Thanks for the suggestions.

Unfortunately, nothing really seems to be working.

It's a real shame, I really like what I see so far, but the game is simply unplayable like this!!

With only 4 AI cars racing, the frame-rate skips from between 90FPS to 15FPS when all the AI cars are visible and going around a corner or something.

I really want to buy a licence, but I just can't justify it with this problem.

Ah thanks for clearing that much up!

What do you mean "whatever"? You think they wouldn't?

Screw Valentines day.

Quote from The Moose :

We cant take it seriously.

You produce a poll without all the current race sims in it. A pointless poll at that, in the main LFS site. You wont get a balanced view here will you?

Then we find out the community is even more full of ricers than we thought possible.

A sad end to a sad thread

Okay that's fair enough.

Look, I just thought the poll would be a bit of fun, bias yes, but still some fun. And to some extent it is!

I seriously hope the NFS votes are jokes though!

All I'm saying is I've been here for one day and it seems 50% of this forum seem to have the mentality that posting here is some kind of macho penis-measuring competition. It AINT! And if it was, I'd probably win!

So everyone just play nice, mkay?

Quote from pearcy_2k7 :

Put the handbags away fellas! The problems of this forum are mostly down to the people in it, e.g. newbie drifter has just bought S2 response "oh no lets just hope he doesn't go cruise or drift" its his chioce.

e.g. newbie comes and makes a suggestion that has been suggested many times before response "use the fcking search button moron (links to 500 threads containing this suggestion)"

Now that's the kind of attitude that is making this forum bad not the people that are coming into the community, everyone needs to wise up and be alot nicer to each other otherwise its going to get worse and worse and eventually drifters will take over the world.

Just to quote you Ian on something you said recently which provokes reactions and makes the forum cold blooded.

"Geewhizz... do ya think!?

It must be international retard week or something"2



Regards,

Ian

Was your response to someone who was asking if people thought adding a LEMAN car was a good idea.

Yes it's been suggested a million times, but there's no need for a respinse like that, in future a moderator should or anyone for that matter link him to 1 thread containing this suggestion and leave it like that, instead of flaming the poor guy, and ultimatley may make even more people give up LFS.

Have been on this forum for one day and couldn't agree more.

What's the fuggen go here guys? It's not a dick-measuring competition all right!!

Just chill out and be nice.

And yes, I agree drifting is silly. Asking for "tuned cars" and drift tracks or whatever is like going onto a Need For Speed forum and posting threads about converting it into a high-fidelity racing simulator.

Thanks Gnomie - well I have those things set to "hardware controlled" in the Nvidia display panel.

And it's not another task. Through trial I have discovered that the frame-rate just drops at the same point on the track, but at the point there is nothing special happening. E.g. at one instance you might have a full view of the track with 8 cars in view and it's running at 50FPS. 20m down the road, the view is almost identical but it starts stuttering at 15-18FPS, even though there is no more complicated visuals etc. If I watch the AI doing laps as a spectator it happens in the same spots every time.

There's a lot of needless abuse flying around on this forum.

Sim-drivers are in some ways just like real drivers I suppose. Think they know it all, are the best at everything and have no qualms about labelling everyone a "fuggen idiot" while they're safe in their car or behind their computer. Different story when you actually come face to face with them.

What's the abuse for guys? Chill out and relax. Don't take it so seriously.

Quote from mcintyrej :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxVIcNsGvRc

Tell me that wouldn't be an adrenaline rush.

Might be fun but anyone racing properly would skin them both alive. Which would be more of a rush IMO.

Quote from mcintyrej :

I guess some do it for the adrenaline rush of entering a cornet at 70mph going sideways.

That would be scary!

Quote :

In all the discussions about drifting, i see people saying "ohh, i don't dislike drifters or drifting in general... it's just those noobs with the bad attitude which are pissing me off". But still there is all this "down talking" about drifting all the time. It's getting annoying, really.

Hmmm ... sorry I honestly wasn't aware that this occurred!!

I thought everyone thought it was cool and I was the one left a bit confused.

I don't want to talk down to anyone, and I can accept it's fun in the same way as doing doughnuts or eating ice cream is fun.

But to be a professional ice-cream eater or "burnout-pro"? It seems to me the same thing almost.

Quote from Intrepid :

what's the fascination with trying to drive a good lap?

Well, you're trying to see how fast you can make the car go... it's basic yes, but there is actually a point. I don't know what drifting is trying to achieve at all!

Quote :

To drift to a pro level is pretty tricky stuff, and just as valid as any other form of motoring.

How on earth does one become a pro "drifter"?

Quote :

What's the point of kicking a leather ball around a pitch, or painting a picture, or writing a song.???

All of those things have very clearly defined goals. I still don't know what is the goal of drifting. It's getting a racing car and making it go slowly and eating the tyres and the only reason I can fathom so far is "it's fun". Which is fair enough, but I'm just trying to ascertain if there is something more to it, or is it just for a shits and giggles?

Quote :

maybe if you invested some time to actually doing it, and understanding what it takes to do it like a pro you might understand why it's so popular.

I believe you that to "drift like a pro", whatever that means, might be difficult. But I still don't know why you'd want to master this seemingly useless talent, except because it's funny to do it!

I think it's more fun to drive fast.

However, I agree sliding around is fun for a bit of light-hearted mucking about - but for how long? Ten minutes? There are people who seem to take it really seriously! I could have sworn I saw a "drifting" race on television before I left for Ireland! And it seems on YouTube there's some professional "drifting racers" in Japan! If it's just a bit of fun driving a car sideways, how can they be professionals? And how can they "race"? Anyone who decided to drive properly would lap them all! Is there any practical benefit to it? Because it seems to me the worst way you could choose to drive on a racing track - slow, dangerous and killing your tyres/car.

I like to have a car that's a little bit loose - a tiny bit of sliding here and there just to rotate the car into the corner neatly, but what I'm talking about is a barely perceptible slip compared to "drift racing" which seems ... just odd.

I'm not trying to be condescending, I really just don't understand the fascination or popularity at all.

Last edited by Ikaponthus, Thu, 14 Feb 2008 15:28.

Browsing these forums, it seems to be really popular! I can't imagine why it would appeal to sim-racing enthusiasts. Certainly is pretty low on my motoring "to do" list, but I don't know too much about it.

As far as I understand, it's maybe the slowest way to corner and couldn't be too healthy for the car either (let alone burning the tyres)!

I see it on youtube too ... what's with these guys? Why would you want to drive a car slowly and dangerously and rip your tyres to shreds? Okay ... so I suppose it could be fun for a while. But apart from that, are there any practical reasons? Or is it just a glorified burnout?

Serious question, I don't know much about it, I'm not trying to wind anyone up.

Guys, can we please stop voting for NFS now?

It was funny when it was 1 or 2 votes, but 18 is no longer funny or original.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Handling - not like a real car, either at low or high speeds, and the tyre modelling is appalling, even with months of work on the curves. It is flawed at the most basic level.

Sound - Sounds GREAT for 30 seconds. Then you realise you hear the same sample all the time, and can hear different samples fading in and out. Doesn't help your driving.

Graphics - More cartoony than Finding Nemo, and needs a great computer to get acceptable frame rates.

Menus - Slow and blingy. Ideal for teenagers.

Netcode - Slow, laggy, buggy and no better than Crammond's GP2 really


The major fault in GTR2 is the tyre curves. As all racing/driving is about the tyres interaction with the road this is a rather big flaw. The driving experience was improved over GTR1 by making all the curves unrealistic and arcadey, rather than fixing the underlying code.

Okay fair enough! Thanks for the detailed explanation.

Quote from Gil07 :

rFactor graphics are in line with the worst I've ever seen to be honest. LFS with it's so-called terrible graphics beats it hands down

Edit: Voted for LFS and RBR, but haven't really tried GPL or NR2003...

Google "Grand Prix Legends 2004", the demo version is a free download. To make it the full version, all you need to do is copy the original tracks (also freely downloadable) into the tracks directory.

No racing sim enthusiast should be without it! The first and still one of (the?) best.

NR2003 is good fun too if you don't mind oval tracks. I don't.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Mainly the handling, the physics, the graphics and sound. But I'm not keen on the menus or the copy-protections either. Or the modding ethos on some of them. And the netcode is a bit 1980s too.

But other than those things they're great.

Come on!!

What's so bad about them!?

The graphics, surely, you can't fault!! They're beautiful - much better than LFS and run twice as smoothly too (for me anyway). The sound also I think is very good.

The physics ... well, maybe I am not so qualified to comment in that department, but they're good enough to immerse me in any case! I must admit, LFS does have "something" about it that just makes it feel more "real", but it's nothing I can put my finger on ... I can't find any obvious major faults with the physics in GTR2....

Last edited by Ikaponthus, Thu, 14 Feb 2008 14:09.

I wish I didn't put NFS in the poll.

It was a joke supposed to illustrate how bad those games physics are but everyone is voting for it.

Quote from Stefani24 :

didnt drive a car (at least not at a speed with more than 5kmh) yet, so i cant say it, but lfs is the best, the most fun, the biggest online comm., ........

Driving a road car on the street isn't very similar to driving a racing car on a track, don't worry!

Actually, even driving a road car on a track!

Most serious speeding accidents on the road are caused by people who think they could drive a racing car, and think they can drive on the road like it was a racing track. They usually find out they're wrong the hard way.

Quote from gezmoor :

Driving style?

Well in LFS I tend to find myself braking earlier than most, (even people with the same lap times as me), turning in slightly earlier but getting on the throttle earlier too. End result in many races is that someone tail ends me going in to a corner and then blames me for "being slow". Whereas in reality I'm just as fast overall. Usually when I'm following the same person I'll often exit the corner faster than them. In a real race this wouldn't be so much of a problem because seasoned racers understand about hanging back and being aware of the driving style of the guy in front and learning where they can and can't pass by adapting their line etc. In LFS most drivers are very one dimentional, (and ultimately unskilled), in that they have no concept of this and just obstinately hold the same line etc no matter what and then blame the resulting crash on others, usually initiating a vote to ban them too.

In real life, I'm very cautious driver especially under braking. I always brake too early. It's probably the motorcyclist in me, where the results of going in "too hot" are a lot worse than just a little bit of front end slide. I rode bikes for 10 years before getting my car license so it's deeply psychologically engrained behaviour now.

Geez what idiots. That's sad to hear. How can anyone tail-end you and then blame it on you? That's so stupid.

I guess that's what you get from playing against the AI so much...?

If you're slow, they should overtake you - problem solved.

tristancliffe,

Just out of interest mate, what is it about the ISI sims you dislike? Anything in particular?

I've tried GTR2 and R-Factor and I quite like them both.

Genuine question.

P.S. Damn I forgot Richard Burns Rally in the Poll! :-(

Okay ... this is really weird...

As an experiment, I just ran a spectator-race with a full field (can only put 12) cars with everything on full.

The frame rate averaged probably around 45, however at times it would stutter badly for 1-2 second and drop down to 18. I can't pick exactly when or why it is doing this, as often the full field is visible and it's running at 45 fps, but then suddenly drops to 20 fps for a second or two without any obvious rhyme or reason.

Anyway, so I decided to fiddle with the graphics and see if I could get it to run smoother. I did the following.

Z-Buffer Depth to 16 from 24
Shadow type to low res from high res
Sky to 16bit from 32bit
Car and helmet skins to compressed from full.

Now it runs even worse!! Dropping down to 9FPS at times!!

What on earth is going on?

Silly Australian person.

God I hope the NFS votes are a joke.

It's atrocious as far as realism goes. I put it in there for a laugh only. Even for an arcade game I think the physics suck.

Just added the poll.

Yeah, maybe won't get an objective answer. But a bit of fun anyway.



Remembering that LFS is only in alpha mode.