Quote from Napalm Candy :

Another thing is that is too easy too oversteer a FWD with a default setup, in RL it is harder (not impossible).

There are SOOOOOOOO many FWDs. Just pick the right one.

Quote from atledreier :

That's a pretty heavy car, though, 1150kg plus my fat bum.

It's 2009, you know.
Nowadays "pretty heavy" means 2t +. Heavy is probably a bit under 2t, normal is above 1.5, and your 1150 kg is a lightweight. Damn, even a Polo weighs that much.

The Ferrari California mentioned above is 1735 kg!!! The Evo I mentioned is in this area too.
I think you already need a lot of magic to make it corner like a 1t car with a decent stock suspension.

short reminder:

heel&toe =/= throttle blipping (rev matching) =/= double clutching

Simply put, heel&toe is operating the brake and gas pedals at the same time with the same foot. You might even say it's operating two pedals with one foot at the same time.

Throttle blipping without double clutching doesn't synchronize the gears as the tranny is not affected by the blip.

Even in a synchronized car you feel that it's harder to put in the gear when just throttle blipping on the clutch than when double clutching.

In everday driving, with an unsynchronized tranny you can get quite far without heel&toe: brake down to the desired speed, THEN shift with double clutching & rev matching. Or shift first if your revs are not already this high.

Quote from halo :

LFS is yet far from being "perfect" in general IMO, but its one of the best at its class.

Quote from The Very End :

LFS feels great, and the respons from the car feels right, close to the real thing, but it's still a ocean behind the real deal.

That pretty much sums it up for me. It's like the MSFS quote: "As real as it gets."
That doesn't necessarily mean LFS is ultra-realistic but every other game feels worse. Can't judge IRacing though... it's a shame there is no kind of demo, really.

Quote from logitekg25 :

a Ferrari California's stats against a Benz' amg...they both could barely break .9 Gs.

When I heard about the Lancer Evo doing 0.99 Gs, I was a bit surprised too. On the other hand my logic (which could be wrong) tells me, that pulling off high Gs isn't exactly the heavy cars' territory.

I don't want to imply that LFS is correct, but it wouldn't surprise me if something similar to an XFG with decent tyres and a sporty suspension would "out-G" an AMG.

Think Go-Kart.

Quote from Jakg :

LFS' H-Gate goes from the gear your in, to neutral, then to the gear you want - wheres sequential goes straight to the gear you want (even if your using paddles in an h-gate car).

That means it's impossible to shift quicker than a paddle flicker...

Provided the part in brackets is true (which would have to be changed) it does NOT necessarily mean that gear-neutral-gear is slower than gear-gear.

Using an H-shifter, changing a gear takes these steps:
1 - Push clutch-pedal.
2 - Move gear-lever.
3 - Let out clutch.
So the time it takes from step 1 to step 3 determines your shift time. It doesn't matter how many actions LFS actually does in step 2. In the moment your lever is in gear, the gear's in.

So perhaps semi-automated-h-box (it is NOT sequential) leaves out the neutral, but that's not the only component of shifting.

That's pretty much like saying car A must be faster around the track because it is faster than B around one corner.


edit: ooooh, didn't see Keling's comment. Yeah, short and simple.

not enough power? just a guess. I once had this with a flightsim some years ago. Whenever the graphic-card really had to work, it couldn't get enough power and blacked out. A better power supply did the trick.

Quote from bbman :

You just added to my statement rather than contradicting it, refuting yours yourself in the process... I can't see a discussion unfolding on you coming around and agreeing with me, so no...

Quote from Bandit77 :

If you look at it this way, you also save petrol by using your regular brakes.

~ "Wenn man es so betrachtet, dann spart man auch Treibstoff, indem man die normalen Bremsen benutzt."

Das impliziert eigentlich, dass man durch Bremsen nicht wirklich Treibstoff spart. Was wolltest du überhaupt widerlegen?
Jetzt sieht es übel danach aus, als hättest du einfach etwas gegen mich sagen müssen, obwohl du eigentlich gar nicht anderer Meinung warst. Und um's ein wenig zu verschleiern, kommt sowas wie "on you coming around and agreeing with me". Jaja, klar. Die mag ich besonders. Immer die gleiche Tour.

Quote from MagicFr :

I got the frex GP H-shifter which is closer to real shifter, and it's really slower to shift than G25.

I see your point. But it's also obvious that if the auto-h-shifting was slowed down, you'd still have opponents using G25s...

Quote :

Anyway, i'm not comparing to my or your H-shifter, but to real life shifting. Which, seems to me, way to fast in LFS.
Cheers,

Sure. But the only way to make shifting TIMES more realistic would be a change in the software, so even if you change gears in 0.2 seconds with your G25 it takes 0.3 or whatever in the game. You can't slow down the hardware. The result would be a mismatch between in-game-gearbox and your controller hardware, which again would lead to an unrealistic experience.
Let's face it: there will always be advantages and disadvantages depending on the input-devices you use.

Quote from bbman :

Actually, no... You're even wasting it, as the amount of energy coming from the fuel that previously propelled you along is now turned into useless heat in the brakes...

ok, if you want it this way...
there is always some kind of resistance in a moving system that "wastes" the energy. letting the car roll out and the engine brake it, the the whole engine is part of that resistance. it takes energy to move the pistons up and down. the "energy coming from the fuel that previously propelled you along".
if you wanted to really waste as little as possible (which compared to the two methods already described would be considered as "saving energy/petrol"), you'd have to find the optimal moment to open the clutch, shut down your engine and roll to where you finally want to stop. if you need brakes to stop, you shut down the engine to late. if you don't reach your destination, you shut it down to early.

do we want to continue smart assing?

Quote from MagicFr :

So when you chosse H-Shifter, you can only be SLOWER than autoclutch + seq shifter.
That's a shame, with H-Shifter you take risks to miss a gear, AND you shift slower ... you got the pain, but no gain.
I mean, seq+autoclutch should simulate the use the H-Gate of the car its simulating, right? So it should NOT be faster than real H-Shifter shifting.

Do you have proof that it's slower than the "automated h-shifting"? If YOU are slower than the automated box, it's YOUR fault.
I think the automated box is about as fast as a quick "real" shift with a G25. I never get the feeling I'm slower than an opponent because of my manual shifting.
I agree with you on the mis-shifts though, and putting the G25 in reverse is a pain in the arse. But how do you want to account for this?

Quote from Feffe85 :

by cutting the fuel? in modern fuelinjected cars the fuel is cut at the instant when the engine starts to slow the car down, when enginebraking that is.

Sure, but actually you don't save fuel by engine-braking per se but by lifting off the throttle - which is common sense somehow. If you look at it this way, you also save petrol by using your regular brakes.

Quote from Gentlefoot :

I do find it hard heel-toeing in LFS cos there is no clutch or brake feel unlike in a real car. In real life I heel/toe habitually but in LFS I prefer paddle shift.

It's more due to the lack of acceleration felt thru your body, I reckon. A lot of newer cars have hardly any resistance on the clutch pedal and overpowered brake servos... and still HT isn't much of a problem after a few tries.


I think in LFS you can pretty much forget about HT for the sake of stability as long as you set the braking balance and force according to your driving. I definitely think I'd be faster without HT in LFS... in RL, however, not using HT (or blipping by itself) totally f*cks up my timing

Quote from only.one.RydeR :

I like this, but they should also add an option that would allow you to repair only parts of the car, like left-front or right-rear, something like that.

that's exactly the problem with this suggestion: after we can choose between body and mechanical parts, we want to have certain group of parts, single parts... ... and in the end individual screws.

i hope it will be implented in combination with some speech-recognition.

"pit options... replace outer right brake-pad."

Quote from TexasLTU :

+9876543210123456789

can you say this as a word?

Quote from BastianB :

its the punto. the car design is very similar and even the interior is the same.

but i would think about buying one lol. its as slow as the xfg and even hase the same crappy handling

It's definitely not a Punto. Maybe the interior partially is from a Punto Mk1, but that's about all. There's no 1.4 16v engine used in any Punto before 2003 (Mk2b) and even then it "only" produces 95 hp and revs to 6500. As for the handling, it's pretty hard to tell as the XFG is so highly adjustable. The XFG obviously IS a hatchback and handles like one, but I wouldn't say it's typically Punto at all - and I've driven lots of different ones.

"Crappy handling"... you know dog-poo.

Quote from rainspecialist :

hmmm too bad as none of those cars are available in the us i guess ill have to keep looking

The look of the car is very close to a Citroën AX.
http://cx.zapto.org/albums/album14/Citroen_ax_gt_01.jpg

Specs-wise I'd bet on some Japanese product like Suzuki Swift.

So if you want something similar, go check out the Jap cars.

@ not sure: do your desktop-speakers start to smell when the clutch of your LFS-car is overheated?



to the main topic: A customizable info-screen would be nice.

Quote from Nathan_French_14 :

Jack found a good way to embarass people that you know have stole your skin. I believe he overwrote his skin, with one which said "DONT USE YOUR BRAKES! USE ME!!" and "IM A SKIN STEALER! RAM ME!" etc. So when it downloaded for people, they see that skin, but the guy using it see's the original skin he stole. I dont have pics, but im sure jack will post some if he sees this.

that's a nice trick IF the stealer uses your skin directly from your account. If he uses the one that has been downloaded to his PC and uploads it to his account, however, it has no effect.

@TVE: I think that rsnake actually meant you upload a blurry, lo-res skin to the server for the public. that's the skin everyone will see as it is downloaded from the server.
additional, you have a nice hi-res skin on your harddrive (= not accessible for others).
result: all opponents look ugly, you look nice... at least on your end of the connection.

we could do this right away, or - as I already suggested - you upload ANY kind of skin you don't bother being stolen, and keep your precious skin with the same name only on your hard drive.
result: others see you in a skin, however not in your sunday clothes. You see yourself the way you want to. The only skin that can be stolen is the one you uploaded.

But THIS CANNOT BE THE POINT OF THE WHOLE SKIN THING .

If I have to look at random ugly low-res or any other half-hearted skins, I might as well not download them and use a collection of own resp. gathered skins from my harddrive for my opponents... just like the AI-package, that contains some really fine liveries.

start up the sims.

wake up, take a shower, put on racing clothes, go to the kitchen, make breakfast, have breakfast, clean the dishes, take out the garbage, go in front of your house. save game.

shut down the sims.

start up NFSU2 or similar.

choose a car, drive from where you are to the airport or anything that looks a bit like a race track surrounding. save game.

shut down NFSU2 (or whatever you've chosen).

start up LFS.

race.

shut down LFS.

start up NFSU2 (or whatever you've chosen).

load your savegame. drive to where ever you came from. save game.

shut down NFSU2 (or whatever you've chosen).

start up the sims.

load savegame. go inside your house. cook dinner. call your sim-girlfriend. relax on the bed. do the thing that is not called f*cking in the game. sleep.

repeat from top.

Quote from Joris :

...still a Golf on steroids...

Actually more like a Golf VI that escaped a scrap press.

Quote from JasonJ :

Still looks like a manga version of Prince Charles.

Just keeping the opinion balanced.

Most people who don't like the Scirroco don't read Scirroco-threads.

Quote from liveforspeedskins.tk :

[...] this is a racing sim. [...]
However the R has 350 Nm torque [...]

A quick way to pillory skin-stealers would be to make a dedicated thread, where the victims could post a screenshot of the skin that was stolen and mention the name of the driver.

Rude, but so is stealing skins. Might at least scare off a bunch of people.


Technically (as has been said), you cannot completely prevent skin stealing. It's like streaming media: if you see it / hear it, it is somewhere on your computer and therefore only a step away. Of course you can enlarge this step a bit.

The possibility to tag your skins as "private" right from your account would not make it impossible at all to steal the source file of your skin, but at least people couldn't use it directly from your account by just typing in the right name for the skin.

On the other hand - almost as a benefit - you would have a pool of true "public" skins (maybe browseable?), and many potential skin-thief would possibly rather look thru this "legal" supply first than steal a private skin.

Edit: not showing your real personal skin to other racers wouldn't be an option to me. Isn't this exactly the point of making skins? If you want to hide your skin, you can always upload one skin and use another with the same name.

Quote from DragonCommando :

Try running without wheel turn compensation if you arn't already.

Thanks for the tip. I already knew and tried different settings. It doesn't help.

Quote from Bob Smith :

Let's face it, floor the throttle out of a tight corner and the FXO might as well have 1 degree of steering lock.

... not with our beloved locked-diff setups.

seriously, I don't think this has anything to do with being used to spool up the turbo.

and how much of the time Ayrton was an F1 driver was in the turbo era?
He started in 1984 and in 1988 turbos were gone. 1994 he died.

One benefit of greater wheel-lock would be a more direct feel when using a 900°-controller, without decreasing the controller's range.

It's really strange that I have to turn the wheel quite a bit more than in real life, where most cars even have more than 900° of steeringwheel rotation (but probably more wheel lock). On the other hand my car doesn't seem to have lots of wheel lock (parking...) and 900° steeringwheel rotation and still you don't have to turn as much as in the XFG for example. I had to restrict the controller to 540° to make LFS feel closer to real life at least in this respect. Something's fishy...

So basically, if a real life FXO-like car only has 30° wheel-lock, then something can't be quite right in LFS. If it has more, and the FXO has some kind of "restricted race lock" then the wheel most probably wouldn't turn 900° either, because it would make the steering less direct than that of the tame road version.

Well, that doesn't answer the original question, but it implies that the answer is most probably not "because it's like this in reality".

So why is it?
And - while we're already there - why do I have to turn more?


btw: scrabby, it took me a couple of seconds to get your avatar, really.

next time you have such a question, he might help you:

Quote from NightShift :

I agree, but I'm not sure you would get to heat rear brakes that much even in a long-ish race, seeing that bias is most often than not set between 72 and 77% IIRC.

The front ones would fade out first anyway IMO.

Totally agree. I used to have a small cookie-box with discs in the front and drums in the back that I "raced" up and down the hills and passes. I soon mounted better discs (with holes and stuff) in the front as I really killed the stock ones. But even after this, the front brakes would give up first and I had to be careful because the back would lock up first.

Quote from Nathan_French_14 :

Yes, they do. Its just the noise's we are missing now.

Suspension noise would be a little pointless imo. The tracks are alot smoother than RBR (obviously). Im not saying the suspension does'nt move, but i just dont think that in a race enviroment, your gonna hear the suspension, especially when doing over 100mph in most cars compared to RBR.

South City. I bet a lot of cars would go plonk plonk plonk there.