Good to hear, fingers crossed for a devkit, keep us posted how it goes.
Since it seems very likely for VR to hit the mass consumer markets early next year, it wouldn't hurt to have implementations ready to go for both of the competing devices.
HTC Vive - VR headset form HTC and Valve - what do you think Scawen?
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Good to hear, fingers crossed for a devkit, keep us posted how it goes.
Since it seems very likely for VR to hit the mass consumer markets early next year, it wouldn't hurt to have implementations ready to go for both of the competing devices.
I'd be confident that Scawen would get a dev kit. Valve knows that the key to their success with the VR stuff is developer adoption, and Valve has the bank to make it happen, especially given LFS is a well established project versus many indie game developers.
I should get one in the next week or so! 
Right now I'm working hard to get the dynamic car reflections to a releasable state.
Right now I'm working hard to get the dynamic car reflections to a releasable state.
Not jealous at all!
Happy to hear that.
If rumors are true December 8th is the release date for the consumer Vive, so not much time left.
Do you plan to do anything with the motion controllers for LFS?
If rumors are true December 8th is the release date for the consumer Vive, so not much time left.
Do you plan to do anything with the motion controllers for LFS?
Not planning that at the moment. I'm guessing they aren't much use for driving a car. But I really don't know what they are like. Main focus will be implementing standard VR support, hopefully through the same interface as the Rift, though I really don't know how it works with the Vive yet.
Congrats for getting a devkit, Scawen. Well deserved given your previous success with VR development.
In my opinion, based on what I've seen and tried so far, motion detection/controllers still need a few more years worth of development to get their latency and resolution to be good enough. However in due time, they will be a great match for VR.
I also wouldn't bet on seeing a hard launch of the Vive this year.
In my opinion, based on what I've seen and tried so far, motion detection/controllers still need a few more years worth of development to get their latency and resolution to be good enough. However in due time, they will be a great match for VR.
I also wouldn't bet on seeing a hard launch of the Vive this year.
That's good news Scawen. Glad you've got a kit on the way. It would be great once you get into it to spare a couple of mins and mention how it compares to the dk2? Obviously I know the Vive will be better and similar to the consumer rift but it would be nice to get your views. You know the genre inside out and I value your opinion. It's hard to find any info comparing the differences as most reviews are by press journalists that know nothing about the technology etc.
Good news.
Just so you know, I have received the Vive developer kit.
I have taken it out of the box. It's more elaborate than the Rift, as there are two laser emitting base stations that the headset senses, for positional tracking. In contrast, the Rift developer kit uses a single camera to sense the location of the headset. The reason for the Vive's different approach is that it is designed for room scale VR. For our purposes in a seated simulator, I don't think that is relevant.
The Vive comes with two hand held 3D tracking controllers with a couple of buttons and a trigger on each one. I'm sure they are fun for many types of game but I don't see much use for them in a driving simulator.
So it seems to me the Vive has more capabilities in its current form, but is more difficult to set up.
I had to install Steam in order to install the SteamVR software. Unfortunately that is as far as I have got because the headset requires a power supply but the transformer requires a US socket. It can take up to 240 volts though, so I've ordered a US to UK adapter and hopefully can proceed when that arrives in a few days. For now I've put it all back in the box to keep it safe!
I have taken it out of the box. It's more elaborate than the Rift, as there are two laser emitting base stations that the headset senses, for positional tracking. In contrast, the Rift developer kit uses a single camera to sense the location of the headset. The reason for the Vive's different approach is that it is designed for room scale VR. For our purposes in a seated simulator, I don't think that is relevant.
The Vive comes with two hand held 3D tracking controllers with a couple of buttons and a trigger on each one. I'm sure they are fun for many types of game but I don't see much use for them in a driving simulator.
So it seems to me the Vive has more capabilities in its current form, but is more difficult to set up.
I had to install Steam in order to install the SteamVR software. Unfortunately that is as far as I have got because the headset requires a power supply but the transformer requires a US socket. It can take up to 240 volts though, so I've ordered a US to UK adapter and hopefully can proceed when that arrives in a few days. For now I've put it all back in the box to keep it safe!
Amazon Prime... Or, bike to the shop
I don't really mind a few days wait as I'm deep in other work that needs to be finished ASAP.
A bit of a busy time at the moment...
A bit of a busy time at the moment...
That was quick. No, wait... actually it's been nearly 8 months since you first applied for a DevKit. Oh well it's never too late for some free hardware.
Are base stations wireless - if not - how long are the cables?
That's a shame. DK2 power supply had 5 adapters for all kinds of power sockets, which was nice.
How is the weight of the headset? Is it lighter than DK2?
The base stations also must be plugged in to the mains and these did come with a UK adapter. They come with a 50 foot sync cable to allow them to be placed at opposite ends of a large room. I don't think they connect with the computer in any way. Apparently this is only for the developer edition as you can see on these instructions:
http://www.polygon.com/2015/6/8/8747067/valve-vive-manual-instructions-virtual-reality
I'll check the weights when I next get it out of the box. The weight seemed OK in my hand. Though I think in a few years all these ancient headsets will seem heavy...
http://www.polygon.com/2015/6/8/8747067/valve-vive-manual-instructions-virtual-reality
I'll check the weights when I next get it out of the box. The weight seemed OK in my hand. Though I think in a few years all these ancient headsets will seem heavy...
Awesome, can't wait to see what you the developers have been up to. Fingers crossed LFS gets another nice update soon!
Wow, I just can't wait for this, it's going to be great! Just what LFS needs!
Gotta say; thanks Scawen, for being the most onto-it developer out there. No exaggeration whatsoever! LFS is the only finished game, racing or otherwise, that works seamlessly in VR, and perfectly every time. Never any loose ends 
Elite: Dangerous was a close contender, up until the point they told everyone not to upgrade to Win10 and the latest SDK or else they could suck it. They won't be doing any more VR updates until Oculus releases the V1.0 SDK, so I can't/don't play it any more, and might not ever again, given their attitude.
Just out of interest, what's the Vive's SDK version at, and when do they predict their V1.0 will be ready?
Elite: Dangerous was a close contender, up until the point they told everyone not to upgrade to Win10 and the latest SDK or else they could suck it. They won't be doing any more VR updates until Oculus releases the V1.0 SDK, so I can't/don't play it any more, and might not ever again, given their attitude.
Just out of interest, what's the Vive's SDK version at, and when do they predict their V1.0 will be ready?
Thanks, Shirtkicker. I'll try to make sure LFS always works well in VR.
Valve's SDK is currently 0.9.11 as you can see on this link, but I don't know anything about their release plans.
https://github.com/ValveSoftware/openvr
Valve's SDK is currently 0.9.11 as you can see on this link, but I don't know anything about their release plans.
https://github.com/ValveSoftware/openvr
When did LFS get labeled as a finished game? Was I under a rock when S3 or V1.0 came out? Damn.
S3 is since many years now simply a CONTENT ACCESS level, NOT a FEATURE ACCESS level. Scawen has said so sometime around 2009 or late 2008. Likewise, just being version 1.0 doesn't mean a software product is finished...usually yes, but software developers can use their own version numbering system.
I think you misunderstood him a bit. The "S3 license" (what you buy) is content access level. Not the S3 LFS release. I.e. there are new features planned for S3, some of them already in development (tyres physics
), but these will be released across all players (demo, S1, S2 and S3), so that's why the S1/S2/S3 licenses are not feature access levels, but content levels.New S3 LFS will be available (if it will be ever released) to all players in the same flavour with the same features. The license of player then only adjust cars/tracks you have available in the game.
(it has been like that since the start, so S2 was released in the same way, all features available to S1 players, only content limited).
Oh boy. Let me elaborate since it was clearly misunderstood. The game is still being developed in the form of tracks, cars, graphics, and physics.
If you think this is a complete/finished game, LOL.
If you think this is a complete/finished game, LOL.
but he meant "finished" in terms of wrapping the VR experience. Most of the VR SW available right now is sort of on technology demo level, as there's not even consumer version of Oculus in market, so it's all moving thing in development... LFS is one of the few games which is sort of finished in VR support, without obvious shortcomings.
That's what he meant by "finished" (IMO).
That's what he meant by "finished" (IMO).
How do you define a complete/finished game, dear American?
HTC Vive - VR headset form HTC and Valve - what do you think Scawen?
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FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG