The driving I mean

Does anyone have any tips from going from a sequential, two-pedal DFP to a G25?

So far I'm really not getting the hang of using the clutch and H-shifter, there's so much going on at once my brain can't cope.

Quote from Crashgate3 :

So far I'm really not getting the hang of using the clutch and H-shifter, there's so much going on at once my brain can't cope.

... then don't. Racecars aren't usually fitted with an H-gate anyway.

PLUS the H-gate shifter (that comes with G25) is incredibly unrealistic to use anyway. Doesn't even have a low range gearbox in it

I would actually say that most race cars do have H shift transmissions.

Most race cars you see on tv do not.

It just takes some practice Crashgate. You can turn autoclutch on and just shift with the h-shifter and not worry about the clutch. Then once you are comfortable with that turn auto clutch off.

That's what I did and now I only race like that.

It took me a month(back 2 years ago) to get back at my level from a momo.i was 3-4 sec off from myself,but all i can say is practice with the paddles first,than go to H-shift(i`d suggest 240 degree) Than try Fzr with H-shift,so much fun!

It's probably just practice, I'm afraid. I don't mean to depress you, but I think I was faster with my Trust 90 degree advanced vibration feedback wheel. However, I'm having a hell of a lot more fun with the G25. I don't use the H-shifter and clutch in LFS*, but I do use it in GPL etc and while it isn't that realistic it is, again, great fun.

*Well actually, that's not right, I do use it in a weird way. I have the clutch enabled and working, but the auto clutch enabled too. In road cars, I use the clutch to shift up but not down + brake, cuz I'm lazy and in LFS I have problems processing everything as well. (I don't know why I can do it in GPL.) Well, I can use the clutch fine whilst braking, but I'm faster without it and as I take LFS more seriously, that's what I do. I should get training really! Though as I can't race online at the mo, there's not really much incentive.

Quote from AjRose :

Most race cars you see on tv do not.

Then again, this isn't a folk race simulator

MRT does not have, FOX, FO8, FXR, FZR, XRR, XFR,UFR would not have, FBM, BF1 do not have, FZ5 could have paddles in real life...

The point was more about the crappy shifter. Even though the rest of the controllers aren't as realistic as possible the shifter is still the worst part of the G25. So why bother using it? I could just as well put bluetooth on and assign my cellphone buttons for shifting gear.

Just keep doing it and you'll be doing it without thinking within a few weeks. Then you can start throwing in block shifting for braking into tight corners or accelerating down steep slopes, going down two or even three gears at once.

I use full H-shifter, full rotation, no auto clutch, and brakes that lock at any speed if I want.
I may not be the fastest guy all the time but I am faster than most of the people on the track.

If you want to get better just practice. I would not expect the heel-toe routine to be easy but it should work eventually.

Quote from Crashgate3 :

The driving I mean

Does anyone have any tips from going from a sequential, two-pedal DFP to a G25?

So far I'm really not getting the hang of using the clutch and H-shifter, there's so much going on at once my brain can't cope.

I believe LFS has been tweaked so the last part of clutch travel has no effect but its still wrong.

I use DXTweak to make a small band (about 1/3 travel) in the middle of the pedel the only effective part of the travel. A clutch pedal IRL is the same in that the first part and the last part of travel does nothing.

This will stop miss shifts.

If you don't drive stick IRL it will take some getting used to. It is possible to shift fast and clean. Don't fight the stick once moving just ease forwards and back. For most gates you are just moving forwards or backwards and the spring loading to prefer 3-4 does the rest. Its only 2-3 and 4-5 you need a slight side force.

HTH

It needs some grinding noises if you use the clutch wrong and don't engage the gears properly.

Or do racing gearboxes do something clever to stop that happening?

Double Post. DOH!

It took me months to get used to driving with the G25 and H-Shifter after 4years of Keyboard Stabilised, and an FBM BLGP time of 1:13:33. <= 1,13,33 :P

I am lucky though.. I bought the G25 2days after I bought S2. If I would've driven S2 combo's with Ks, it would've taken me even longer to get used to it.

I'm faster with FBM@BLGP now

My tip is: Start getting used to the hardest combination, and you will only be faster in easier combinations.
With this i mean: Start with full manual. No Auto-clutch, H-shifter and 720 degrees of steering.

After a couple of months, drive with autoclutch and paddles, and you'll be faaaast (If you are a good driver :P)

How should I be using the clutch as I change? As fast as humanely possible, or is it more subtle than that? What about flatshifting?

As fast as possible whilst keeping the most speed : > (only applies to racing ofc, not to real life as you have to shift smoothly there)

I first head a Microsoft SideWinder force feedback wheel. Then I got the G25 and I tried to drift.. well, that was one the biggest and quickest fails xD It took me about a month to get used to driving it and now I can drift again.

The G25 has also helped me in my driving lessons as I have done some practising at the parking lot and such. Parking my car forward and backwards etc.

-Any typos are caused by the fact that my eyes are malfunctioning : > (Tired) -

Quote from Crashgate3 :

How should I be using the clutch as I change? As fast as humanely possible, or is it more subtle than that? What about flatshifting?

The clutch is on or off, yeah as quick as you can.

If you have never driven a manual in real life, I guess what you should do it find a track with more straight line braking and do things slowly, just allow yourself to be accustomed to the procedure and timing.

Actually Netkar Pro would be a more ideal training tool because the impact of a bad downchange is more severe in that sim.

My advice is remember that it will help your coordination when you get in to a real manual car. It definitely helped me. I didn't really have to learn to drive as much as I needed to learn the laws of the road, which here in the U.S. are very lenient.

Basically, I just learned to give people the finger.

One more tip from me. Press and release the clutch as fast as humanly possible, this keeps the heat down and makes for faster shifting as clutch slip causes power waste.

Quote from legoflamb :

Basically, I just learned to give people the finger.

Driving with Americans is scary. You never know what someone is going to do. I have been cut off so bad that the front of my car has been UNDER their car, I have been in a truck and cut off where I can't see much of their car.
I have had someone move over FULLY into my lane forcing me into oncoming traffic (I almost sh** myself).
I have had a flatbed truck coming head on at me and I would be dead if I had not moved off into the grass beside the road.
While carrying a load of engines in a large 3/4 Ton Chevy pickup some tard in a Lexus decided to panic stop in front of me. Sadly I hit the brakes and barely stopped in time (brake pedal to the floor). I wanted to see what a Japanese pancake looked like.

Sorry about the O/T. My suggestion for driving in america is to carry a 44 Magnum.

Yes, I do drive a manual car

I think one of the hardest things to get used to is that due to the the lack of g-forces,you don't feel the car lurch if you do a messy shift.

you aren't paying for the clutch in LFS, so who cares :P just thrash the crap thru it

Hell with it, thrash your real life clutch too, its good fun :P

The race cars are to fast to learn how to H shift , IMO .
Start with slow uf1 or similar,you will have loads more time during braking to downshift /upshifts on exit
Don't use the shifter to fast or hard ,learn where the gates are gently.

Blipping the throttle to match revs on downshift helps , but the pedals are not really set up for this out the box,the brake is to soft to proper heel/toe and not close enough to throttle.

Your totally correct about the lag of g-forces ,when messing up a change, your not getting your face slammed against the windscreen to tell you it was messed up .
I found using 'Acceleration shift viewpoint ' settings useful.

Now I use H-shifter for messing around on road cars ,and paddles/auto clutch for racing ,since I don't have a force dynamics rig to give me G

Try a realistic steering wheel angle / lock on front wheels ,as per this thread ,to get real life steering ratio .
Lock on front wheels makes a huge difference to sensitivity.
In the FZR I use 540 steering/21 wheels to give a 12.8:1 ratio .
If you use 25 at the wheel the ratio goes to 10.8:1, much more twitchy.

Dont try and be as fast right away , it will take time .
Patience is a virtue

Quote from mamoru :

.....only applies to racing ofc, not to real life as you have to shift smoothly there

The only time I shift smoothly in my rl car is when I have passengers, other than that I don't care how I change gear smooth or jerky, I'm the only one to complain and jerky shifts remind me that I'm driving a real car

I use a G25 with 720 degrees and no aids whatsoever and that's how I've had it since the day I got my wheel. I started off with the hardest and got used to it after a while. If you drive a car in real life you should fine the G25 dead easy to use in LFS...unless you drive one of those automatic transmissions, like the world seems to be doing these days, getting lazier, people don't want manuals anymore >_<

The above applies for when I started to drive as well, I had 2 drives in my parents car, couldn't get over the power steering so I bought my own car, 5 speed manual without power steering, quite a good car and I don't mind the minor workouts I get, I'm used to it now.

I'm getting better - I spent the weekend practicing and it's starting to come without thinking. The hardest part is downshifting, training my left foot to realise it's on the clutch not the brake. I keep missing shifts because my brain just won't let it push the pedal all the way in, for fear of locking the wheels.

I learnt to drive with the G25. As a 32 year old who never wanted to drive, I could never understand the relationship of the clutch, the gears, the revs and the brake and accelerator.

Now, I'm ready to finally have a solid crack at my license and I reckon it will be a no-brainer... it all clicked after years of watching other people drive, my feet automatically knew what to do!

Now, when I have my license, I can finally take the pilot's lessons that I've always wanted... and what's especially amusing is that I've learnt to properly fly a Cessna using FSX.



Geek ftw!

Um....no. You're in for a *big* shock if you think you're going to be able to jump into a car or plane and just drive/fly them.

I'm not an idiot!

For driving it's learning the rhythm of using the clutch, for flying it's learning the equipment. I know that actually experiencing it irl is going to be a vastly different and nuanced beast.