Quote from Shotglass :

i think what youre suffering from is called cognitive dissonance

Everyone is suffering from it when we talk about death sentence.

Quote from The Moose :

The death sentence can never be the right way.

You cant condemn murderers on one hand then agree that murdering someone as a punishment is fine. And that's what the death penalty is, no matter how you want to dress it up...it's state sanctioned, pre-meditated murder.

I don't think anyone is dressing it up in any way.

So what does that make prison then? State sanctioned, pre-meditated kidnapping is fine then? Going with that idea any punishment from any crime is wrong because it is always just tyranny and "morally wrong" to do such things to people.

Why exactly life long kidnapping and disconnection from society, friends and relatives is some how fine but death sentence isn't? What exactly makes one better from another? Is there even such huge difference between the two?

Quote from The Moose :

The cost to taxpayers is a complete non argument imo. It's a moral question.. do we lower ourselves to the level of these criminals? Do we become murderers for the sake of revenge? Surely we have moved on as a species. We are better than them. Let's act like it.

In the end the price to taxpayers may be measured in lives when the released breivik decides to do his thing again.

You make the argument from opposition sound like they just want revenge. An eye for an eye. When it is in fact all about incapacitation. Death sentence is nothing more than little more extreme case of incapacitation compared to life long prison sentence.

When someone does something horrible the society must make sure he does not do it again. It has nothing to do with punishing or retribution. It is about incapacitation.

Quote from Racer Y :

I also notice a lot of people that are pro-choice are against the death penalty and a lot of pro-lifers are all for executing criminals.

Lots of people who are pro-life have at least once in their lives travelled in train.

Personally I used to think that long sentences are better than death sentences because the way I thought death sentence is actually the easier solution for the guilty. But after that I've learned more about the justice system and what are its purposes. Sentences have basically 5 different purposes:
Retribution
Deterrence
Denunciation
Incapacitation
Rehabilitation
Reparation


Now personally I try to use logic and facts and remove any ideologies when I try think about this. I don't think retribution should have any place in modern justice system. I think incapacitation is the most important aspect of sentencing. Removing a dangerous individual from the society. But I also think rehabilitation is very important which is why removing from society is problematic. Of course the point where to draw the line is difficult as well. Where does rehabilitation become ineffective?

One of the reasons american justice system has higher recidivism rates than UK is the different focus. UK system tends to focus more on rehabilitation. So while rehabilitation has indeed helped to reduce crime and is indeed effective one also needs to remember that the cases we are focusing now are the most serious ones. The ones that either get long prison sentences or even death penalties in other countries.

I've not yet come across any study which says that in the case of most serious crimes (like mass murders) the rehabilitation could actually do its job. Which at the moment leaves the long prison sentence as the only option. I think death sentence should be one of the tools of the justice system. I don't think there are any good reasons why it should not be used. Most of the reasons against death sentence are just ideological. We should not kill. Well we should not kidnap and imprison people either. The way I see it it is just double standard to say long prison sentences are fine but death sentence isn't.

The way I see it death sentence is the most extreme form of punishment for the most extreme cases. It is the most extreme form of incapacitation and it is also extremely effective.

I think we should acknowledge the fact that we can not heal or cure everyone. Rehabilitation is a great tool that works but not 100%. Sometimes you just have to put the society in front of individual. I think it is fair point that a person can become too dangerous for the society. And once that happens the society needs to use the more deadly tools to protect itself.

So in essence I'd say Breivik is too dangerous to live. We need a sure way to incapacitate him and prevent him from killing more. Death sentence does just that.

Quote from Intrepid :

Look, I naturally side on the liberal side of the debate.

Which makes it even stranger. First you call people who have abortion killers and murderers. You make the claim that abortion is killing of humans. But then you say you're on the side of pro-abortion! And then you manage to make it even worse by claiming that you only want serious and respectful discussion when your starting point is that those parents who for various reasons may have needed abortion are just killers and murderers who do not apparently even understand the seriousness of the abortion operation and need some bible bashing martial arts people to remind them they are killers and murderers and then have a discussion about it.

Quote from Intrepid :

Why is abortion such a hot topic? I think it's as valid a topic as anything else as we are talking about the actual life of a human being.

So you think the aborted fetuses are in fact living humans? Maybe you should actually use some google to figure out how "living" the fetuses are at the moment of abortion. For example check what the acceptable abortion weeks are and at what stage the fetus is at that time.

Personally I find it almost shocking how some very basic ideas are still being "discussed" today in modern world. Abortion is just one thing but sexual equality, drug policies, stem cell study, the use of contraceptives and a whole lot of other things are so strongly tied to illogical and plain harmful ideologies and delirious religious interpretations and to the down right disastrously harmful need for maximum control about what people can and should do.

I just find it shocking that we still have people who think we should "discuss" about abortion for example. What's there to discuss? We already know that abortions save lifes, improve the living standards and status of women. The upsides by far outnumber the negatives. Yet we should still discuss about it? Should we discuss about the legality of the use of contraceptives as well? Or is them being legal nowadays already common sense even to the most ardent ideological preachers?

Got the arty thing done. That tank killing 3 arties is going to be really really hard!

Quote from Bean0 :

Easy except for...

The battles must have at least 4 SPGs in each team.

Which very rarely happens.

Well... Half of my battles in obj212 have at least 4 SPGs per side. I think it is relatively easy to get if you have t7 or t8 arty tbh. The other one is pretty difficult though.

I almost had this in my obj212. Too bad the other team only had 3 SPGs. My glorious double kill was wasted Need to play more games with arty though.

Not sure if this makes good gameplay for high tier tanks to have these kind of competitions .

Well here is easy 1000 gold:
http://worldoftanks.eu/news/3600-behind-lines/

To win as artillery, you must destroy 3 or more tanks.
To win as a tank, you must destroy 3 or more artilleries.
...
Each valid entry will be rewarded with 500gold

Quote from Funnybear :

Heel/Toe is just another technique in the quiver of the drivers skills. When your coming in somewhere hard and fast and you wanna drop straight down a couple of cogs then you need to do it just to save the engine and give yourself beter control in braking. But if your in a long sweeper then heel and toeing might unsettle the car with torque pull or wheel locking/spinning. You'd make your own judgements when to use it, just as you would with left foot braking, handbraking, looking out the window, checking your hair in the mirror, giving that cute girl the eye! . . . . .

You know what I mean, it's down to the driver at the end of the day.

Heel and toe does not wreck your motor or help preserve it in any way. You can ruin your motor by over revving it which you can do regardless if you heel and toe or not. Just letting the clutch up suddenly forcing the engine revs to go up (or the driven tires slow down and skid) does not hurt the engine.

The part that is taking the abuse is the drivetrain and especially clutch if you just throw in smaller gears without blipping and slide the clutch or just release the clutch very quickly.

And if you slip the clutch when downshifting then you can be smooth as well but you are also wearing he clutch. I'd imagine keeping the clutch steadily slipping while breaking in rough surfaces can be quite difficult though. And I doubt with more racing oriented clutch the slipping part is very very snappy anyways.

What heel and toe allows you to do is to downshift smoothly without wearing the clutch which makes it good technique especially for those long sweepers if you need to brake down while turning. I'd also imagine the cars being a lot more sensitive to the imbalance caused by sudden lift of the clutch on smooth tarmac than on gravel where you are not even driving the same corner hundreds of times trying to perfect it but instead you are just trying to get it right on the first try by simply eye balling it and trusting your co-driver's instructions.

Plus with four wheel driven car the effect of sudden clutch lift may be even very small with short ratio gearboxes where the difference between gears may be less than thousand rpm.

Personally I only turn the steering wheel off if there is visible steering lag. In lfs I don't mint either way but in iracing for example I must turn the wheel off because the delay is a bit confusing.

Finally installed xvm. Did not install it earlier because I wanted to make my own look but then I tested the online config creator for it and it was super easy to make it exactly like you like. You can even create own otm with the editor.

Kind of scary how many red players there are in lower tier games. And even at higher tiers it is pretty amazing how bad some people are

Anyone of you tried the new physics yet? What do you think?

Blue saw

You need to remember that drivers like Tommi and Juha started rallying with cars which pretty much required heel and toe. But then again you can get away with it on gravel so maybe they just did not learn it well.

Maybe contact your bank? Maybe your debit card has been haxxored, copied or whatever.

I think they have pretty much confirmed that there won't be complex scheduled online racing system like in iracing. And it won't be monthly payments but one time buy like lfs for example.

Wouldnt it be easier to just list all driving games that do not have cockpit view?

Cameras don't increase the steering lag. That's an old myth that simply is not true.

Personally I hate it when people say "you won't feel it when driving". Maybe I'm more sensitive to it than someone else but for me if there is steering lag I will feel it.

And not working anymore...

qr code apparently coming...

It was wowp code apparently. I put it on the wot site which means it was just burned. Don't care about wowp at all though. Just went with the code as soon as it appeard. Maybe better luck next time. My system is flawless though

Finger dexterity over
9000 reached! I got one of those codes from teh chat

You need to be really really quick now. Basically when the code comes up you need to be able to use it within minutes or you miss your chance.

Quote from Joku123 :

How did you get 600 golds? I put my email in 2 different qr-code links and then later received 2 emails, but both of them had the same bonus code, so I got only 200 gold.

I got three emails and each one gave me 200 gold. Those two I posted here gave 200 each and one I spotted earlier gave me 200 more. I have no idea why you did not get 200gold for each link...

Edit: apparently the QR codes now appear randomly so you need to watch the stream all the time.

Not hilarious but pretty cool imho:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otCLgQjBaio