Quote from srdsprinter :

like i said. look at the detail of the bf1 and new interiors, they blew everything previously done out of the water. Im sure it took longer that previous cars/interiors. If every lfs car has the interior details of the formula cars, i'd be pretty happy. If their is something new up his sleeve, id be thrilled.

IMO the BF1 could use some work actually. The interior looks nice, but as far as the car model is concerned I feel the FO8 looks more finished. The FO8 is the most complete looking car imo. It has details other cars are simply missing. For instance the FO8 has mounting points for the suspension whereas the suspension on the FOX and BF1 just goes right through the body work. They're little things and most people probably don't notice or care, but I care about details But I agree most other cars need more work to be up to par.

As I've understood after following LFS from the start the three man team doesn't have a 3D engine coder. It's not Eric and it's not Scawen. The engine we are using at the moment was coded by someone else.

I feel sure whatever Eric makes next will have plenty more cowbell

Well I'm sure we will see the fruits of Eric's labours sooner of later. However, given the timescales I can understand why people are starting to ask questions.

To put it into perspective, S1 was released in June '03. S2 full Alpha was released in June '05, more or less 2 years dead to produce S2. It's now coming up for June '07, so in a months time the same amount of time will have passed as took Eric to produce the entire S2 content, and in that time, we have seen 1 car, 2/3 cockpits and some new kerbs/bollards at Aston.

So it's simply inconceivable that there isn't a whole pile of unreleased content just waiting for the right moment. I guess it wont be an equivalent 2 years work as those 2 prior to S2 release, due to moving house etc. and perhaps a moments resting on the laurels, but it should be a significant chunk of work nonetheless.

Quote from aaltomar :

As I've understood after following LFS from the start the three man team doesn't have a 3D engine coder. It's not Eric and it's not Scawen. The engine we are using at the moment was coded by someone else.

? I highly doubt this is true, do you have anything to back that up?

Quote :

I still don't understand how "not saying anything to the users" is a good marketing thing.

Should every person who works at the company be an official spokesperson, or should the company have an appointed spokesperson who deals with press & community. In LFS' case, Scawen has made tonnes of posts. The fact that Eric is silent does not mean that he does not care what we think.

Well, would be great if had a tiny progress report and maybe, just maybe, a teaser pic of whats going on when the patch X hits the main page.

You have to wait for patch Y, patch X won´t bring those changes. Scawen made a post some time before, but I don´t want to search it now

Quote from Becky Rose :

Should every person who works at the company be an official spokesperson, or should the company have an appointed spokesperson who deals with press & community. In LFS' case, Scawen has made tonnes of posts. The fact that Eric is silent does not mean that he does not care what we think.

Maybe we should appoint the biggest fanboy of LfS to Developer's spokesman too...

Quote from Becky Rose :

Should every person who works at the company be an official spokesperson, or should the company have an appointed spokesperson who deals with press & community. In LFS' case, Scawen has made tonnes of posts. The fact that Eric is silent does not mean that he does not care what we think.

I'm not saying he doesn't care what we think. I'm saying he doesn't bother telling us what he's working on, and that, whatever anybody can come up with, is not a good marketing strategy.

Quote from Becky Rose :

That man is the epitome of everything that is wrong in the mainstream computer games industry.

How is John Carmack the epitome of what's wrong in the industry? Doesn't that statement first assume that you know exactly what is wrong with the computer games industry and secondly that you know John Carmack represents exactly that?

Quote :

To create game ready 3D artistry is a skill that only a tiny proportion of 3D graphics artists are capable of doing,

And programming a fully functioning multiplayer racing sim is a skill an even SMALLER proportion of programmers are capable of doing. Trying to make a comparison of skill in separate fields just doesn't make sense. Besides you said yourself, a small group of people could replicate Eric's work in a short time, even if it wasn't exactly the same quality it would at least be comparable. You think it would easier for that small group to replicate Scawen's work? Hardly.

I'd take Kegetys' Mcgyver over Eric's BF1 any given day

Or Eric's Mc..laren...?

Quote from boosterfire :

I'm not saying he doesn't care what we think. I'm saying he doesn't bother telling us what he's working on, and that, whatever anybody can come up with, is not a good marketing strategy.

This is nothing to do with a marketing strategy. Those of us who have already brought an S2 license did so because the game, although still in alpha stage, is good enough to have enormous fun with for many 100s of hours of playtime. And no new players are going to buy an S2 license on the promise made by a few screenshots of what Eric may or may not have been working on. Any new customers will surely buy an S2 license if and when Eric's work get included in a patch, and not before.

I don't know about anyone else, but I brought an S2 license in the full knowledge that the game was in an alpha state, and that there *might* be more content to come. I did not expect (nor do I demand) constant updates as to what the devs might be working on, or any future direction of the LFS project. That Scawen continues to knock patches out is 'only' a welcome added bonus. That we don't know what Eric has been working on (if anything) is neither here nor there for me. I paid my money because the content when I brought S2 was enough to justify the fun I have had (and would continue to have, even if LFS development stopped). Anything to come is a bonus as far as I am concerned.

These petty demands to know what Eric has been doing are unjustified and unhelpful imo. If he starts to release screenshots, then there will be no nice suprise, and it will only increase the pressure of demand for the new content, when it's going to come sooner or later anyway. No one has the right to demand insights into the development process of the codebase or the content. Enjoy what what you have now, enjoy the community, and bask in the knowledge that LFS in its current state is better than anything else out there on the market, and that there's (probably) more to come at some point in the future.

Quote from bbman :

Maybe we should appoint the biggest fanboy of LfS to Developer's spokesman too...

would you really want progress reports chockfull of weirdness by some portuguese guy ?

Quote from boosterfire :

I'm not saying he doesn't care what we think. I'm saying he doesn't bother telling us what he's working on, and that, whatever anybody can come up with, is not a good marketing strategy.

From the S1 days we know that Eric's progress leads Scawen's releases by months to years. The FOX was ready way before S2's release.
If you'd look into Eric's PC today you'd propably find many cars that won't be released within the next few years. Some day the devs tested the kart-class in LFS, and I'm sure Eric came up with something so they could look at the bike-car-class Scawen implemented for testing. There are propably also car-parts around that will be necessary once the damage model is improved. A LMP car must also be in some stage of development since groundeffect will come some day.
That doesn't mean we'll see any of this within a reasonable timeframe. A concept-drawing of the FOX would've been misleading in 2003. A screenshot of Eric's current work would be misleading now.

That said, I'd like teaser-shots like before S2. Just to know what's coming within the next two months.

Vain

Quote from Vain :

From the S1 days we know that Eric's progress leads Scawen's releases by months to years. The FOX was ready way before S2's release.

not too long ago scawen posted that eric is not working on s3 content yet

Quote from Shotglass :

would you really want progress reports chockfull of weirdness by some portuguese guy ?

YES!

Quote :

Originally Posted by aaltomar
As I've understood after following LFS from the start the three man team doesn't have a 3D engine coder. It's not Eric and it's not Scawen. The engine we are using at the moment was coded by someone else.

Quote from joen :

? I highly doubt this is true, do you have anything to back that up?

I'd love to back it up but the comments describing the birth of the 3D engine are buried and perhaps lost, you would need to find the comments Scawen made about the engine from the time period when the first playable demo was released and we were all more than hyped about it in 2002.

If Scawen happens to read this thread he just might comment about it, but I think this thread doesn't hold much interest to him. My not so exact memory tells me it was someone who they knew from Lionhead.

Quote from aaltomar :

My not so exact memory tells me it was someone who they knew from Lionhead.

Unless it was "early contributors" Dickson Roberts, Mark Healy, Alex Evans then there is no mention of this in the credtis - which I'm sure there would be.

Quote from Ball Bearing Turbo :

YES!

discounting people who display autoerotic tendencies in their avatars

Quote from Ball Bearing Turbo :

Unless it was "early contributors" Dickson Roberts, Mark Healy, Alex Evans then there is no mention of this in the credtis - which I'm sure there would be.

the ony one of these i could quickly find any proper info on is alex who appears to be a 3d demo coder that worked at lionhead at the time and seems to be the one who got vicc in touch with scawen and eric

Quote from joen :

? I highly doubt this is true, do you have anything to back that up?

Quote from Ball Bearing Turbo :

Unless it was "early contributors" Dickson Roberts, Mark Healy, Alex Evans then there is no mention of this in the credtis - which I'm sure there would be.

I think this is from the engine Scawen made which was replaced:


Edit: I'm not saying that Scawen is not capable of doing the 3D work, but the lack of actual 3d-engine upgrade suggests to me that they don't have an expert in the house to do an overhaul.

Quote from XCNuse :

Not so fast now, these threads inspire new ideas.

I'm not kidding either.

...and you wanted to close it.Over 4000 views

Quote :

However, graphically we are lacking a lot of effects - these will be addressed later

Thats what Eric mentioned over 3 years ago but where are the effects

What little worrying me there is very little VISIBLE progress from Eric sides.IN the past there have been always small teasers in this are but somehow there is none in last few months.

I understand the problems with moving the house but LFS need these 3D upgrades,effects,hi-res textures.etc a lot.If the next update in this area would be really small then this would be first time I would say that something wrong is happening with the progress of LFS.I started practically with the first public demos so maybe its too long time me with LFS :lovies3d:

Regarding the 3D engine I remeber reading a long time ago from Scawen that he had some friend who helped him with the 3D engine.I think this is the area where has been done last few years practically nothing.Somebody should start thinking about it...:rolleyes:

Quote from aaltomar :

I think this is from the engine Scawen made which was replaced:

Don't be fooled by that screenshot. The reason it looks so old is the fact, that there is no texture mapping. Add textures, lighting and a higher poly car model and it would probably look like the early v0.04 screenshots.

And please don't think that Eric built the S2 tracks in just a year after the S1 release. In fact he was working on Aston at least since mid 2002, so that's three years for that track!

Well it's not the only "first" screenshot I've seen just one that was readily available. Consider also the fact that the core 3d-engine hasn't got an update in five years. And there has been very little info of anything related to upgrading the engine, no development shots, nothing. It's still DX8. And what Eric does is "art", he's not responsible for the rendering. I remember seeing this "Porsche" mockup and the geometry and engine in general looked way different than just being without textures.

I've poured through a lot of LFS related articles and there's very little info on the 3d-engine itself or the development of it. Scawen will correct this if he deems it to be false...