2 to 0.6N3 :

VR :

Rift headphones are now used for sound output (default setting)
Rift remote can now be used for click / escape / virtual keyboard
Improved appearance of top row (ESC / F keys) of virtual keyboard

Controllers :

Controllers may now be plugged in and detected after LFS is started
Refresh button to detect controllers in Options - Controls screen
Controllers are now sorted (not dependent on order of connection)
Separate controller type setting for with / without controllers
Automatic controls assignment for various game controllers
Warning when you press ESC to exit controller setup screen
Button functions are now easier to see when in car

Fixes :

Axis names were previously displayed wrongly in Options - Controls
It was possible to enter a state where chat box could not be opened

https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/89352
Scawen
Developer
It should usually be OK. If you set it up for 6 controllers on one occasion, that will be saved (in DEFAULT_6.con). If you then go with 4 controllers, you will need to set up again. But that will be saved separately (in DEFAULT_4.con). If you go back to 6 controllers, it will load DEFAULT_6.con again and you don't need to setup this time, because you did that before.

It is likely to go wrong if you use a different set of 6 controllers. But if it's always the same 4 or the same 6 then it should work fine. There is the possibility of manually backing up the DEFAULT_X.con files if you like.
Scawen
Developer
It actually resaves the file when loaded to make it the most recently modified file. I suppose ideally LFS would store in some other file a list of the last loaded layout for every config. But this simple solution has always worked OK.
Scawen
Developer
Quote from K0Z3L_43V3R :I have multiple controllers, separate pedals and wheel, sometimes when I connect them in different order (wheel first or pedal first) or into different usb ports, button numbers and axis change, so I have to remap everything, can it be somehow fixed?
I have seen it in other games (Euro truck sim 2) where its working, controllers there have unique identifier or someting like, so they never change no matter how they are connected

Good point.

I've thought of one way to do this - LFS could sort the controllers by name (and maybe type).

So, the same set of X controllers will always be in the same order.

That should solve the problem of the order of connection and which ports you use. You would still need to do some reassignment if you removed or added a controller or changed to a different one.

Does that sound OK?

Note: For multiple controller combinations, LFS now saves separate config files so for example DEFAULT_3.con will be used if 3 controllers are detected and DEFAULT_8.con is loaded if 8 controllers are detected.


Quote from K0Z3L_43V3R :Rumble Gamepad F510 (logitech)
Gamepad
...

Thanks! Smile
Scawen
Developer
Thank you for the info, bobloblaw and Skytrill.

Interesting that they are nearly the same as the XBox One controller. Mine (using default drivers) does have the triggers on two separate axes. The right stick is the same as Skytrill's PS3 controller (it does have up/down).

Please can you tell me the text description shown at the top right of the controls options screen (the controller name and type of controller, in title colour, default yellow).

Thanks EeekiE, that would be good and does anyone have a Logitech game controller?
Scawen
Developer
I've been working on controllers.

Forced by the Rift updates (trying to make LFS suitable for Oculus Store) but beneficial to everyone who has a controller.

LFS must start up already in game controller mode, if a game controller is attached. That will be default behaviour and of course you can switch it off using the usual option (mouse / kb - wheel / js). But now, internally, there will be two of those options. One for when you have no controller attached and one for when your controller is attached.

So in the next patch, LFS can be in mouse / kb mode when your wheel is not attached, and if you start next time with a wheel, then it will be in wheel / js mode. Also now you can connect your controller while LFS is already running and you can click "refresh" in Controls Options and it will load the correct assignments file (misc\*.con) previously only loaded at startup. No need to restart LFS to connect your controller.

Also I must make LFS more intelligently set up the controller (axes and buttons) the first time it is seen. To help me with this, if you have a console type controller, please could you report to me the button numbers you see in LFS, if only that one controller is attached?

EDIT: This is the information I need:

1) The number seen in LFS for each of the buttons
2) Which axis name (in LFS) relates to which analog joystick axis / analog trigger
3) Which direction is + or - (in LFS the axis display moves right with positive movement)
4) The exact name and type of controller as seen at the top right in title colour text

I have an XBox One controller so don't need this information for that one. It would be useful to have this for another XBox controller or Logitech controllers, or any others in common use.

Thanks
Last edited by Scawen, .
Scawen
Developer
OK, I've fixed that in a way that should handle all possible ways that could happen (the state where you can't press T to start a chat box, because a previous chat box was incorrectly terminated).

If you find any other ways to reproduce it, do let me know and I'll check that it is covered by the new fix.

Thanks.
Scawen
Developer
Quote from cargame.nl :I can easily reproduce this report; https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/89368-pit----chat----join

Thanks, good find. Pit then press ENTER and T at about the same time, that gets you into the state where T no longer starts a message box.

I see why this happens and should be able to protect against it. I wonder what other cases could cause the same problem. It seems a bit unlikely that every time someone got this bug, then had pressed ENTER and T at the same time in the garage...

I'll try to fix it in a way that fixes all cases, but would like another test case to check it.

Quote from Abone :im on my work i cant test 6N2.i dont know if everyone talk about this problem in 6N,but sometimes in online practice i cant writing in chat, i press "T" and LFS dont open box for writing menssage,just after relog i can writing again.i dont remember if this happen after press shift+S,shift+P or press any key by mistake.

Quote from BADLVBOY :or did it happen when you pressed CTRL + SHIFT !?!
Happens to me a lot, since im checking people usernames, just press the same combo again and all good

I think these are different bugs.

I think Abone's one is the same as the one above, something to do with unexpectedly terminating a chat box. The chat box does not exit properly and then LFS doesn't allow you to open a new one.

BADLVBOY I think that is a case where LFS somehow has not noticed that the ctrl or shift key is no longer pressed. It shouldn't be possible normally but I would like to know how to make it happen!
Scawen
Developer
Is this a new thing you are talking about? Or an old issue? If anyone can find out how to make it happen, I will fix it.

Quote from killafilla :Hello ") same problem here, whenever this problem comes i restart the game immediately

It seems unlikely that you need to restart LFS. It sounds like CTRL or SHIFT is 'stuck' down so pressing one of those keys will get you out of the bugged state?

If this is a bug, there must be something that happens before this bug comes up. That's what we need to know...
Scawen
Developer
Hi, plenty is happening, check out the news updates. Smile

https://www.lfs.net/news/type/-2

There was a quiet time but we are doing a lot of good work now.
Scawen
Developer
Yes, Oculus did kindly send me one. Smile

I've written a few comments on reddit
Scawen
Developer
No, I'm just doing a bit more on VR then back to the tyre physics. Meanwhile, Eric is working on a new track. No time estimates for these.


EDIT: but -> bit - thanks loopingz Smile
Last edited by Scawen, .
Scawen
Developer
New test patch with improved support for Oculus 1.3 and CV1.

0.6N2: https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/89352
Test Patch 0.6N7
Scawen
Developer
EDIT : Official Version 0.6P is now available!
https://www.lfs.net/patch-6p



WARNING : THIS IS A TEST

NOTE : THIS DOES NOT CONTAIN NEW TYRE PHYSICS OR ANY NEW CONTENT

PLEASE TEST BEFORE YOU POST

PLEASE AVOID : OFF-TOPIC FEATURE REQUESTS / UNRELATED COMMENTS


Hello Racers,

Here is a new TEST PATCH : 0.6N7

- Support for the new Oculus 1.3 software and Rift CV1
- OpenVR support updated to 0.9.19
- Various improvements to controller support (see below)

0.6N7 is fully compatible with 0.6N

- You can connect online with 0.6N
- You can play replays from 0.6N

You cannot upload hotlaps made with this test patch because it is only a test patch, not an official patch.

Please keep a backup of your LFS.exe from 0.6N so you can easily go back if there are any problems.


Changes from 0.6N6 to 0.6N7 :

Translations :

Many translations updated. Thank you translators!

VR :

Default HUD field of view is now 70 degrees / HUD distance 0.5m
Improved centralisation of one-eye monitor view on desktop window
Auto-updater is avoided in VR mode and helpful options are offered
Crosshairs are always visible when watching a training replay


Changes from 0.6N4 to 0.6N6 :

VR :

Fixed an error in calculation of Rift's vertical FOV
The intro replay is avoided if LFS is started in VR mode
LFS now pauses and hides crosshairs when Rift focus is lost
OpenVR support updated to 0.9.19

Controllers :

RGT wheel should now be identified as a Thrustmaster

Misc :

Added left and right arrows to the "Look function" option
Music in setup screens is no longer enabled by default


Changes from 0.6N3 to 0.6N4 :

Controllers :

Controllers with 5 axes now default to combined brake / throttle
Combined brake / throttle axis now defaults to correct direction
Automatically set Clutch setting to axis if wheel has clutch pedal
Automatic preset is now attempted on first of multiple controllers
Controller screen in game now shows correct pedals and steer gauge
New joystick look mode using two axes to control look direction
Arrow keys can now be assigned to wheel buttons (default D-pad)
Default 900 degrees turn for Logitech G25 / G27 / Driving Force
Attempted reasonable presets for Thrustmaster and DFGT wheels
A scroll bar appears if there are more than 16 available axes
Removed axis calibration system that had various problems
You can now type in the active range of an axis function
Typed range can exceed input range to reduce axis effect
Look Roll axis function now has a full 360 degree range


Changes from 0.6N2 to 0.6N3 :

VR :

Rift headphones are now used for sound output (default setting)
Rift remote can now be used for click / escape / virtual keyboard
Improved appearance of top row (ESC / F keys) of virtual keyboard

Controllers :

Controllers may now be plugged in and detected after LFS is started
Refresh button to detect controllers in Options - Controls screen
Controllers are now sorted (not dependent on order of connection)
Separate controller type setting for with / without controllers
Automatic controls assignment for various game controllers
Warning when you press ESC to exit controller setup screen
Button functions are now easier to see when in car

Fixes :

Axis names were previously displayed wrongly in Options - Controls
It was possible to enter a state where chat box could not be opened


Changes from 0.6N to 0.6N2 :

VR :

New LFSRiftVR DLL supports Oculus 1.3 software
IPD slider movement is now detected and message displayed
Now correctly handles CV1's different up and down FOV values
User can now cause LFS to exit through the Oculus software


INSTALLATION INSTRUCTIONS :

A FULL version of LFS 0.6N must already be installed


To install the PATCH using the SELF EXTRACTING ARCHIVE :

1) Move or save the patch into your main LFS folder
2) Double click the patch to extract it to that folder
3) When you see "Confirm File Replace" select "Yes to All"
4) Now you can start LFS in the normal way

NOTE : You can see if the patch is correctly installed when you run
the program (LFS.exe). At the bottom of the entry screen : 0.6N7


DOWNLOADS :


EDIT : Official Version 0.6P is now available!
https://www.lfs.net/patch-6p



PATCH 0.6N TO 0.6N7 (SELF EXTRACTING ARCHIVE) (if you already have 0.6N) :
www.lfs.net/file_lfs.php?name=LFS_PATCH_6N_TO_6N7.exe (1.3 MB)

PATCH 0.6N TO 0.6N7 (ALTERNATIVE ZIP) (if you already have 0.6N) :
www.lfs.net/file_lfs.php?name=LFS_PATCH_6N_TO_6N7.zip (1.6 MB)
Last edited by Scawen, .
Scawen
Developer
Thanks! Got it. Smile
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG