Quote from AndroidXP :

That's the only way to fix the instant-shift exploit you were able to do with H-pattern shifters.

I could do it with a sequential setup on a joypad...was only for manual clutch-ers though...

Quote from dougie-lampkin :

I'd highly doubt if a 5 minute cool-down would result in a perfect clutch...

Offcourse it won't!

In this patch heat is added not damage, maybe it will be in a future patch but right no only heat is simulated!

Also (God, I'm really fixated on the new clutch ), I tried holding the XRT with the clutch on the big jump at BLR, and clutch went red almost instantly. I was only using 1000-2000 RPM though. IRL, it wouldn't heat up that fast...now maybe I should try another part of the new patch...

Quote from SFL :

Offcourse it won't!

In this patch heat is added not damage, maybe it will be in a future patch but right no only heat is simulated!

I know, I'm talking about the heat, a real clutch at maximum temperature would NOT cool down after 5 mins...thats what I'm saying...

Quote from AndroidXP :

That's the only way to fix the instant-shift exploit you were able to do with H-pattern shifters.

Mhhh, I see. Yeah, i've done it sometimes...

I can see a solution: if the driver engages a gear on its shifter, but doesn't depress the clutch, he would *have* to get out of the gear, then put it again (while clutching, this time...) for it to work.

Don't you think?

Quote from dougie-lampkin :

I know, I'm talking about the heat, a real clutch at maximum temperature would NOT cool down after 5 mins...thats what I'm saying...

My bad!

if you yank hard enough you could pull the trans out of gear in theory...wouldn't want to...but you could.

putting it in gear at full throttle would be kinda horrible though

I was taught pretty much never to touch the shifter w/o the clutch engaged..common sense really if you understand how the drive train works. Its a pain in the ass teaching someone to drive stick who doesn't know how cars work :X I said I'd teach them how to drive stick not what an RPM was :banghead:

Why isn't it possible to shift gears without clutch?

Normally if you rev your car up and jam it in first you should be able to start it and shifting without the clutch while driving is possible anyways.

Have tried it with a old car on some large deserted area, so im sure it will work in rl.

Quote from pipa :

Why isn't it possible to shift gears without clutch?

Normally if you rev your car up and jam it in first you should be able to start it and shifting without the clutch while driving is possible anyways.

Have tried it with a old car on some large deserted area, so im sure it will work in rl.

Because when you're transferring a lot of torque through the shafts, there is a lot of force there stopping you from pulling the collars out of the gears to disengage them (on an H pattern). Same principle but different mechanism for a sequential box.

Of course, the more torque there is being transferred the harder it is.

It's not so much a matter of clutching per se, it's a matter of unloading the shafts, which from everything I've read today is the way it is in LFS as well. Weehoo.

Quote from Ball Bearing Turbo :

Because when you're transferring a lot of torque through the shafts, there is a lot of force there stopping you from pulling the collars out of the gears to disengage them (on an H pattern). Same principle but different mechanism for a sequential box.

Of course, the more torque there is being transferred the harder it is.

It's not so much a matter of clutching per se, it's a matter of unloading the shafts, which from everything I've read today is the way it is in LFS as well. Weehoo.

Took me quite a while to understand it as english is not my native language. And what you are saying is very interesting, eventhough as you said it is hard to do, but not impossible.
Why am i then not able to do produce it in LFS?

Edit:Found my answer sorry to bother http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=21535
And i was able to shift without using the clutch apart from the start, but if you get a push or stand on a hill and get to 4-6km/h you dont need the clutch at all. really amazing.

Quote from Gil07 :

When a car stalls IRL the ignition is still "ON". You have to switch it to "OFF" before starting again

That doesn't make sense. Why do you have to turn off the ignition before starting again? You just turn the key to "start" to run the starter motor. The ignition is on, why must you turn the ignition off and then back on before you start the engine?

I really dont like that the handbrake is automatically on, which has probably been stated before somewhere in the topic.

Quote from wheel4hummer :

That doesn't make sense. Why do you have to turn off the ignition before starting again? You just turn the key to "start" to run the starter motor. The ignition is on, why must you turn the ignition off and then back on before you start the engine?

That's what I was wondering when I posted about it at the beginning of this thread.

On cars like the lx6 when close to flat shifting(keeping gas down when pressing the clutch to shift then letting off the clutch) even on a fresh clutch the rpms will just slowly drop down to match what it should be at. It would seem like the clutch would have more grip than that, how can it slip so much when it's not even hot?

Probably a bug:
Engine doesnt stall when the driving wheels are locked up, either cause by handbrake or foorbrake, in manual clutch mode.

i have no idea where to put this, but i think the clutch wears out WAY too fast.. on the race cars i think its probably just right.. but the road cars wouldnt wear that much..

unless im just not doing something right.

Quote from Kancel :

Probably a bug:
Engine doesnt stall when the driving wheels are locked up, either cause by handbrake or foorbrake, in manual clutch mode.

Actually it does stall it, the revs drop to zero and if you shift to neutral and stop the engine will be off. In your example it just push starts itself back alive when you unlock the wheels and it still has forward speed

FZ5 traction control.

When I purposely overheat the clutch, traction control limits clutch slip instead of wheel slip.

In real car (where ecu cuts engine in case of tire slip) there would be ABS sensors on wheels where from ecu reads wheel speed and cuts fuel/spark.

In FZ5 it seems to be such way that I find it bit unrealistic, speed difference of engine and clutch/transmission ?

Replay from testing attached, I switch traction control of and on to illustrate better that it is traction control issue.

Allright. lol.

Has anyone else noticed that the shift points stayed at the same PRM so when you try to go by the shift light, you hit the rev limiter before it turns on?

Plus, I have always used 120 FOV and I used the digital speedometer and now after X30, I cannot read the numbers on my speedometer at all.

If Scawen codes having to hold the clutch in to start the car I will be pissed. I have owned cars with that damn switch and after the first hour of owning it I Fix it (unplug the switch and short out the two wires)

If you put in a gear with manual gear and clutch, then lift the clutch veeeeeeeery slooooooooowly, the car starts accelerating by itself (as in, it presses the accelerator pedal by itself).
Basically, the THROTTLE is still exibiting the same behaviour as in patch X - just the clutch isnt.

Quote from R3DMAN :

i have no idea where to put this, but i think the clutch wears out WAY too fast.. on the race cars i think its probably just right.. but the road cars wouldnt wear that much..

unless im just not doing something right.

I too agree to a point. I was testing out the new car and was slipping clutch to see how the new feature works and WoW.. I'd say it's good and bad to a fine limit. I'm aware of what happens when you heat a clutch up, but after so much heating it's done. I wasnt able to make it to pits to see weather pitting will fix it or not, but the clutch seems to heat rapidly on race cars, I'm still testing out everything so I'll post any bad/odd behavior Thanks for the test patch DEVS.

Oh yeah, Black wood never looked this good, and the chickaine (Yes I know it's spelled wrong) route is awesome... I like the bumpy feel and the layout.

Quote from wheel4hummer :

That doesn't make sense. Why do you have to turn off the ignition before starting again? You just turn the key to "start" to run the starter motor. The ignition is on, why must you turn the ignition off and then back on before you start the engine?

Let's just conclude it as an "idiot proof" feature, that is not mechanically required. Same goes for requiring clutching to start even in neutral.

All cars I've driven, too, required only turning to "start" to run the starter motor. No clutch needed starting in neutral, either. But it does make sense to artificially require turning to "off" then to "start", and maybe plus pressing the clutch to a) avoid using starter when engine's running and b) avoid driving the car with the starter.

Quote from Stigpt :

If you put in a gear with manual gear and clutch, then lift the clutch veeeeeeeery slooooooooowly, the car starts accelerating by itself (as in, it presses the accelerator pedal by itself).
Basically, the THROTTLE is still exibiting the same behaviour as in patch X - just the clutch isnt.

That's normal for a car. You don't need to push the accelerator to get going.

lol.. Umm. I would not have my clutch in my real car overheat while doing doughnuts. I just did it in LFS and my clutch went out And no.. I was not clutch kicking the entire time.

Quote from BrandonAGr :

On cars like the lx6 when close to flat shifting(keeping gas down when pressing the clutch to shift then letting off the clutch) even on a fresh clutch the rpms will just slowly drop down to match what it should be at. It would seem like the clutch would have more grip than that, how can it slip so much when it's not even hot?

My guess is (haven't driven the road cars in X30 yet myself) that there's also some modeling of the limits of a clutch when it isn't overheating, IRL even a racing clutch has limits of the amount of torque it can transfer. The LX6 should be running a road clutch (harder, larger area less friction), there's a reason why racing clutches exist in the first place