Yeah, admittedly the HRTs haven't been that graceful under blue flag conditions.
Yeah, admittedly the HRTs haven't been that graceful under blue flag conditions.
and similar things were said about Hamilton in Monaco....
point being there is ample evidence to suggest Button should be rewarded with penalties.
If he isn't then there is a suggestion that the stewards really are on a Hamilton witchhunt. If he is then the stewards are basically outlawing normal racing etiquette. Both are bad,
That puts a very different spin on it. I'm not sure today's incidents were clear cut at all.
Alonso didn't turn into Jenson taking a normal line though did he? He gave him room and took an outside line and Jenson was going too fast to avoid him and take a tighter line. I agree it should be a racing incident like hamilton and webber, but that doesn't stop it being Hamiltons fault.
Why do people keep comparing Button's accidents to those happened with Hamilton in Monaco?!
Hamilton dived down the inside in Monaco. Button was alongside Alonso the entire time. It was nothing like Monaco. The only accident that is similar to Button/Alonso collision was the Hamilton/Webber collision at the start, only there was enough room for both Hamilton and Webber through that corner if Hamilton didn't ran wide. So if Hamilton didn't get a penalty for that, then neither should Button.
No he did not. But by trying to go into the chicane with Jenson side by side, the odds are they are going to come together at that corner at that speed at that angle. It was no one's fault. Alonso could have avoided it, but he took the risk. Period.
There's a big difference between both incidents.. Hamilton took a dive down the inside in Monaco. Button was fully alongside and braked a little less than Alonso.
... so Alonso should be penalised? See where I'm going here.
The whole concept of a 'racing incident' doesn't exist any more and it's become a farce.
The whole concept of a 'racing incident' doesn't exist any more and it's become a farce.
No, Alonso gave enough space, Button did what he could to avoid the incident as well but their efforts were in vain. Therefore it's a racing incident.
If they are going to give out penalties, they should ban overtaking.
Seeing Hamilton and Button drive amuses me more than watching Vettel gaining 1 second a lap.
They fight because they have to, which is great to see, you shouldn't give penalties to that.
If so, you will get boring races where one will overtake another gently by using DRS+KERS.
Look at Webber passing Hamilton, was that any fun?
Was there any kind of sensation in that?
Great job by Jenson, he deserves it.
hm when did I ever say Alonso should be penalised?
Webber squeezed hamilton pretty tight into T1 but alonso gave buttocks plenty of room. Plus hamilton was at least side by side with webber. Button barely had his front next to alonso's rear tire. The reasons for each collision are different. Both imho still just racing incidents.
They weren't side by side in the chicane.
Thanks for the links 
I turned in on "that's not pretty is it"
I turned in on "that's not pretty is it" When Webber saw that Hamilton was coming, he steered away.
How can you expect someone to go for that gap.
It only went wrong because of understeer of Hamilton.
You cannot blame Webber there.
Also, you seem to have mixed up something, Hamilton was not side by side with Webber.
And Button WAS side to side with Alonso.
Even Martin Brundle and DC said during the commentary that Webber gave Hamilton plenty of room. Hamilton understeered into Webber.
http://i.imgur.com/np1Ew.jpg
I don't think you can get anymore side by side than this. Alonso was always going to come (or crash) out of the chicane first since Jenson was taking a much tighter line hence slower speed.
Why did Jenson hit his rear wheel then if he was side by side with him THROUGH the chicane?
Because he was slowing down to try to avoid an incident? While Alonso let go of the brakes to carry more speed around the outside.
I remember an onboard from Alonso's car and you can hear that he lifts off the brakes before Jenson to carry more speed on the outside, thats kinda why.
Just because button was next to alonso at turn in does not make button innocent. Alonso gave him tons of room, was ahead of of button already at apex and at the time of impact alonso was way past button. Button hit alonso from behind. Failed passing attempt but shit happens.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVF8r075Kuc
As with hamilton/webber. See the video. Hamilton has his nose at least on the webber's helmet at turn in, at apex and after the turn. It was the usual webber driving. Always fully on the grey area when defending. Webber simply drives like hamilton wasn't there. Hamilton even manages to slow down the car even after going over the kerb.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTBysfNgSJI
Because of physics. Jenson had to take a tighter line through the corner, hence lower corner exit speed.
Jenson had 2/3 of his car alongside Alonso in mid-corner. Alonso did gave Button enough room for corner entry and mid-corner. But Alonso didn't expect Button to have as much grip as he did (or Alonso didn't go as fast as he thought he would be), so Alonso took a slightly tighter line which didn't give Button enough room for corner exit.
41.4 Whilst the race is suspended :
- neither the race nor the timekeeping system will stop, however, in accordance with Article 5.3 the length of the race suspension will be added to the maximum two hour period ;
sauce: http://www.formula1.com/inside ... regulations/8690/fia.html
Figured. :P
Also, why do people keep having sterile and never ending arguments on incidents of this kind?
Most of the F1 "fans" are agreeing on the fact that the stewards are generally penalise too much and too harshly for banal racing incidents that occur in most single seaters races(and generally do not have a huge influence on most of the race results), but yet internet boards are filled with discussion on them? I don't get it.
Wasn't really aiming on you in fact, more like a general notice :P
I am kinda tired of arguing about this lol. I have said all i have to say. So I am out. Later guys.
FORMULA 1 GRAND PRIX DU CANADA 2011 (Montreal)
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