Hello Racers and Teams:

Here is the official car balancing for the 2010 Grand Touring Amateur League.

FZR 20%
FXR 23%
XRR 24%

UPDATE Oct 29: XRR has had its ballast removed. It now is required to only run 24%.

This is subject to change should a patch come out mid-season. For now, we will be taking this route.

Considering XRR is more fragile (example last igtc race - 2/3 DNFs are XRR, very good teams), it stucks in sand, it flips easily on high curbs, shorter races than in moe (so fuel advantage is less important).. with 25% XRR is out of competition.

25% on the XRR are too much. 20%-22% would be more fair. The XRR arent the at all the fastest car on track, at least if you dont know how to drive it. And we have to remember that this isnt MoE, but GT"amateur"L. Not all are the best drivers.

Just my opinion

Quote from Flingoko :

25% on the XRR are too much. 20%-22% would be more fair. The XRR arent the at all the fastest car on track, at least if you dont know how to drive it. And we have to remember that this isnt MoE, but GT"amateur"L. Not all are the best drivers.

Just my opinion

The XRR is the only one that can run R2s all round without a problem (unlike FXR and FZR) and it´s not using that much fuel either. 20% wouldn´t be enough, I´d go more for what deko has put up there. Either 25% or 24% or 24% with a small weight penalty. Still don´t think that many will actually use the XRR of the FXR to be honest.

24% with kg's or 25% in my opinion, because of the reasons stated above.

24% would be much better fzr clearly has the edge at most tracks, with the exception of we1.

Scipy has done some serious testing with quite some fast people and he says 25% is the best balance over the whole stint. You can't get perfect balance for all cars, fzr wille be quicker here, xrr there.

Apart from that, you have to concider some other aspects apart from pure speed like fuel and tire consumption (which is better on the xrr) sequential shifter (fxr, xrr) etc. The biggest problem is the xrr getting stuck in a gravel trap, but you can't balance that as it's a clear driving error.

// We had this discussion also in MoE (thats why it took us so long with the balance). In the end you have to trust a few really stupidly fast people (over a longer distance) running several different settings and not the teams driving in the league as harsh / mean that might sound. //

Who the hell are you?

I think 24% is best, just to be different from MoE. The FXR was 23% last year, so maybe even make that 22% for a laugh and see what it's like.

that's right boothy, let's punish FZR for nothing

For nothing? The FZR owned the other cars at each track with the previous restrictions (currently the MoE ones), so taking 1% off the FXR and XRR would be a good move.

Quote from Deutschland2007 :

The XRR is the only one that can run R2s all round without a problem (unlike FXR and FZR) and it´s not using that much fuel either.

On BL1r it can't run on R2s.

Quote from arrowkart4 :

24% would be much better fzr clearly has the edge at most tracks, with the exception of we1.

We have seen enough races to know that with 25% the XRR is clearly worse than FZR (GTAL 2009 and MOE 2009)
I mean... you just can't deny this! The XRR can flip, has turbo lag, worse COG...
Tires are a big problem with the GT2 version of this car too... On the tracks like AS4 you CAN put R2 but you have to be very careful if you want to. I'm not even talking about other tracks like WE1 or FE4 where doing a race with R2 is nearly impossible do you have to put R3 with a very low pressure which is bad in the straights...

hum...restriction, always a problem ^^

FXR with 23% is quite fast ! Just have to check Ceskomasai from R2R ! He is as fast as MoE aliens with it ! XRR with 24% will be so fast in AS4 or WE1 ! I think the best is to put some kg on FZR

Quote from boothy :

For nothing? The FZR owned the other cars at each track with the previous restrictions (currently the MoE ones), so taking 1% off the FXR and XRR would be a good move.

how about, maybe noone pushed xrr and fxr to their limits

Quote from boothy :

For nothing? The FZR owned the other cars at each track with the previous restrictions (currently the MoE ones), so taking 1% off the FXR and XRR would be a good move.

I second that.

FZR 20%, FXR 23%, XRR 24%, lets go racing..

Personally I'd rather have the XRR pwnting than yet another FZR FTW League.

Quote from racer hero :

FZR 20%, FXR 23%, XRR 24%, lets go racing..

I agree with you

FZR GT2 *can* run R2s on selected tracks, just like XRR can on selected tracks.

Want to try something different?

20, 22+15kg, 24+15kg

24% alone has proven to be faster than FZR at KY3, but that's also because it was running R2s unlike the FZR that was tested at 20%.

With that +15kg don't plan on running R2s.

@Niki: Lets see you push it to the limit then.

Quote from PMD9409 :

FZR GT2 *can* run R2s on selected tracks, just like XRR can on selected tracks.

Want to try something different?

20, 22+15kg, 24+15kg

24% alone has proven to be faster than FZR at KY3, but that's also because it was running R2s unlike the FZR that was tested at 20%.

With that +15kg don't plan on running R2s.

@Niki: Lets see you push it to the limit then.

I'm liking the theory Phil. Worth a test at least..........(hint hint, Jack :razz

Quote from Wilko868 :

I'm liking the theory Phil. Worth a test at least..........(hint hint, Jack :razz

Lets have some decent drivers test it...

I drove myself up from being a lap behind top 10, in 24th position with FXR, and drove myself up to top 10 (I think I was 8th or 9th?) with FXR... It wasnt much slower... my fastest lap was .1-.2 behind the fastest time set by spdo (if I remember correctly, at least when I was at the track), so the FXR is more than competitve (at least on SO). The FXR is also way more easy to drive, so imo it should stay at 23%. And I agree with Niki and Scipy (and the guy who had talked with Scipy etc?) Last year, there wasnt any competitive teams in the XRR, and thats the main reason why it didnt win. 25% might be too harsh, what do I know, but 24% will be too less again... So 24% with kg's maybe? Or 25% as MoE. There must be a reason for why MoE kept 25%, right?

Not that I don't trust the MoE decision, I just have a desire to make sure we've done what we can do.

Anyone who is interested in helping run some of these settings next week or at this weekend, please post here or PM me. We'll work something out. If you want, just put on some of the following and run a bit, preferably as close to a full stint as you can.

FZR 20%
FXR 23%
FXR 22%+15 kg
XRR 24%
XRR 24% + 15kg
XRR 24% + 10kg
XRR 25%

If you decide to run on your own time, that's fine, just send me an mpr or spr with your run. Fell free to try multiples on the tracks for this season.

May try to do an organized test session next week if enough can commit.

d

Quote from PMD9409 :

@Niki: Lets see you push it to the limit then.

My driving style got totally adopted to FZR over the years and I'm not such talent to change that over night. So when I come to the corner I use FZR brake / accelerate points, instead of earlier and more oversteery turbo lagged car points. Even if I set my mind to change this, it still isn't fast enough.
I'm not too worried about this, since I've been enjoying FZR the most since ever.

FZR 21%
FXR 24%
XRR 25%

I have no scientific or practical basis for this, however when I read it out loud in my mind it sounds very neat and balanced.