The online racing simulator
Searching in All forums
(130 results)
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from tisy0 :In response to the question, I think there is life still left in LFS. Although yes it's mostly cruise servers that are populated. Although browsing through the server list there are still plenty of race servers for the 'cruise haters', everybody has a different view on the game.

To the people who are talking about how it takes around 2 weeks to perfect a car if you're a professional modeler. I've seen people create cars for LFS that are much higher quality compared to the models in LFS in a shorter period of time. A good example to use is the VW Scirocco, understandably there are not many people working on perfecting the car but does it really take that long to model one car? taking into consideration the other models that have been created by users. Also i'm sure that many people would voluntarily help to the progression of LFS to bring some more life into the game. I used to really enjoy playing the game in the past, but now I have found it slightly boring and it would be nice to have some new features/cars/tracks or anything for that matter.

That's exactly what i am talking about my friend.Many community members have released cars(of arguable quality ofcourse) in even less then a week in lfsmods.Some cars (bmws,nissans,golfs,hondas,toyotas,etc..) are of extremely high quality with the only thing keeping them from perfection is that they are tied to the handlings characteristics of the lfs cars they replace as you cannot add them and select them from an additional list but you must replace your current cars.

Now from the dev side of things most people here try to defend their negative view on user help with the same old cliche that they prefer quality over quantity...So come on now they need 6 years to model one car and one track ? So how much perfection there is there ? Grand turismo 200 "premium" models which are mind blowing and have around 2.000.000+ polygons on them required around 2 weeks time from professional modelers.
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from Becky Rose :Turbosquid is a rip off who only support American artists. Overseas authors are shafted and receive so little of the profit that despite getting the best sales figures of all his affiliate sites my brother found he was earning less than most of his other channels and has since quit the site in disgust after Turbosquid kept increasing his prices over his competitors citing that the quality differential meant they didnt want him being cheaper too. Good models on Turbosquid are typically 3-4 times more expensive than on other channels.

That rant aside the quality of purchased models is very inconsistent, using off the shelf media is fine for holding graphics whilst you are developing, or for set pieces or such like - but finding one that is rigged correctly for your game engine, especially when using a bespoke engine like LFS, meens there is often just as much work converting the model as getting your in house artist to make one for you.

Now the in house artists for LFS we know has produced a lot of new models but has yet to get them "perfect" enough to send them to Scawen for inclusion in the game. In any case it seems Scawen too has been struggling with low productivity because he too is distracted trying to get things "perfect" enough, so it's harldy fair to point fingers at Eric in this regard.

Regarding only have a frontwheel hatchback to race with, have you considered getting a licence for the other cars, I notice the OP account was demo - and one of the grips was not enough content...?

None-the-less after 2 or 3 years play you will most likely find yourself bored again of the extra content in S2. Mind you, that's not bad for £24 right?

I don't play LFS any more myself, after a few years of it being the only game I played I've actually gone back to not playing games again. The question isn't "what can LFS do to keep you interested after a few years play?", there's only so far that £24 will stretch afterall. The question is "What can you play afterwards that's even half as engrossing?".

Personally I turned to guitar. Sadly it cost more than £24 and i'm really struggling with the gameplay.

Hi there!.I used Turbosquid as an example and i know there are many model/texture sites out there and much much cheaper.I mentioned turbosquid as it currently has some really incredible models of my all time
favourite cars.

And 0fcourse in an engine like lfs that uses seperate files for interiors and exteriors i know there is more work to be done and its not a simple drag and drop matter,especially if you want to have realistic damage and good perfomance with lod levels.But at the same time you have to agree that the simple vertex only damage currently lfs has is the same damage that will be seen if you drag and drop a 3d model....

And about content making from what we know models and tracks are Eric's and Victor's work and there is so much high quality work that can be done from 1-2 persons only.Remember a professional modeler does need a good 1-2 weeks to finish a car so having to improve all current content to next gen hd level and making new cars and tracks needs too much time for only 1-2 persons developing only...Making contest for the community would lead to certain models been made by many people simultaneously (the best modelers will model while the best texturer's will texture them...).

And my brother owns lfs for years and he has built himself a simulator frame so there is no point for me to buy an additional license when i don't have the room space to have a sim frame myself...But i made a account to lurk in the forums myself...
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from g7usl :I really do not understand the meaning of the OP's question?

With over 8-900 multiplayer LFS sessions active, who can say it's boring now?

LFS is still the most graphically realistic game there is - Period! The scenery is faultless and the gameplay is superb. Okay some of the collision effects need to be worked on it's true but on the whole, this game has no comparison with any other on P.C.

I used GT4 for a while on a PS2 and the graphics were fantasticly real, but game consoles will always outshine those for P.C.

I'd like to see the Nordshleife in LFS and more tracks too but the code is okay for me.

The problem with adding more features would mean higher spec computers to run them with. Not everyone is flush with cash to spare to chase them. Boredom only sets in because of a lack of participation, in my opinion.

On the 'Schumie' server we have longer races and mature competition participants.
Come on over and beat me, if you can, because if you don't, you have been beaten by a 70 year old and maybe that would be too hard on you?

Long Live LFS

Well i would agree with you 6 years ago that lfs was looking quite good (especially with the community texture updates) but since then things have progressed a lot!

Have a look at rfactor with some of the best mods out there.It has better real time lighting,a better engine and there are some really sweet tracks and cars to race on.From norchliefe,rouen,spa,monza,touge tracks,barcelona,brand hatch,isle of man,slvestone,valensia,macau,pau,singapure,monaco,le mans,oran park,road atlanta to even targa florio is almost finished....

Or look at the latest gtr evo/race on from sim bin.Granded its not perfect physics wise but there are some sweet cockpit with great animations for drivers and pit crew,fantastic weather effects and some exellent ai...

And there is also netkar which while sadly very limited looks much nicer than lfs.
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from ftop :LFS Team reminds me a Unofficial Team that making a game for test, or even beta! i never see'd a Team like that! they question is, Is LFS an official game? or a beta proggram that we run and we everyday posting bugs for it? the Tittle "a blast from the past" says it all, the game now is exaclty like it was at the past ! OLD, LFS devs i thing you really need to update it ! RFactor is a really nice game! its old somehow like LFS and they now will make RFactor 2! LFS is at some Versions not even LFS S3! if you want to get people back here ! You HAVE to realease a New GAME not Version, and fix it as much as you can, by the Graphics, By the Physics and more! i play LFS 2 times by the week and some times by the Month! im pretty sure that Communitys doesn't dieing! the Game is dieing! Communitys will keep be alright because there are many defrent games to play! i agree with drifterXdk and i dont care for LFS until you release a Official version and not a beta thing..

P.S.

For the physics that i ment is not only the Vehicles handling.. is all the game.

I cannot agree more with your view my friend.I remember lfs from before even the s1 days and in the beginning it showed incredible promise.When lfs s2 was released back in 2005 in was ahead of many many things compared to other games.It had probably the best physics in my book(Now netkar pro and somehow also gtr evo/race on feels better) ,decent graphics,nice car range and great tracks along a exremely customizable interface and smooth netcode.

But now we are into 2011 and the last six year besides physics and some community texture improvements lfs has stayed in limbo with the only thing the devs keep mentioning is the god forsaken scirocco and rockingham track....What about of a new render engine ? What about of better lighting with hdr,bloom and soft shadows? What about of weather effects ? What about of animated pit crews,spectators 3d trees and larger patches of grass ? What about of nicer real looking models of the real cars lfs takes from ? What about more tracks and maybe so road tracks too ?

Its a pity the devs didn't use the incredible talent found in the lfs community like in lfsmods .

Rfactor 1 was initially horrible but nowdays its almost the only game i still play...Gtr evo/race on has some sweet weather effects and great ai.Rfactor 2 is just around the corner.Even netkar has started to show some signs of promice.(Kunos added weather effects,an incredible hillclimb and some new cars along a few updated to rfactor level community tracks)
Is there life left in lfs ?
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Before you burn me on the stake i am not here to bash the game for god's shake.It was great news when we received in december the progress report so even if the worst were to happen at least we are finally getting the new ultra realistic physics along a new track or two and a car or two....

But...will it be enough to resurrect the game ? I mean there is so many times you can race on a run of the mill track like rockingham and how long most people will really drive a front wheel drive hatch ?

And its great we getting ultra realistic physics but what about more ?

Graphics are ancient as the render engine still is based on dx8 and is missing real time lighting,real time reflections,hdr,bloom,3d trees/animated pit crews/spectators etc...Still there are no weather effects...

I have mentioned many times the lfsmods website were some very talented people have made a huge number of incredible looking car models .If the devs used those incredible talented people to help them upgrade the existing cars with their real version and upgrade the current tracks while they were making new ones or even let them make new tracks and choose the best in a competition to be incorporated in the main game then the game would be resurrected...But they are against this sadly...

Still they could buy ultra realistic models from 3d modeling markets like Turbosquid but i don't believe they are going to...

So what do you think ?
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from RasmusL :GG THX, I think your advertising and lfs bashing is unwanted here. Take it elsewhere, please. I'm trying to tell you nicely

Man oh man...i am not advertising anything...I just wanted to mention this underdog of a sim that nobody knows to people that love simulator games.I care about lfs but i look at other sims(nowdays i play mostly rfactor and gtr evo/race on).In any case here in the community there are a lot of incredibly talented people that want and can help the devs to improve lfs but are denied.Games like the game i mention need the help of people like that to improve and the dev(s) actually ask about people's opinions and help.
In the end if another simulator improves and become worth of actually playing everybody wins.Don't see it as enemy that's plain silly.The more simulators out there the better.
Simulators outside lfs ?
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Hi there just wanted to mention about the latest version of x-motoracing.

It is still a long way before it reaches lfs level of realism but it features some really cool features i wished lfs had...

In any case worths checking out and writing your opinions -The dev(s) really listen what people say so you can speak your thoughts of the game at
http://www.racedepartment.com/x-motor-racing/
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Well lets see how would we realize that lfs is dead...? Well s2 was released in early 2005.Now we are 1 month away from 2011 and a good 6 years of...nothing....Yes a couple of patches were released here and there but anything more substantial ? Come on now be honest to yourselves....

We had no new cars or tracks for 6 years....If the devs were more open minded about user involvement as i asked many times at least we could have remade and highly polished versions of the existing cars and tracks or even maybe a few dozen new ones that were of high quality...(or converted from rfactor)

And nowdays after purchasing gt5 i feel all is really pointless in the end of it...

Before burning me at the stake i know gt5 is too arcadish...Brain dead ai that follows a perfect line ignoring themselves and you and constantly playing bumper cars with them it really harms it a lot.Add the laughable damage(they toned down damage a lot to the point you need to crash multiple times at 150 miles to have even a fender dislodge itself...)
Add the incocistentment of 200 good looking cars with cockpits versus 800 without one and looking abysmal and the game really is messed up...


But in the end the good probably outweight the bad ones for me at least...

There i have all the cars i ever liked with interesting descriptions,some look actually out of this world with some great looking cockpits and a great usage of the ps3 camera's face recognition to move around the cockpit like having a track ir...

Then through most tracks are horrible some are mind blowing....Monako,le mans,norcheliefe,monza,madrid,rome,tokyo downtown look and feel incredible...

Great sound effects and music and some incredible weather effects too..

And you know something ? With a decent wheel and everything turned off (You have to turn off some aids twice as when you go in the race screen just before starting to race abs gets enabled to low(1) and sometimes even the traction control too..-i think i is done for the cars that actually have those aids...or maybe its a bug...)
The driving feels quite realistic ...

So why i even bother with lfs ?
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from skywatcher122 :To justasimfan: I just remember Scawen said on LFS it must be generated as racing simulation not screenshot generator LFS is generic when it comes to PC Graphics its not their major thing to set it up LFS Reacts like real Tyre Physics and some other things not Graphically Matters here

As i said before why you are stack with the concept of either Graphics OR Physics ??

Technology the last few years has evolved at an incredible rate to the point where an average computer runs lfs at 500 + fps....(mind you the human eye barely notices any difference over 60 fps and you need a capable monitor that has a high refresh rate.)


And i always laugh when i hear the term "Screenshot generator "

Its probably among the oldest and more commonly used excuses for inadequate graphics....

And again as i said before 5+ years ago when s2 was released was actually pretty good looking for its time.It wasn't "OmG!! " stuff but it was nice never the less.Some nice physics based head movement along some nice cockpits ,large grids,interesting tracks,tyres flying when hitting tyre walls and some interesting vertex deformation were at that time making a very solid looking game.

But nowdays no matter how you put it the graphics are looking very dated.
And yes there are some nice high res textures from Lynce and Electric Car that improve the game but still the truth is that it looks dated.The dx8 render is missing shaders effects and bloom/hdr lighting effects.Shaders are crusial to have "warm tarmarc","wet reflecting tarmarc ",real time reflections,metallic surfaces actually looking like metal etc...
Then there are effects like normal mapping that is a better bumpmapping texture effect that makes surfaces appeal that they have depth.
And the difference some bloom and hdr lighting does is like night and day...

You don't need dx11 or even dx10 to archieve the above effects.Dx9 is more than adequate for the above effects.And no the game will still run at 300+ fps on a decent computer.As much as i love fls and it still has the second best handling(the best in my opinion is netkar pro) it is surpassed on many levels but newer sims like the recent gtr evo/race on combo,rfactors latest mods(with real feel) and i can only imagine how it will compare against the upcoming rfactor 2 and Gtr 3 .....
Last edited by justasimfan, .
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from JazzOn :No problem
Sure it doesn't matter much, but in regards of simfan's "point", I was just wondering what he meant with LFS being far ahead. Maybe you can enlighten me in this regard?

+1, eyecandy is the last thing LFS needs, and every moaning about that is a waste.

JazzOn 5+ years ago when s2 was released it featured vertex deformation on cars (something that was featured for first time in carmageddon 2 and later first time in a sim in viper racing in 1998....) -Now its nothing special but it was something more than other sims at that time.

Also little details like good physics head movement in cockpits,bouncing tire walls,large grids made it a very solid sim.Also all other sims used dx8 or even dx7 so it didn't really matter that it used dx8.(Gtr 1 was released a little bit after s2 and had dx9 support but it didn't use neither shaders and neither bloom/hdr lighting. )

But nowdays...technology has evolved and so are other sims.All other sims nowdays use fully dx9 (shaders and bloom/hdr) .All other sims have some great cockpits and animations.All other sims feature some nice damage...Some sims even have some great weather effects that are depended on temperature,wind and humitidy...All other sims can have large grids and i could go on and on...
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Well the thing that many people here don't get is that lfs has almost remained suspended in time for around 5 years...

People have put lfs on a pedestal and feel they have to defend it for every single shortcomming and attack anybody that dares to mention things that need improving or adding.

The most common excuse is that lfs is a sim and it does not need fancy graphics or many cars or many tracks or special effects or anything for the matter....except physics...

Yet everybody forgets that the time of having to choose graphics OR physics is long gone....You can have both and there is simply no excuse of not having everything in a game to a high quality level.

And the other thing everybody forgets is that everybody keeps saying that lfs was never about graphics...

But quite the contrary in 2005 when s2 was released lfs was far ahead of its time and its competitors on many many aspects -including graphics.

I love lfs or else i would not be here and spend hours reading and writing in the forums.But this attitude that the game is perfect if you don't like it leave must stop...Instead of having people giving suggestions and asking to help the devs everybody keeps praising them and attacking anybody that talks negatively about it.

The thing is the way things go i don't know if there will be anybody actually caring about the game in 1-2 years.Lets say s3 gets released with scirroco and a few other cars and 1-2 tracks.Everybody will play the game for a month or a bit more and then everybody will forget it altogether...
The game needs a serious graphics overhaul but also a strong content addition if it is to have a future..
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from kavaari :Hmm... Rfactor had it last patch released about 3-4 years ago.... correct me if I'm wrong. Those "AAA tracks" etc are third party content.

And Yes 2.5 years is a lot, but I hope there will be more content than only one car and one track.

The real feel is a pluggin that has been updated many times to include more force feedback effects.

And yes those AAA tracks and those AAA cars are made by the rfactor community because ISI made rfactor open for user made tracks and cars.

ISI proved times and time again with rfactor that the users given a stable base can make amazing things equal if not greater than commercial products.Why not the devs here do the same ? There are some very talented people here either with sound editing,either with textures like Lynce and Electric Kar ,either with models as many modelers have shown in LFSMODS.

Why everybody here try to sidestep all the above things ?
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from smurfer :Depends on what you call 'awesome'. Some people tend to expect more quantity (not only tyre physics and what was already mentioned, but also other updates) as time goes by. They underestimate the time it can take to get a specific problem (like the tyre one) right. Since you do not directly see the math and the work that has been done, it's 'just' the tyre physics update.

If 'awesome' means a better than the already awesome tyre physics, I agree!

For god's shake people....they are supposed to be working for 2.5 years for....tire physics,one track and one car ? During the last year rfactor got a few dozen AAA tracks and cars and got improved ff with real feel(Like norchilefe,grand de turini,le mans,isle of man,new/old monza,spa,rouen,laguna seca,pau,silvestone,brand hands,sangai,detroi etc...).The upcoming rfactor 2 (by the way isi is a very small team too with Gjohn as the main programmer) has added variable weather effects(affected by temperature,wind and moisture) full dx9 effects with hdr and bloom,some fantastic driver and spectators animations,better sound,better ai,better physics(And if they manage maybe flatspots will be included also...).Iracing from a expensive turd has become a expensive sim,Gtr series get better with each installment and yes....even the bumper car grid runner called grand turismo series looks that 5 will be a true simulation.(I played the time trial and the main physics with all aids off with a g25 were quite decent.Having in mind that collition physics are improved a lot ,complete with cars getting airborne and rolling over plus that there finally is actual mechanical and visual damage means that this time gt5 will be a simulator.Add to that some incredible 1080p 60fps graphics with 3d support and some sweet cockpits-for 200 of the 1000 cars,plus some fantastic weather effects and some of the most beautifull tracks ever made for a game....)


But no no we the hardcore simmers are still waiting patiently,moving to 3 years waiting for....for 1 car and 1 track with some better physics....
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from Xenix74 :The most think i wish (of course after the update) is a Rally Car and some usefull tools like a Trackeditor (maybe only for offline first, or with Agree of the Devs for Online Races, if they are really well done, like the rest of Lfs Tracks. There are such talented people out there, they can help to grow Lfs to higher Sphere. I hope the Devs thinks about such thinks (look at rfactor there is no day boring. (the devs can decide wich is good enough for Integrate online.)

Just my opinion.

Exactly right !
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from BOSCHO :We all want the tyre physics and other content to be released but we cant do anything to speed up the process.. i think the flamers, spammers etc.. want to piss of Scawen to release the patch faster but that isnt the way.. true that the activity in lfs and lfs related sites like lfs Bulgaria is going down

Well i do NOT want the devs to release the tire patch or s3 any sooner than they have to.I dont mind if they took another 6 months or another year for the matter to be honest.

What i mind and i have told it countless of times is that a lot of people have placed lfs on a pedestal and attack anybody that dares to suggest an improvement or critique some of its shortcommings.

I do mind when the number 1 excuse i hear for everything is that the devs cannot do this or that as they are only 3 people.I know THAT.And i feel its nothing less of stunning what they have archieved so far.But instead of having people here trying to help the devs and the devs accepting that help any mention of something like this is immediately scorned...

Look other games do not stay in limbo while lfs is been developed.Just have a look how great the physics and sound of netkar are...Or how great the overall experience is in gtr evo/race on.Or the great ff of iracing or the incredible tracks and cars that were made for rfactor...

We have long past the age of choosing graphics OR physics.Or quality OR quantity...There are many ways people can help lfs.I am sure some people are talented with sound editing and some others (like Lynce and Electric kar) are great with texture work.A few others as seen in LFSMODS are great at modeling.And a lot have great ideas and suggestion to give.

We are all here because we care about lfs and i am certain many people of the above categories would be more than happy to help the devs to improve the game.I may talk about car models all the time but i believe is self explanatory on how many levels people can help the game.From better sounds(making a sound repository and choose what is best),from better models and high res texture updates,to even full blown tracks made from scratch.
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from TehPaws3D :Nope, I've played Rfactor and it sucked. Horridly.

DID you play with or without the real feel plugin ? With what wheel ?

And DID you play any of the recent AAA tracks or cars ?Any of the latest versions of Isle of man,grand de turini,le mans,norchieliefe,laguna seca,old/new monza,spa,rouen,brand hands,silvestone,macau,pau,detroit,lienz,sangai,tsukuba,suzuka,fugi,a few touge mountains ?
Have you driven the latest supra,corvette,ferraris,hondas,gallardo,lexus,mx5,skyline,silvia,trueno,historic championship ,CTDP 2006 v1.21,FS ONE, VLN 2 touring championships ?
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from TehPaws3D :I've watched quite a few videos of it, It just doesn't compare to LFS in many many ways (Dammage physics, No moving hands on wheel, Crash physics, Lag physics.. Game looks like crap in some instances)

Hehheh....So i guess all your knowledge of other racing games outside lfs is based on youtube videos ,is it not ?

Quote from TehPaws3D :
However, Sometimes the laser scanned tracks do look good, It's quantity vs quality... I prefer quality.

As i said earlier i don't like iracing because its nothing more than a money sucking scumm.But the problem is not quality !! -but the lack of any quantity! There are many tracks but most are ovals or run of the mill usa tracks.There few interesting tracks through are incredibly modeled-yet the problem is you have to pay additional fees for every single track and car in addition to a monthly fee.

-And as i said earlier the latest build is improved a LOT compared to the initial version.FF is fantastic(depending of what car you drive ,the wheel can get really heavy at slow speeds or when you lock your brakes the wheel slighly pulls either side and a lot of detail like that makes it great).Tracks look great and some texture improvements like normal mapping and hd detail textures were added.As also better lighting.Through cars still do not have any visual damage ,mechanical damage is spot on as also collition physics that have been improved a lot.Even the tire model is improved a bit as well as netcode is really smooth with lag almost none existant.

So before judging other games at least play them...

I guess you and a lot of other people when talking about rfactor have not tried it with the real feel plugin and the latest AAA tracks and cars.All you have to do is go to rfactorcentral and choose the tracks and cars with the highest scores.
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Thanx man for bringing some reason on this ultra long thread...Its really frustrating when most of the people here instead of suggesting things to be improved in lfs and ways of make those suggestions feasible in realistic ways they are mostly here to "defend lfs" from anybody daring to speak anything that on their mind destroys the idolized podium they have put lfs on...
A physics update no matter if it is even better then netkar's physics is not enough to bring new life in lfs or to even hold the current population.
Games like rfactor have come a long way since they were released with some greatly improved ff with real feel and some amazing tracks and cars to drive.The upcoming rfactor 2 details are nothing less than stunning if they become reality.And even the latest version of gtr evo/race on is great fun.Not as perfect on physics as lfs but there are so much more thing happening on those games.From incredible cockpits,great weather effects and really good ai for offline races.And a ton of great tracks and cars to download (basically some of the better ones for rfactor were converted for gtr evo/race on).About gtr 3 ?I can only imagine.And even the....don't laugh..infamous gt5...I know everybody will think meh....arcade s@%....Heheheh...
But seriously now i had a chance to play a couple of months back the time trial demo and it was much better than prologue as far as the main driving physics and feel go.And from the looks of it the final game coming in november will actually have some decent physics when all the aids are turned off and,some sweet weather effects and finally ai and damage implemented...
I even tried the current build of iracing at a friend and while i still believe its a money sucking scumm ,the truth is that it has evolved a lot the last 2 years.
And now back on lfs ...Where is lfs going ? Only 3 people can do only so much i know...But with some help a lot more could have been archived...There are so many things that lfs is lucking like ancient render system,dated graphics,absence of weather effects,not enough content....etc...
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from MadCatX :Reducing the size of a texture is not a trivial operation if you want the result to look good. And here we're talking about 2D space. Doing the same in 3D is much more complicated and reducing some 1.5M+ poly model to some 30k poly model by hand could actually take more time than creating a new low-poly model from scratch. And as CodieMorgan already explained, finishing a 3D mesh of an object is where the real work begins.

BTW, I haven't seen any XFG, FZ5 or XRR models in the TurboSquid shop, so I guess your whole idea is to replace these with something similar. No offense, but this is stupid on so many levels. We like our cars and we've known them for years, I certainly don't want them to entirely change shape overnight. Also changes of bodywork should affect how the car behaves, so replacing the model and leaving the physics as it is would feel like a slap in the face of those who actually give a crap about physics.



Can someone please close this thread now?

I know that you cannot simply drag and drop a high polygon finished model in a game before in that case you would live everybody with older computers behind.New graphics cards can handle easily such loads but thats not the point.Definitely some work would need to be done to make simplier polygon models so you can have different LOD levels in the game.

But i hold on tight on my belief that the amount of work needed to simplify models are much much less than actually the time needed to make a model from scratch.

The real cars lfs cars are based from are a 911,a mitsubishi starion,a fiat punto,a celica gt4,a honda dc2 integra,a mini and a lotus super 7(caterham). There are incredible versions of those cars and if you leave the name to the fictionals name already exist(Or use names like conda tegra,celca gt4,etc...) and change the badges(so instead of a prancing horse you have a prancing goat for example) everything is ok.
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from CodieMorgan :You dont have any clue about game development


And - no - most Turbo Squid car models - are not shown in real time renders.



Lol - a week? Impossible if you want that level of detail.... AND make it work in game...


$40,000 a year? The US-Army pays you more than that - even as a E0 to E4 ranks it is possible....
Hell u can get a sign up bonus of 20K to 40k anyhow... just ask your local recruiting office.... No need to talk bullshit about an industry that is far more complicated than you think.

1: Base model
2: test
3: model it more
4: test and compare to concepts or base, fix rat nests in mesh, remove excess detailing
5: model until 'mesh' is finished
6: LOD implementations - or LOD detailing in mesh - optimizations
7: UVW unwrapping, textureing
8: creating textures when tested unwraps are right
9: additional textures for Shine,Ref, Normals Mapping, etc......

10: IK a and suspension animation linking ( 3D Modeller's Job )
--- suspension animated mesh works correctly? Mesh breaks?
--- animated doors?
--- non-hinged animation bits?

11: constant in game model tests - and game editing tools testing of 3d models

This takes more than "a week"....

If the models is for a Licensed Ferrari - you will likely have to go back - weeks or even months later - to adjust the mesh and textures for anything that doesn't match the real car - especial when they enforce that as part of an agreement.



You definitely don't know what u are talking about.

Only the larger game development companies have Hollywood Budgets, some even get sponsorships.

90% of all game developers & designers have average , or less than average income after costs.

Licensing labels and permissions often are not "royaltie free" - EG: Toyota could allow their cars into GT5 - but would require Sony to pay them for using the label, and car labels. If the devs dont have a licensing agreement - people get sued.

About the money i am speaking don't forget i am talking in Europe where to put it frankly we are f$%%$....Still people pass by ok (our generation) but 15 years ago everybody had their own house ,where now everybody at best has his own appartment.In a few years everybody will just have enough money to rent an appartment....

(Btw for 40.000 a year you are willing to go to iraq and kill for companies/get killed/maimed ?????? -i thought you get a lot of money and an early retirement..... )

Anyway back on the main subject!

Licencing can easily bypassed by simply changing each car names(leave the same names we have now fxo,rb4,xr etc..) and change the brand badges .

As for the models themselves how difficult is to simplify a model ? Simply reduce the polygon number...
The same with textures...I mean you can have 4096x4096 textures simply converted to lower resolutions in seconds with photoshop....
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from Michalxo :My "shitty" laptop cost 1000€ so stop writing here stupid things.
Stop telling things of which you have no idea. You live *only* in UK. Come live and work to central europe. Then release some facts about it.
Electronics here is not cheap at all. Get more facts before insulting other people.

I am not saying anything about not getting graphics better. I just want be able to play it as I can now. Relatively fluently. (I can survive mass start "lagging")
(Toshiba A200 1gs in 2007 was high-end machine)

I am not going to react on you anymore, cause you live in UK's reality not mine.
-- over --

Michalxo Electronics are expensive here too.I always buy most parts from ebay.With 1000 euro you can built a monster gaming system as i told you with a high end I7 ,6 gb of ddr3 and the monstrous GTX 480 .With that you will play LFS with 700 + Frames per second...Well unless you buy the 500 euro Zalman tft you will not actually see drawned more than 60-70 frames....


If you payed 1000 euro for your computer you made a few serious mistakes and that is your fault not anyone's else.

1-To begin with know that laptops are ALWAYS twice the price a desktop pc cost for having the same level of equipment.

2-If you buy a laptop/desktop from ebay instead from an actual shop you can buy it at least 40% cheaper .(Always buy with pay-pal)

3-NEVER EVER go near a toshiba !! (They never have graphic cards on their laptops....even their expensive models usually have only a intel/ati motherboard integraded solution.....) -And thats why your shitty laptop cannot run anything..............I search toshiba sattelite models and not even newer models have seperate video cards...

4-I can imagine what your laptop specs are but from curiosity what are they ?

5 - INSTEAD of asking for lfs to remain idle and stay with ancient graphics go search in ebay for a new DESKTOP computer.IF you have a friend that knows how to built a computer ask him if he can help you so if you buy only parts from ebay you can built a computer for even less money.
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from tinvek :exactly, if we take michalxo's argument to it's logical conclussion then we'd all still be using the first driving game i ever played

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MK_pwMItCPM


added to which LFS is currently very easy on a computer, on my pc 400 + fps compared to 95 fps on iracing, so if it is improved michalxo should be able to retain a decent frame rate just by keeping the appearence similar to what it is now

Hallelujah ! Hallelujah Amen to that ! That game can even run on my whist watch!
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from MadCatX :1) LFS has a pretty good modeler, his name is Eric
2) Games you mentioned were funded by Rockstar, Microsoft, Valve etc. Just because they were pretty expensive to develop doesn't mean all games have to be.
3) These models you're talking about over and over are not "plug and play", some serious modifications would be necessary. Moreover, even if they were put in LFS, they wouldn't look nowhere near as good as they do on the screenshots. Screenies like those take hours to render (raytracing and stuff) and LFS is not a turn-based strategy as far as I'm concerned.
4) High amount of high-detailed models available on the web indicates that creating some doesn't take as much time as it seems. Given the fact that there hasn't been a patch released for nearly 2 years I reckon that Eric would have had all cars in LFS remodeled in HQ by now if he wanted.

MadCatX I am not trying to pick a fight.I am trying to help lfs get improved but everybody here see any suggestion to their "Holy Grail" as a personal attack...Most people here have idolized lfs..And when they realize how behind it is they are going to be the first to leave.

1-FOR CHRIST SAKE you are trying to defend Eric's job !!!! For CHRIST SAKE man he is one of the devs.... And having the car models bought ready that does not mean he has nothing more to do-quite the contrary....Tracks...tracks and again tracks,animation for spectators,crews,better animations for drivers etc....

2-The games i mentioned cost MILLION of dollars a million equals to 1.000.000 dollars ok...? I am talking about spending 1.000 dollars the max 2.000.
And don't even start the-How you know they have money excuse... (20.000-30.000 s2 users multiplied by 40 dollars equals = ??? )

3-YES THEY ARE REAL TIME RENDERS...

4-Yes you simultaneously both right and wrong....You can model a high quality model in a couple of days,but if you want a full model with interior and underside you will need a good week or two.
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from Michalxo :My 3 years old laptop CAN'T run LFS even on medium details! Sometimes I get too low FPS on start. I don't have money for another laptop/desktop. So I am against this. You can use modded dlls and other nice looking "user-patches" to make your LFS look beautiful. I think that 50% of people don't own gaming machine(s) like you do.
Think about this fact and users too. Thanks

Michalxo I DO NOT OWN A GAMING MACHINE ! My computer is over 3.5 years old !!!
So please don't try to find arguments on this.You do exactly what i critisize my friend.You bought a shitty $400 from a grocery store and you expect to play games.And even worse you expect from a game to dish any improvements while all the competitors have moved miles ahead ?

I can understand people moaning 3.5 years ago when Crysis was released...And even that game wasn't as demanding really.Only if you wanted to play on dx10 you needed a gaming pc.And that was 3.5 years ago.

I have a Core2Duo E6700 oc at 3GHZ,4gb ram and a 8800gtx ultra on a 680i diamond msi.And i run lfs "The hardcore killer as the people i described here say" at 1920x1200 at full detail (AND YES Michalxo i have also the Lynce high res textures installed-And YES i know about LFSMODS i talked about making a contest so people can make super detail models countless of times....) with a 16 car grid at OVER 200 fps.....!!!!

-For CHRIST SAKE the human eye can barely notice any difference over 60 fps.(And you need a fricking $ 800 Zalman 120hz 3d tft to actually have more screens displayed....for that almost unnoticed improvement)

-You can build or buy a Intel I7 with a decent video card like a gtx285/ati 57xx from Ebay for $1000 .And that will get you around -/+ 400 frames per second..... Enough ? Want more frames ? With $1500 you get a GTX 480 and around -/+ 700 frames per second.......

-And Even if you don't have $1000 you can built something better than my computer for around $600 if you don't mind using an athlon and an ati card.And that will get you easily OVER 200 fps...

So please stop trying to hold lfs back.Lfs has started to show its age.If it is not improved it will be left behind.And the people here that attack anybody that tries to suggest ways to improve lfs are the first that are gonna jump the ship when they see what the competition has accomplissed.
justasimfan
Demo licensed
Quote from IceMan31x :.... all sounds great and all... but seriously, who the hell in thier right mind would spend nearly $2000 dollars for sim cars? lol im sorry but if i was willing to spend that much on a sim game, i have more real life racecar stuff to buy, not virtual cars that look like renders... nice work.. but way to over the top! Devs keep it up your doing just fine!

Well almost every single game out there for those that don't have a clue about game design cost dozen of thousands of dollars to make and some even cost hundreds or even millions of dollars.You think 2000 dollars to update all the cars in a game and add a couple more if a lot ?It's a steal.Turbosquid as some other 3d marketplaces uses content people created so everybody sort of wins.Some money go to the site,some to the original creator(who will get multiplay sales for each model) and a lot of money and time is saved by the people that use those models and assets.

A "proffetional game designer "-somebody that has worked on previous games or has attended a gaming university may ask 30-40.000 dollars a year to work on a game.Even the best designers need a week or two to model a car with that level of detail.Modeling 2 dozens would require around a year of work....

But with 1000-2000 $ you can have them immediately and that would only leave the physics to be tweaked by the devs.

Just to understand how incredible game development costs can be take a look here :
http://techgage.com/news/top_1 ... e_game_development_costs/
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG