Quote from amp88 :

I've got to say that's one of the most poorly constructed sentences in the history of the English language.



To make it look "better" for TV and season reviews because there's no SC in front of the winner.

yeah I probably shouldn't have squeeced that into one sentence~

So on a normal restart behind a safety car, drivers can pass others after they crosses the first safety car line. But why should that not be the case when the safety car is coming in on the final lap of a race~?

Quote from Mustafur :

Is there any info yet on how Redbull got such a huge boost in performance in Spain? because they made atleast 7 tenths in that race which would have to be the biggest single upgrade done in years.

don't forget the upgrade McLaren built last year was even bigger~!

Red Bull is supremely quick in qualifying, while the McLaren is pretty bad at it but has decent race pace. The combined effect was that Red Bull was a country mile ahead in quali, but Lewis was closer in terms of speed during the race, sufficient enough to jump Vettel in the pits.

it's much worse than America's style of "sprint to the line"...

what's the point of pulling the safety car in if one ain't allow to pass another if the safety car came in on the last lap, despite the first safety car line thingy~?
just so the cars would cross the line more quickly then they would have if they were following the safety car~?

I expect the top teams to stick 20min worth of fuel load in the cars and be circulating for the whole duration of Q1. Then they can hope they can squeece a time in somewhere in the middle... lol

Quote from adamlfs :

Yeah I was gutted to see that happen He drove an amazing race, I was worried after the jump in the pitstop that Vettle would have ended up catching him.

I was worrying when Lewis was pulling away from Vettel and catching Webber immediately after his pitstop... (which prob explains my earlier remarks...)

but nah, if they both didn't have their problems, Vettel can't find a way pass a McLaren with the best developed f-duct and the best engine...

Quote from adamlfs :

From crash.net



If anyone was paying attention while watching the crash, you could see the rim explode and metal flew off over Hamilton's head.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/h ... t/formula_one/8671198.stm

If you watch that video 31 seconds in you see the rim blow then the tyre deflates.

so that explains it...

didn't really watch a replay of it cos I pretty much turn my TV off as soon as I saw a McLaren crashed into the wall... lol

Quote from JPeace :

funny = fully

My bad typo. But yes, he wss alongside and in hindsight it's better to have finished the race (well...?) than go out on 1st corner. Dont think webber saw him anyway.

yeah Lewis should have stick it down the inside, which would hopfully take the two Red Bulls out along with himself...

then Alonso would have an easy cruise to a victory~!!!
that would goes down very well with the Spainnish, and would probably improve Lewis' popularity there too~!

Quote from Mustafur :

I Didn't find the race that boring, but i knew the spanish GP is one of the boring tracks(so is everything thats in spain), However Webber won so im happy.

Really bad luck for Hamilton.

would be really interesting to see if that was just bad luck, or bad tyres management by Lewis...

Quote from Boris Lozac :

And i was on forum for a split second when Schumacher overtook Button, they haven't showed the replay ffs!

Button had a crap pitstop, and he was way too cautious if Schumacher when he's heading out of the pit and going down to turn 1 together...

he didn't have to let Schumacher pass there, but he did and now I doubt he'll be able to find a way pass...

Quote from Gerdoner :

Wasn't there a rule that you're not allowed to go over a certain speed and use special tyres?

doubt the certain speed thing...

surely a promotional video would look rather stupid if the cars are crusing at 100mph~?

Quote from Zdenek CZE :

Big accident in Moto 2 - Jerez 2010

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFwKujTZ79c

what on earth happened there~ lol
half the field gone in one corner, and most of them fell down all by themselves. lol

Quote from mr grady :

i should have added i want to burn it onto a dvd, and i cant with iplayer.so thanks, but you aint getting a penny! lol

have you heard of those brilliant website out there somewhere... where you can gather some B and some T...

can't say their name out in public through.

Quote from Shotglass :

it has been said countless times before and your caluclation there will bring the point home to even the more mathematically ungifted person

effectively there has hardly been any change to the point system at all
the relative difference in points is more or less the same as it was before and the point have simply been increased over the board to allow awarding points for lower finishes (which overall doesnt matter much in the final result)
second place has been demoted a little from 80% to 72% which is a good thing but still not back to the 60% it used to be so winning a race is still devalued a lot compared to the early 90s

I like the way the points system was in the 90s, 2nd + 3rd equal the number of points for the winner, so basically when a team won a race, no other team could score more points than you.

Quote from pearcy_2k7 :

My memory is pretty bad sometimes, shhh.

He still had alot of cars to overtake and Jenson had a clear air too.

But he's the one that put himself so far back in the first place~

I'm not saying that's his mistake through, as obviously both Ferrari, both Red Bull, and a certain 7 times Champion, made the same decision~

Quote from JPeace :

you cannot blame lewis for having a car with faults. In brazil 2007, the car went into a false neutral, nothing the driver can do to stop it. And then in china, the team made him stay out so long his tyre went down onto the canvas. Neither incidents his fault, therefore he didnt throw it away, the team did.

I didn't blame him for Brazil... but for China...

Lewis is the one in the car, the one that should have could have told the team the tyres are gone and required a pitstop, after being the one that weared the tyres down pushing hard up front, and ultimately, the one that throwed it into the gravel...

Quote from wild :

What is it with all the Lewis is better at overtaking than Jenson bullshit in this thread?

I really don't see how it matters that much as Jenson is leading the WDC whereas Lewis isn't. Jenson uses his initiative whereas Lewis just relies on the team to make the decisions for him. Then when they get it wrong he goes off in a huff and mouths off to the media.

Surely he can override the decision to come into the pits, since he is technically driving the car if I'm correct? That's where Jenson comes into a league of his own, he uses his own initiative and pits when the conditions are right.

I'll agree that Lewis is probably a better Racer, but what would you want a consistent racer who is always there or thereabouts or one who is fast but is not as consistent. That sentence reminds me a bit of the Red Bull situation this year. A extremely fast but un-reliable car. A bit like Hamilton

I know I'm going to get slagged off for this but oh well, that's life. We're all entitled to our own opinions.

A racer is more exciting to watch for us F1 fans, but it won't necessarily win him races~

And at the end of the race, it's winning the race that's ultimately the most important isn't it. While at the end of the season, it's leading the championship standing that's the most important.

Button is proven to be capable of doing the two. Where as Lewis... to say it simply, he should have and could have been a double world champion, but he managed to throw one away. No doubt he's exceptionally quick through...

Quote from PaulC2K :

Button:
R1| Qualified 8th, Finished 7th, overtook nobody when he needed to
R2| Qualified 4th, Finished 1st, fortunate enough not to need to pass anyone
R3| Qualified 17th, Finished 8th, overtook Alonsos struggling Ferrari and the rest in pits or mech failures
R4| Qualified 5th, Finished 1st, fortunate enough not to need to pass anyone but Rosberg

Hamilton:
R1| Qualified 4th, Finished 3rd, passed Vettels struggling Red Bull
R2| Qualified 11th, Finished 6th, passed Button, Webber, Massa before being wrecked by Webber when in 5th.
R3| Qualified 20th, Finished 6th, passed 5 people on track, plus 7 on grid straight incl Button & Alonso
R4| Qualified 6th, Finished 2nd, passed approx 10+ people (midpack folks)

This isnt intended as a Hamilton is better than Button and heres the proof (though FTR IMO anyone who doesnt recognise that as being true anyway is blind) but just a bizarre observation from the first 4 races of the season. Its quite easy to say bloody hell Jensons doing well at the moment, 2 race wins, tops the driver standings etc. But when you analyse what he's done what he's actually done is actually just make 2 very good decisions which have won him races, and the other 2 races he's spent his time following others unable to pass them. The 2 races he'd won, its hard to judge as he found himself in the that position in the first few laps so didnt have the chance to prove he COULD have passed people, but in the other races he proved he COULDNT pass people.

Im sure the fact that they're having to compromise on the setup to give it better balancing and this isnt making them as fast as they could be is a factor which could soon be solved in Barcelona, they could both be overtaking with relative ease if DF is equal to the rest of the grid and the F-Duct gives them a straight line speed advantage as you'd expect (currently they're adding extra DF, which the F-Duct neutralises down the straight, meaning no speed advantage but hi-DF with no speed loss like all other cars would experience).


As for the 'yeah, well he did it last year'.... its quite easy to overtake people when you have one of the fastest cars on the grid, and thats my point. He's having to fight for passes, and he's struggling. Hamilton is too, but the difference is he has made a dozen, including Button, Massa, Alonso & Webber (+ Vettel, but in a struggling state) and thats what you expect from world champions. The likes of Senna, Prost, Schumi, Alonso... they can hussle a pass with witt & cunning maneuvers. Button showed last year he could win from the front in a dominant car, and win when a faster car (RBR) appeared and had a dozen mechanical issues... he rarely took a race by the scruff of the neck and faught for it (Brazil is the only occasion which springs to mind). Maybe thats not his fault, but it doesnt disprove my point either.

Also regarding someones 'one of a few to pass a KERS car' pull the other one, half the grid passed a KERS car at some stage. Their extra weight compromised them around 80% of the lap, so made them vulnerable where most equal cars wouldnt be, and while they're hard to defend against, it wasnt as hard to pass one because there was more opportunities (due to more defensive lines being used around the track) and being slower on the corner exit if you were still close when the KERS was deployed you'd probably be able to stick with them in the slipstream. It certainly wouldnt be like comparing single & double deck defusers, KERS was removed from many cars frequently, only McLaren ran them regularly and still removed it for a couple of rounds (Silverstone i recall, due to not enough brake points to recover energy) so many teams removing it showed it wasnt all that.

Jenson is a very good driver, many will say he's one of the best in F1, but IMO his racing ability isnt of the standard you'd expect from a WDC and he's done little to prove that. Many people were saying this at the latter stages of last season, Brazil surprised many people, but its the exception and not the norm. Vettel was a far better racer, but had mechincal issues. Jenson got the WDC exactly how you're meant to, winning races and picking up pts... you cant knock that, but IMO its the weakest WDC winner i can recall for a long time (i've watched since late 80's) but again... not his fault, he raced, won, and did so without controversy.

As I said in one of the posts above. In Bahrain, he was stuck behind Michael Schumacher. Even Lewis, despite his brilliance at making passes, found it impossible to pass a Mercedes engined cars in normal dry condition. So how does Jenson failure to do the same thing make him suddenly a lot worse~?

FYI, Lewis was stuck behind Rosberg in the opening stint at Bahrain, only got the position via the pit stops. And Lewis was stuck behind the Force India at Malaysia.

And were you watching the same season I watched last season~? Havn't got the stats on me cos I ain't bored enough to count it. But no, if the car in front has KERS, it means it can pull away in the straight, which made it impossible to pass. Remember Vettel looking at a Ferrari diffuser for the whole race at Barcelona, or how Fisichella couldn't pass Kimi at Spa despite being able to lap quicker~? Button certainly didn't "win from the front" at Bahrain as far as I could recall (that track that's utterly boring this season, the one where no one could pass any body), Lewis got in front of him at the start thanks to his KERS, but Button got it back a lap or two later.

So if I'm trying to apply your theory, oh no, Lewis PROVED that he couldn't pass a Force India... how crap is that~?

Quote from Intrepid :

And that's why everyone was stumbling over him to sign him up for 2010!

Jenson is very good but that statement doesn't actually correlate with the team's actual behaviour (actual money on the table and not just 'talk') in the 2009 silly season.

.. and when have u been a slave to F1 paddock talk considering it's substantial support for karting (which u hate )?

and I guess hardly anyone would have put money on Jenson for leading the World Championship and winning the most races after the first four flyaways...

At least Peter Windsor, the man that has spent years as the editor of F1 Racing magazine but obviously failed in setting up an actual F1 team, seems to think Jenson Button is good.
On the season review issue of the F1 Racing magazine last year, Peter Windsor said a whole lot of stuff about how brilliant he thinks Button is at the "second gear corner", which he claimed now "made up the majority of corners during a F1 season", and how important that is for Jenson to build up that big lead.

How good he actually is at those "second gear corners" I don't really know, but I surely did disagree about his points that it was a fundamental part for him to win so many races, because he hardly get on the podium afterwards.

Quote from Intrepid :

Button has had two good tyre decisions but he still lacks fundamental race speed in dry races (Malaysia and Bahrain anyone?) and when we get to Europe Vettel will just disappear into the distance.

But to be slightly fair to him, he was stuck behind Schumacher in Bahrain. Just ask Lewis how hard it's to pass a Merc-engined car in normal dry condition. Despite Lewis brilliance at passing people this year, he couldn't pass Rosberg in the opening stint of Bahrain, and was stuck behind a Force India in Malaysia.

And in Malaysia Button pitted extremely early, and has to nurse his tyres for 50 odd laps, but it's also this pitting early that saved him from having to make passes on the track, he jumped a lot of people with that strategy.

Don't forget Button was one of the very few drivers who managed to pass a KERS equipped McLaren last year. And don't forget what happened at Brazil last year.

Button put himself into a position of not having to pass many people and still win, which Lewis obviously failed badly at that.

At the end of the day, it's winning (be it a race, and as well as the Championship) that's ultimately the most important, and Button had put himself in a great position to be in. Won two out of the first four races, and leading the world championship. He earned it himself the SMART and the EASY (comparatively) way.

Quote from J@tko :

That's exactly what I thought happened - their pit boxes are right next to each other and you could see from the live feed that Hamilton's wheel-spin was all over the place. A bit naughty of Seb to push him towards the pit boxes though

Which is why he got reprimanded also~

Good racers will do anything to win a battle as long as they think it stay (just) within the rules~

Quote from Danke :

And he was reprimanded for weaving last race. How many reprimands does it take to get a penalty?

OT: Are there trailer parks in the UK? I was under the impression that tornados only hit trailer parks. :P

I take reprimand means that you'll be penalised the next time you commmit to the SAME offence~

there is an easy solution, just lick Anthony Davidson from the 5 live team...

Just watched the BBC post race forum (not from the red button XD). Martin Brundle called it perfectly regarding McLaren releasing Hamilton. When the McLaren dude lift the lollipop, Vettel was on the pit box right behind, and the lollipop man couldn't have seen him coming, because the Red Bulls and the McLaren lifted their lollipop almost at the same time.

Just that Vettel got a much cleaner acceleration off his box while Hamilton was spinning his wheels, that's what put Vettel in front. And in the end the reprimand was correct, McLaren didn't release Hamilton into the path of Vettel, although lifting off the throtle was always an option for Lewis (but there was nothing much wrong about going side by side with another car in the pit), and Vettel shouldn't have pushed Lewis towards the pit garages.

The stewards actually called to see both Alonso and Massa to have a chat about Alonso's pass on Massa in the pit entrance. No one know what they talked about through...

PS. Webber said that the Red Bull car this year doesn't work in the wet. And I think it will be for the same reason that they're so strong in qualifying (and the ride height issue).

Quote from ekze :

And nothing about unsafe pit-enter?

Unsafe pit-enter~?
Never heard of it before...

Nothing is unsafe regarding that as long as they braked in time for the speed limiter, and don't breach it on the gravel on the entrance~

Quote from Intrepid :

Having watched the video again I can see why he escaped punishment, despite causing carnage behind.

that's his revenge for:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Da0Vn_b-s18