Oh come on now. There are much more legal-ish cheats people use to get insane hotlap times, the uberfast clutchbutton script, ridiculously low steering lock, setups that won't last for more than a lap, you name it...
Even online you can use InSim to write all sorts of "assistance" apps, the most die-hard cheaters can use info from OutSim and OutGauge to create traction control and ABS hacks and there is no way you can prevent that - should we remove InSim and OutGauge too?

Honestly, the force view mode is nothing compared to what can be done and what some people really do.

Quote from S.E.T.H :

you talk as if i blame everyone that is faster than me of using Force mode. no, i do not.

Yes, yes you do.
You saying you are not blaming everyone else but removing force view feature would affect everyone to the same degree, heck it would even make making sets harder, because where am I supose to make set and test my car if not in hotlap mode.

Quote from S.E.T.H :

i dont really understand what you are against when i say it should at least be blocked on ''hotlap'' mode.

First of all there is force view which according to experienced players give no advantage while in race, if you are not as good as them and if you are not as familiar with this particular sim, its nuisances, etc (you are playing for one month only), then what is it that puts you in position of saying they are wrong?
And second there is not a single reason to remove an otherwise useful feature just because someone say its unfair, especially when lot of experienced drivers disagreed with this someone.

As a change from all the flaming.

S.E.T.H - Would you like to *clearly* explain the advantages that the "force mode" gives a driver? Is it the cameras new position, or the "at the wheels" force data, or both?

Quote from Jakg :

As a change from all the flaming.

S.E.T.H - Would you like to *clearly* explain the advantages that the "force mode" gives a driver? Is it the cameras new position, or the "at the wheels" force data, or both?

Part of me wonders if it's the name, like some kind of special Anakin Skywalker podrace mode.

Quote from Jakg :

As a change from all the flaming.

S.E.T.H - Would you like to *clearly* explain the advantages that the "force mode" gives a driver? Is it the cameras new position, or the "at the wheels" force data, or both?

you can see much better where the tires are, and abuse the track to its very limits.

you can see the way better, with better sight

you can gain advantage in race with it. that you can see better, find places among cars to pass.

generally, better sight gives you advantage, it adds around 40% more sight. i myself did quarter of a second faster times with it.

one mouse player (lagger) told that he was gaining advantage with this mode too in this thread. he is s2 licensed and registered in 2008. but everyone ignored him and noone wanted to give him a hearing.

Quote from S.E.T.H :

you can see much better where the tires are, and abuse the track to its very limits.

you can see the way better, with better sight

you can gain advantage in race with it. that you can see better, find places among cars to pass.

generally, better sight gives you advantage.

one mouse player (lagger) told that he was gaining advantage with this mode too in this thread. he is s2 licensed and registered in 2008. but everyone ignored him and noone wanted to give him a hearing.

Have you not considered that the view on a monitor is MUCH more restrictive than the real thing in the first place, and that custom views - or in this case force view - is restoring some of the lost visibility that you would have in a real racing situation?

Quote from Becky Rose :

Have you not considered that the view on a monitor is MUCH more restrictive than the real thing in the first place, and that custom views - or in this case force view - is restoring some of the lost visibility that you would have in a real racing situation?

should take this as a confession?

if you dont have an HD 100+cm tv then you lose some visibility. but you dont sweat, you dont feel the G forces, and you dont vibrate behind your wheel. and also you do have more tries than you have in real.

no F mode is not like restoring a visibility. okay, restore it with custom views. but F mode never feels right. custom views are realistic to a certain extent. but force mode is totally a bullshit and has nothing to do with reality. it should be only allowed somewhere like setup environment.

Quote from Sobis :

I'm sorry but you can't buy it, you can only rent it AFAIK. Plus it doesn't have Force view so I will loose everytime.

good point, thats why I only did the free trial and ruined everyones SR by letting my friends drive

Tune in next week when 3 screens is considered an unfair advantage.

Quote from S.E.T.H :

you can see much better where the tires are, and abuse the track to its very limits.

you can see the way better, with better sight

you can gain advantage in race with it. that you can see better, find places among cars to pass.

generally, better sight gives you advantage, it adds around 40% more sight. i myself did quarter of a second faster times with it.

one mouse player (lagger) told that he was gaining advantage with this mode too in this thread. he is s2 licensed and registered in 2008. but everyone ignored him and noone wanted to give him a hearing.

Like i said earlier if your used to cockpit view then it doesn't matter what so ever, yes you can see the tyres but experienced players know the paramiters of the car in cockpit view and hit every apex and drive the tracks limits you can watch some of my and joes hotlaps if you like (need s2) and you'll see that you can drive a tracks limits in cockpit mode, i've been playing the sim since 2007 and ive come across lots of fast drivers that use different types of views but it all comes down to skill and preference and infact imol is the only person ive ever heard uses force mode.

Quote from S.E.T.H :

you can see much better where the tires are, and abuse the track to its very limits.

So are you saying riding curbs is not possible when not in force view?
I mean curb is as close to the track limit as you can get so are you saying that unless I am in force view I cant to it?

Quote from S.E.T.H :

you can see the way better, with better sight

No you cant see way better, what you will see and what was obstructed with cockpit is only few meters ahead even if you see it there is not time to react to it.

Quote from S.E.T.H :

generally, better sight gives you advantage. i myself could do quarter of a second faster times with it.

Placebo.
I am making worse time with force view as well as someone else previously stated.

Quote from S.E.T.H :

one mouse player (lagger) told that he was gaining advantage with this mode too in this thread. he is s2 licensed and registered in 2008. but everyone ignored him and noone wanted to give him a hearing.

That probably because he never said he was gaining advantage

Quote from L@gger :

--//snip//--

Go to his post and quote the line in which he stated he used this view to gain advantage I cant see anything like this.

What the hell S.E.T.H. ? I must admit i didnt read the 4 pages, but i did read the first 2.......

Heres what i think:

For starters, i thing you are talking to soon about a game you dont even own ( yet ), and dont even know to much about it ( yet also ).

Second, you said you played ALOT of racing games, but oddly enough, you just started with LFS a few weeks ago.....LFS exists for a fairly number of years, and if you search for car racing simulator games on google, im pretty sure LFS will be there ( either on a forum or review or whatever ), listed as one of the best.

Shall i continue? ( retorical question, of course i will )

You ask ppl to be on your side instead of throwing you down, but yet, you seem to talk down to alot of "us", like you know something we dont.....and that tells me, from the start, you have no respect for "our" comunity, or the game it self. So dont ask us to do what you are not willing to do.

LFS is not perfect, and all the other sims around are the same, they all have flaws. Some more, some less. Only you can decide what to play. But, you cant base the hole experience on one simple thing that only you consider a flaw! Specially if there is a way to go around it ( wich there is, and someone already told you that ).

Im not trying to throw you down, im just trying to make you aware that your acusations are unfounded and a bit ignorant. LFS , to me , is the best there is in the racing simulator business, and i have tryed Rfactor, Iracing, GTR ( all of them ), etc etc..... If you take some time to investigate it better, you'll see it has a nice comunity, and that there is a diferent corner for everyone ( i mean theres diferent types of servers for diferent tastes ) , and i bet you that there are a few that enforce cockpit view, and other thing to make it more realistic.

Im sorry if along this thread you came to your senses, but as i told you in the beggining of my post, i didnt read more after the end of second page.

Just stop trolling go racing. If you dont like the "f" key view, dont use it. And if you are trully good, you will beat anyone with or without the "f" view ( wich noone uses by the way, just so you know.....). LFS has been here for years, and for us, the "old" users, there are much more important things to worrie about then a crapy F view. Dont think the developers where waiting for you to come along so they can change the system just for you....grow up.

I apologise if i sound a little harsh and if some of my sentences dont make sense, but i try my best in the english language

Bob smith aproves this thread and chupacabras with the gift proved a importan point, this thread should be nominated for the YEA 2012

What are you on about the reason for the force mode is to help in tuning the car.

http://en.lfsmanual.net/wiki/Views
It is not a view.
It is a tool.
http://en.lfsmanual.net/wiki/Keys
Just make sure you are wearing clothes while sitting in the car.

if you hold down F-key it makes you faster.

just shut the **** up S.E.T.H, you have absolutely no clue what you are talking about, now go back to the miserable sh*thole you came from and stay there.. Free us from your bullshit.

Yours truly
Deeee.Inc

im not one for speaking against any post but this is the most stupidist ever post made,i race a lot everyday and ive just tried racing in force mode and it gave me no advantage in anyway,why not press view til get the view with just the wheels...before you make statements that are so daft its better to either A-Research it(try with and try without) over a period of time B-then think of it logically....

S.E.T.H. the advantage is huge. I am roundabout 2 sec faster on small tracks and like 5 sec on longer tracks. Other cars arn't even an obstacle anymore.

I also use a 100cm+ screen and can see every pixel, which obviously gives me the total overview.

This is the funniest thing I've read all day.

Quote from S.E.T.H :

should take this as a confession?

*raises an eyebrow* Like I said, I find force view distracting.

Actually my preffered view when driving a tin top is to position the camera on the bottom centre of the windscreen and adjust the camera field of view so that I am zoomed right in. So I have less peripheral visibility, but can see up the road further ahead.

Quote :

if you dont have an HD 100+cm tv then you lose some visibility.

Is this bragging? Because if so: I have a cinema under my house. Envy me, yes bow down and worship. 100cm lolz!

If not, well, what you are saying is that different setups require different configurations to get the most out of them, so a different array of screens and a different controller means you will set the game up differently.

Luckily LFS is released on a console where all the hardware is the same so we don't have to worry about that. Oh wait...

I actually tried the F-mode earlier today before I had to go to work ( I am work atm, but coffee break like now)

And I have to say that: it sucks


I rather use helicopter view than freaking F-mode, as I can not feel the car itself when it is on. It is like using Lightsaber than real sword ( Star Wars fans knows that it Lightsaber weights nothing).

And someone beginner says that everyone uses it because they can do faster laptimes...

Oh btw, how about using UF 1000 car in Kyoto Ring Oval? People uses there F-mode and they get only same time as best drivers do or weaker time. It is all about track knowledge and hard training, with good setups and so on. There is nothing about F-mode, it does not help at all, because LFS players simply are much better in LFS by training, training and training, no matter do they use F-mode or not. And they do not use.


How about skins then? Many people wants to make own skins on LFS, what they want to use in their car. Also, many people wants to see whole cars, because it looks nicer and it makes more realistic to see whole cars than just wheels with bouncing stick forces on. If every people uses the F-mode I am pretty sure that only rare people then would make some skins on LFS.


S.E.T.H - please use brains and think about this case in other hand. Do you really think it is so the case? If you really do, then I must be a god then in LFS ( and so are many many others like aliens) as I have never used the F-mode, because it looks bad and stupid.

I have 6,5 year LFS Experience and I do want see whole cars on LFS while racing, drifting, cruising or anything else. Even if I am not fast, there is lot of other things to be good player without using any F-modes. I can tell to you that it is not even a secret! Everyone starts on LFS even, everyone have same cars, same setup system, same tracks and so on.

And finally, actually does it really matter? If you do not like it that there is F-mode, then do not use it. I do not use it, and many others do not use it. I know this mate, I know this.


Just my 2 cents...


Next --->

Nominated for best thread of the year

And what I really also want to say that:


If you are trying to say that I still try to defend my secret, which is for me is not a secret at all ( which makes kind of pretty amusing, because I know how people can be wrong), or if you try to say that I am only saying here to you, that you know nothing, which is also true...

... Then I have to say you are really lost in there mate

I am complaining here only, because I want to advice you how the things in LFS are, and how the LFS-players make it... You are not fast or good with only 1000km or with 2-4 months. Nope...

Drive over 100 000 LFS-km, play LFS over 5 years and make a good hotlaps on LFS World. AND I can say it, you are able to do them without any F-mode, as I know...

... And if you refuse the things what I said to you, then I know you are wrong, you have been beaten by someone epic driver, and you are crying that you are poor, beginner cruiser, who just wants to own the game by with own things in LFS, which should be to everyone else LFS-players.

... I just say to you...


DEAL WITH IT!

You have lost your war here pal. Very lost. I know you still try to defend your arguments but I know they are totally wrong... I am pretty sure you afterwards will use something illegal stuff in LFS, because then again you think that every epic LFS-player are CHEATERS, which in that case you are again wrong and have got a "Double-Bogey" if this game would be a golf. Too bad it is a racing simulator and you will get both DNF and DQ in same time.

Yeah I want to argue this with you long. looooooooooong time, as this is amusing me alot. I write here at my workplace with nice smile on I am not arguing myself only. I should say WE, the community, as they know how the things in here are. I am just a emissary who talks our behalf about this

OF COURSE, I am not saying that there is no one who uses the F-mode, but as I said earlier, it does not matter at all, and that's it.




So mate, please, I hope you do understand, or do you still want to lose and getting embarrassed here? I just want to help you, nothing else, but I must be a bit rude because it feels so unbelieveable that you still try to defend yourself lol.


There is 2 choices:

1. Deal with it and play and enjoy LFS as it is on now
2. Get lost


K?


EDIT:

Quote from MoMo92i :

Nominated for best thread of the year

And I agree!

Quote from UnknownMaster21 :

And what I really also want to say that:


If you are trying to say that I still try to defend my secret, which is for me is not a secret at all ( which makes kind of pretty amusing, because I know how people can be wrong), or if you try to say that I am only saying here to you, that you know nothing, which is also true...

... Then I have to say you are really lost in there mate

I am complaining here only, because I want to advice you how the things in LFS are, and how the LFS-players make it... You are not fast or good with only 1000km or with 2-4 months. Nope...

Drive over 100 000 LFS-km, play LFS over 5 years and make a good hotlaps on LFS World. AND I can say it, you are able to do them without any F-mode, as I know...

... And if you refuse the things what I said to you, then I know you are wrong, you have been beaten by someone epic driver, and you are crying that you are poor, beginner cruiser, who just wants to own the game by with own things in LFS, which should be to everyone else LFS-players.

... I just say to you...


DEAL WITH IT!

You have lost your war here pal. Very lost. I know you still try to defend your arguments but I know they are totally wrong... I am pretty sure you afterwards will use something illegal stuff in LFS, because then again you think that every epic LFS-player are CHEATERS, which in that case you are again wrong and have got a "Double-Bogey" if this game would be a golf. Too bad it is a racing simulator and you will get both DNF and DQ in same time.

Yeah I want to argue this with you long. looooooooooong time, as this is amusing me alot. I write here at my workplace with nice smile on I am not arguing myself only. I should say WE, the community, as they know how the things in here are. I am just a emissary who talks our behalf about this

OF COURSE, I am not saying that there is no one who uses the F-mode, but as I said earlier, it does not matter at all, and that's it.




So mate, please, I hope you do understand, or do you still want to lose and getting embarrassed here? I just want to help you, nothing else, but I must be a bit rude because it feels so unbelieveable that you still try to defend yourself lol.


There is 2 choices:

1. Deal with it and play and enjoy LFS as it is on now
2. Get lost


K?


EDIT:



And I agree!

yeah, i am so embarrassed. you are not using it, you are not getting advantage of it, its not important at all, but defending it so crazily that as if you'll be lost if its removed in hotlap mode.

no worries how much you beg how much you bleed will not make sense, as my request is supposed to have no such ''crazy'' posts. and i simply want it to be removed while hotlapping and online races. and be available in somewhere like test environment.

if you were truly not using it, you would say ''its ok. i only use it while making setups, just make it available to us in single mode so we can create good sets with its help.''


seriously, why would i be stupid for requesting such thing? you must have been happy with that. but you call me stupid then eh

one guy did a good job showing the difference between normal & F mode, unfortunately, it was showing so much about what i am talking.



yes, that makes hell of a difference.

Quote :

OF COURSE, I am not saying that there is no one who uses the F-mode, but as I said earlier, it does not matter at all, and that's it.

it does, really. it matters.