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Quote from Boris Lozac :Yes, SC coming in in the final lap, isn't from this year, from this year there's a SC Line on the pit entrance, that's what people seem to miss here.. In previous years, green flags are not waved straight away when SC goes in, but when first car passes the finish line, in this case Webber, and then the racing is allowed etc.. But this year, since there's that line, green flags are waved then, and everyone thinks that means the racing is now allowed... well it would mean, if it wasn't the final lap, because since it's the final lap, cars have to finish the race AS IF the SC hasn't went into the pits.

You're getting confused

There's a difference between the SC behaviour and the track status

1. SC: Comes in - Track Status: Clear
2. SC: Comes in - Track Status: Still under SC deployment

The green flags would not have been waved if the track was still under SC conditions!!!!! They were meaning the race did not end under SC deployment.
But aren't the green flags always waved when SC comes in, isn't that the right procedure? And the message "SC In this lap" and all that... That doesn't mean they are good to go racing, it's just mean that he's getting out of the way cause it's the finish of the final lap.. it would mean racing and all, if it wasn't final.
#228 - col
Quote from Boris Lozac :But aren't the green flags always waved when SC comes in, isn't that the right procedure? And the message "SC In this lap" and all that... That doesn't mean they are good to go racing, it's just mean that he's getting out of the way cause it's the finish of the final lap.. it would mean racing and all, if it wasn't final.

Talk about going around in circles... lol

No Boris, the green flags are not ALWAYS waved when the SC comes in. They usually are, but on the very special occasions when the race finishes under safety car conditions, green flags are NOT waved when the safety car comes in because the track is still under safety car conditions... that's has happened before, but it didn't this time. That means that safety car conditions were over and the race did not finish under safety car conditions.

Not that you will listen, I get the impression you are trolling big time...

Col
Quote from Boris Lozac :But aren't the green flags always waved when SC comes in, isn't that the right procedure?

I don't think so.

In any circumstances there should be a difference between SC coming in because the track is clear, and SC coming in for pure procedural reason.

Think about it, race drivers are almost hard wired to the idea that Green flag means it is safe, means you are now racing, and racing means taking every opportunity to gain position, if overtaking is not allowed there really should still be a yellow flag...
@ col

lol, i'm not

Just checking some pictures of Australia 2009, SC boards remained even after the final lap, the whole out-lap when drivers cruise to the park ferme.. So, it should've been like that this year too then.. i'm just wondering if that SC line has to with anything and this year beeing different.
Quote from Boris Lozac :Just checking some pictures of Australia 2009, SC boards remained even after the final lap, the whole out-lap when drivers cruise to the park ferme.. So, it should've been like that this year too then.. i'm just wondering if that SC line has to with anything and this year beeing different.

NO! NO! NO! NO! NO!

Because the SC was recalled this year and it wasn't in Australia.
Quote from amp88 :Alonso was also going for it (evidenced by the oversteer coming out of Rascasse) but got caught.

Alonso wasnt going anywhere untill he saw Schumacher along side. He put the boot in smartish & the backend got loose, after he'd realised MC was racing him to the line.
Quote from Mercedes :In the best interests of the sport, Mercedes will not submit an appeal.

Very disappointing decision, IMO. Smacks of saving face/backroom dealing.
this is some serious bull. It was a legal move acoording to their own f'ing rules. It's not like a drive through where the effect of the penalty is debateable. It is very cut and dried as to what the effect of the penalty was. Just admit you made a mistake and fix it goddamnit!
It's always the same with fu..ckin stewards...they dont know anything about their own rules...
Quote from amp88 :NO! NO! NO! NO! NO!

Because the SC was recalled this year and it wasn't in Australia.

Ok, the fact is, SC got into the pits in Australia too.. can you show me what was the procedure then, did he went in with lights on, was there a "SC in this lap" message or what.. it can't be that he just went in without anyone knowing
Quote from tristancliffe :I fully expect Boris to have realised his error on the next page

hows that working out for you?

Quote from Boris Lozac :But aren't the green flags always waved when SC comes in, isn't that the right procedure?

no they arent
green flags are waved when the track is clear not when the safety car comes in for whatever reason like for example if the safety car has engine problems
come on this isnt rocket science were trying to get into your skull here
green flags means the track is clear and the race is on and thats all there is to it
This is what happened at Australia 2009 and what should have happened at Monaco.

Safety car in this lap:


Everyone crosses the line with the SC boards and yellow flags still out:
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Yeah, i saw those pictures... guys, i'm not trying to drive all you crazy here it's just that we're having discussion on our local forum, with some people really into F1, old-school guys.. and i just wanna find out who's right here, they, or you.. They're saying the reason the boards and yellows remained in Australia 2009, was because there was no Safety car Line at the box entrance like this year, in 2009 that "line" was at the end of the lap, meaning SC conditions remained till start/finish line, untill the first car crosses it, but because this year that's not the case, the green flags are waved after that new line, BUT, in the same time because it was the final lap, rule 40.13 came into action.. That's their case, i can see the reasoning behind that version too and behind this one that you're talking about.. I'm just curious as to what's the truth here..

Mercedes agreed that ultimately, it was the proper decision by the stewards:

Quote :"Mercedes GP would like to emphasise that we fully support the inclusion of past drivers on the stewards' panel and are completely satisfied that the Monaco Grand Prix stewards acted professionally, impartially and properly in this matter.

Fact was Green flag was waved, But according to the stupid rules the least punishment he could of got was a 20 second penalty, where as he should of just been kept back to 7th at worse, the loser here was shumacher big time he shouldn't be penalized for the race organizers screwing up.
Quote from amp88 :Very disappointing decision, IMO. Smacks of saving face/backroom dealing.

Nope, it's all they can achieve... The penalty can't be appealed anyway, so forcing the FIA to act is everything they wanted... I don't believe the "in the interest for the sport" for one second - it didn't held anyone back in the past...
Quote from bbman :Nope, it's all they can achieve... The penalty can't be appealed anyway, so forcing the FIA to act is everything they wanted... I don't believe the "in the interest for the sport" for one second - it didn't held anyone back in the past...

Hmm, for some reason I thought that part of the sporting code was changed after the Hamilton/Raikkonen dealio so DTs could be appealed. Boo.
Quote from Boris Lozac :Mercedes agreed that ultimately, it was the proper decision by the stewards:

No, they do not accept the decision was 'proper'. They accepted the process to which the decision was made, but not the actual decision itself. They withdrew the appeal because the penalty can't be over turned and it would do more harm than good if they were to continue.
it's much worse than America's style of "sprint to the line"...

what's the point of pulling the safety car in if one ain't allow to pass another if the safety car came in on the last lap, despite the first safety car line thingy~?
just so the cars would cross the line more quickly then they would have if they were following the safety car~?
Quote from JCTK :what's the point of pulling the safety car in if one ain't allow to pass another if the safety car came in on the last lap, despite the first safety car line thingy~?

I've got to say that's one of the most poorly constructed sentences in the history of the English language.

Quote from JCTK :just so the cars would cross the line more quickly then they would have if they were following the safety car~?

To make it look "better" for TV and season reviews because there's no SC in front of the winner.
Quote from amp88 :I've got to say that's one of the most poorly constructed sentences in the history of the English language.



To make it look "better" for TV and season reviews because there's no SC in front of the winner.

yeah I probably shouldn't have squeeced that into one sentence~

So on a normal restart behind a safety car, drivers can pass others after they crosses the first safety car line. But why should that not be the case when the safety car is coming in on the final lap of a race~?
Given that the flags on track seemed to be at variance with the rules, I'm surprised that Mercedes have withdrawn their appeal.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/h ... t/formula_one/8690323.stm

Sure, put Schumacher back to 7th place, but in view of the circumstances the 20 second penalty still seems harsh to me.
Quote from dungbeetle :Sure, put Schumacher back to 7th place, but in view of the circumstances the 20 second penalty still seems harsh to me.

No penalty is justified even putting him back to 7th. The 20 second penalty is so he can not appeal the decision.
Unfortunately they can't withdraw that kind of decisions, there are numerous other cases in the past that are also fishy, so if you withdraw this one, then someone could say let's look at the previous cases too, and that could go on and on till the first years of F1..

FORMULA 1 GRAND PRIX DE MONACO 2010 (Monte Carlo)
(283 posts, started )
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