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Head gasket change
(15 posts, started )
Head gasket change
I've got a 94 Honda Civic with 185k on it. Just pulled the head half an hour ago due to blown head gasket (I think you folks new I had a blown gasket.)

I paid $20 for the car and it has 185k on it, I'm not taking the head in for anything. I'm just putting a new gasket on and putting it back together.

Everything looks good to me. I did look at the head for level and it looked good to me. Just a quick question of what should I do while the head is off? One cylinder is full of water (about an inch of water) that I need to suck out of there somehow. I cleaned the head and cleaned the block where the gasket will go. Mating surfaces look good. I can see that the intake is filthy and thickly grimey, but I couldn't reach the bolts to remove the intake to clean it well.

What flows around the cylinders in the block? Is it oil? Is it coolant? I don't know, I've got both puddled up there, LOL.

What would you recommend as far as fluid changes? Should I drain and refill coolant and oil and run it for a day (work and back is basically a 40 mile round trip) and change again? Any specific amount of time I should do a 2nd fluid change? Just start it up and run down the road to get it to operating temps and change?

It wasn't too bad. The shop quoted me around $800-900 to change the gasket and timing belt. I can get the gasket kit (all gaskets needed) for $80 and I think the belt is $30. That's quite a savings, and it only took me a few hours to pull it. Most of that time was me standing there scratching my head (no pun intended) trying to come up with a way to get my hand in where a bolt I needed off, hehe.

Oh yeah, I've got 1 issue. I pulled the plugs and could not get one of them broke loose. Anyone have a trick to getting it loose? I'm not sure if there was anti-siege put on them or not when they were changed last, I've only had the car a few months.
#2 - kaynd
You sould have drained the coolant before taking off the cylinder head.

Just drain everything and refill it folowing the workshop manual instructions. No need to do a 2nd fluid change.
I hope you where joking about what fluid goes were in the block.

I am curius how you mannaged to unbolt that crankshaft pulley bolt... it's quite a pain if you havn't the proper tools.

Use a torque wrench and follow the right order wile tightening them. (workshop manual again) Applying a thin layer of copper spray on both sides of the head gasket will help it seal safer, especially now because of the cleaned by hand surfaces.

workshop manual can be found here -> http://hondatech.info/
sounds pretty bad
you might want to get yourself a large enough sanding block to get the head and block level (since youve been running it with the broken gasket for quite a while you can be fairly certain it wont be level) seeing as the engine isnt anything special a slight bit of sanding should cause you any problems
its also generally not a bad idea to get new head screws

this is the most important bit: get your hands on the service manual so you get the order and torque for tightening the headbolts correct and make sure you get the valve timing correct when you put the timing belt back on
Quote :What flows around the cylinders in the block? Is it oil? Is it coolant?

both, in separate holes. that's why the head cylinder is really important. if oil and coolant leaks into the cylinder, it'll smell really gross. if oil and coolant mix and the engine can't properly cool itself, game over.

Quote :One cylinder is full of water (about an inch of water) that I need to suck out of there somehow.

either take the whole engine out, and dump it out when you have the head off, or the better idea...

disconnect power to the fuel pump, and take out all your spark plugs, crank the engine for a few minutes and let all that water shoot out the spark plug hole. take off the head and let the rest dry up.
Quote from kaynd :You sould have drained the coolant before taking off the cylinder head.

Hmm, there was no coolant left in the radiator. No reason to drain.

Quote :I hope you where joking about what fluid goes were in the block.

Yes, just joking because I have both coolant and oil sitting in the area around the cylinders in the block.

Quote :I am curius how you mannaged to unbolt that crankshaft pulley bolt... it's quite a pain if you havn't the proper tools.

Why unbolt the crankshaft? For the timing belt? Timing belt is just incased in a plastic cover and has a tensioner on it to loosen the belt. Mine just slipped off anyways with a little work. Will probably have to loosen the tensioner up to get a new one on though.
#7 - Osco
Quote from Shotglass :sounds pretty bad
you might want to get yourself a large enough sanding block to get the head and block level (since youve been running it with the broken gasket for quite a while you can be fairly certain it wont be level) seeing as the engine isnt anything special a slight bit of sanding should cause you any problems
its also generally not a bad idea to get new head screws

this is the most important bit: get your hands on the service manual so you get the order and torque for tightening the headbolts correct and make sure you get the valve timing correct when you put the timing belt back on

real good idea to sand the deck. Motors love metal shavings in oil passages.
New head studs for a $20 car? I bet those studs alone are way more than that. Clean it up with some brakecleaner for the intake manifold or just put the head in de dishwasher
#8 - kaynd
Quote from mrodgers :Why unbolt the crankshaft? For the timing belt? Timing belt is just incased in a plastic cover and has a tensioner on it to loosen the belt. Mine just slipped off anyways with a little work. Will probably have to loosen the tensioner up to get a new one on though.

Unbolt the crankshaft pulley I said, not the crankshaft.
http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/5931/picture3181.jpg
I must have guessed wrong that you have a D series motor then.
[edit] or you just didn't have the lower plastic cover?

Quote from mrodgers :Hmm, there was no coolant left in the radiator. No reason to drain.

There was no coolant at all? then how you mannaged to flud a cylinder?
Quote from Osco :real good idea to sand the deck. Motors love metal shavings in oil passages.

yeah because obviously you wont clean it up afterwards
if the engines been running with the broken gasket long enough to burn off all the water id be surprised if there wasnt some damage to the head and or block at the point where the gasket failed that requires flattening of both

Quote :New head studs for a $20 car? I bet those studs alone are way more than that.

replacing some of the most critical bolts on an engine... what an outlandish idea what was i thinking?
Quote from Osco :real good idea to sand the deck. Motors love metal shavings in oil passages.
New head studs for a $20 car? I bet those studs alone are way more than that. Clean it up with some brakecleaner for the intake manifold or just put the head in de dishwasher

You type alot of shit sometimes.
Quote from kaynd :Use a torque wrench and follow the right order wile tightening them. (workshop manual again) Applying a thin layer of copper spray on both sides of the head gasket will help it seal safer, especially now because of the cleaned by hand surfaces.

Not just any torque wrench though, you want an angular torque wrench too. Torque the stretch bolts (USE A NEW SET, ONCE USED THEY SHOULD BE BINNED AND REPLACED!) up first in a diagonal arrangement, starting inside out, then replace the normal torque wrench for the angular kind and refer to the manual for the tightening routine, Autodata is good for this sort of stuff, nip them all up.
If he has a D series engine, and concidering the low value of that car, he can use the same bolts and any kind of torque wrench Honda workshop manual gives only tightening order and torque.

It's a pretty safe setup... nothing is really stressed. The only thing that can go wrong now has to do with the possibility of a "bent" cylinder head or block due to overheating in the past. This might prevent the new flange from sealing.
It was recommended to me for this car to replace the bolts, but not required. I've read plenty now of claims on the net that folks have reused the head bolts on a Civic 1.5L (once obviously.) I would have to order the bolts through Honda as I can't find them at any parts shop and it would be a while. I need a car (or should say, Wifey needs her car back) and it only has to get me through the summer. It has a million miles, though if it weren't for the head gasket, it runs fantastic, and it cost me nothing to acquire. I'll just reuse the bolts.

I did find out that the head gasket had been previously replaced at 93,000 miles.

I also saw (stated previously) no indication of warpage. I worked in quality control for 7 years and went to school for Metrology, which is the science of measurements, so I am pretty sure there is no warpage in the head/block.
Risky business reusing stretch bolts, but if you want to risk it, crack on.

All you need is a good straight edge and light to check for warping. If it is marginal you could get away with just sanding it down.
If you are not going to disassemble it more (removing the crank), you probably want to flush it with some cleaning liquid{1}, since there is probably{2} a lot of oil/water sludge stuck here and there that will cause problem with the oil cooling in the future.

{1} some say diesel, I do not know
{2} if the engine whipped the oil and water mix to a cream or not

I find it unlikely that the head is straight and smooth, my guess it that its the heads fault that the gasket broke, i.e that the head was not pushing evenly on the gasket and the gasket broke where there were too low preassure.

I'm not an expert, just suggesting some "check there carefully" before proceding.

Head gasket change
(15 posts, started )
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