A friend of mine uses that thing to steer his car in lfs because he is in a wheelchair/bed and is only able to move his head. But how can this gadget simulate a look to the side? You turn your head and still have to look to the monitor in front of you? Sounds kind of silly/unrealistic to me.
Of course, youre right but just have a look at some people in this and many other threads regarding this issue. They want to get rid of that view completely. Now as same as many users start with mouse or keyboard also many users could start with the chase view, even if its just once in a while to get a better feeling or to see how the vehicle is reacting in several situations (weight transfer, behaviour under braking or acceleration, tire deformation blah blah) Besides, if its really that useless why would we have a discussion about it?
I agree. Lets just respect each others opinions about it and see what will happen. And trust me, it was not my intention to manipulate anything rather then that was i just curious about some people's opinions but none answered yet. They demand to get rid of a simple view which has no influence on them whatsoever so im just curious about how far they would really go...but anyway i dont really care anymore. I think its the last time im replying into a thread like this where its obvious that there cant be a conclusion without the developers opinions.
Of course not, but then - I don`t race in real life eighter, and there is not many on this forum that does eighter. People scream about beeing hardcore racers, and like none of them have tried to actually race in real life.
He's not referring to racing, he's referring to driving. Ever driven a road car, on the road, attached to a bendy 20ft pole sticking out the back window? In cannot be more realistic or better for car feel than being in the car, otherwise real drivers would do it. If you can't understand weight-transfer in the car, being on a bendy pole ain't gonna help ya.
And what has this to do with the god damn case or topic?
All we are asking for is a chase veiw mirrow, and I canot be bottered with hearing, special you but others too, saying realistic this realistic that. I really don`t give a shit whats realistic, no games are realistic, I don`t care, just hope we can get a mirrow so people like you can stop bitching and saying that chase-veiw users are a hasard on track since they can`t see whats happend around, specially behind them.
It has everything to do with this topic. Can we have a mirror in follow view? Folks are stating their opinions on why we shouldn't, because that view shouldn't be used in a simulation of driving a race car. You don't care about what is realistic because there are no games that are realistic? Well then, let's be a bit more politically correct for you. LFS isn't a racing game, it is a simulator of driving a race car and is being developed so that it is the best simulation of driving a race car. So, driving in chase view is less of a simulated feel of driving then viewing from the cockpit.
Since realism isn't important, I hear GT5 is coming and from the screenshots, it seems that it is being touted as the best thing since sliced bread. Looking at screenshots, the majority of game playing folks can determine that it would be the most realistic since the physics of the driving seems to have nothing to do with it being realistic. I'm sure GT5 has a fantastic chase view.
Maybe, if you don't care about realism, you'd be better off with NFS or rFactor? Why do you play LFS if it isn't for the realism? It's not the easy driving, or the great modding capabilities...
Your English and spelling have got a lot worse recently - who are you, and what have you done with the real "The Very End"?
Can you please stop that totally silly realism discussion?
Major fact is that we sitting in front of a monitor, using a machine that only knows 0 and I and that machine creats a feeling of driving around.
I don´t speak in a car by pressing the left CTRL-key, I do not calibrate my wheel in the car everytime i want to drive. Last time I hit the wall on the road I did not SHIFT+S because I was dead and so on. It´s a damn computer program, nothing else. So leave me alone with that stupid realism discussion. If you don´t want to drive in chase view - fine - just don´t do it and shut up! I don´t like cockpit view and I don´t care what others do. Even tire view is fine for me if I can have nice close races with them.
Sometimes I´m thinking all the chase view haters think we have a advantage and that is maybe the reason to ban this view.
edit: View discussion and oval discussion sounds the same sometimes...Ovaaaaaal
First off, my grammar and english itself has allways been bad, if it have turn out to be worse then before, well then I feel sorry for myself.
Secondly - I care about realism, but I want to point out that no games, what so ever are close to beeing realistic. You may fllame me for that, but it`s true.
Anyway, as I said, I care about the realism in the game, how the car handles, feels and such, but I think that the camera veiws shouldn`t been taken into considering when we talking about realism.
Of course, you get a more realistic feeling if your sitting in the car instead of flying behind it, but it does not, what-so-ever changes anything else that is consider as physics or relistic.
It's not silly - realism is why we play LFS. It might not be realistic, but it's more realistic than anything else. Removing any scrap of realism by floating behind the car is the whole point of this thread, so it's not a silly realism discussion.
As opposed to sitting in a car which doesn't even know 0 and 1 and gives the feeling of driving a car, only with more cost and more danger?
Neither do I, in LFS or real life
Neither do I, in LFS or real life. I do however spend several hours setting my car up before driving it, which I don't in LFS, and we're not suggesting that!
You don't like the realism discussion because you can't do it. You play the easiest car on the easiest track, letting only the experienced people get near you (by banning everyone else), so I don't expect you to have a concept of what it's really like driving a race car. This discussion is too much for you, so it's you that should leave it, not I.
No, you have a HUGE disadvantage, in not being 'connected' to your car. You will always be later in reacting to slides. The only advantage you have is that on the odd occasions when you are actually racing (oval doesn't count) you know where the corners of all the cars around you are.
Yes, because both are daft, crap, and need removing from LFS (the oval can come back when the simulation is ready for it).
It's a case of symantics. No game/sim is close to BEING real, or realistic, but some get closer than others. LFS is the closest simulation in giving the feel, adrenaline and effects of driving a racing car at speed, whilst combining it with the inteligence required in setting up a car and managing a race situation with other human beings. In that sense it IS realistic. Attempting to drive the sim from a wholly unrealistic view makes the former meaningless.
Why not? The view you drive from is JUST as important (if not more so) for realism discussions than the behaviour of the car from user inputs which is more variable depending on tyre construction, aerodynamic effects etc.
So you've just admitted that chasecam is less realistic? Thank you, that makes it much easier.
Your just a silly person with know-it-all-attitude. I should knew it before I posted here. It´s always the same with tc. Impossible to discuss with you. Get a life .. no ... get a girl "racecardriver".
Some people said in this thread or another i dont remember right, that we "chase view"drivers miss something of the intense simulation feeling´. So let us miss this "intense feeling"and this one thing about the simulation and give us the mirror to be more safe for everyone else. You said yourself we will miss sth...i can live with it. A lot people miss sth because they dont use wheel, but kb and mouse is still supported.
I dont have a prob with people using mouse or kb, since i can understand that not everyone can afford a wheel.
You should do the same and understand us chase view driver that our tiny monitor doesnt give us the surround feeling as when we are in a car. I need to know whats going on around me without pressing a buttom and my monitor will never reflect the real feeling i have in the cockpit. We just want to race proper and safe for everyone else. The only thing missing for us is the possibility to know whats going on behind us.
Why not just add this tiny mirror there? Does it hurt you in any way? It would make the racing on public server even better, so why are people agianst it? "It doesnt help me! Its not made for me! So i dont want it. No programming time should be invested there."
That´s exactly the behaviour kiddies like tristan showing all the time. It´s funny that he would not take notice of chase view drivers in a race. All you can hear are silly and stupid explainings about realism. Dump reasons like "chase view drivers see the corners first" and crap like this. We are not driving an unknown highway, we drive circuits. If you drove a circuit track several laps you know the corners and you don´t have to see the edge of the corner. All he can do is insulting people. Very_ends grammar is bad and I don´t know about race cars. Fine. If it helps him getting an erection....
Man did you damage your brain when you were young or something? Maybe you should go to a doctor and check your head. I don´t want to insult but the facts are speaking for itself. You MUST be stupid. Need the argument again? Didn´t saw it before? Ok here it is AGAIN FFS!!!
I`ll got plenty of arguments, and if you read on the topic you will find a lot of good arguments why we need, and why it should be mirrows in chase veiw mode.
And btw, the reason why no one wants to discuss with you is because you use follish way to discuss. You are one of the sort that thinks that he knows everything, and what everyone else says is wrong. Of course you will reply that it wasn`t what you meant, but it`s true, and it sucks to discuss with follish people like you that have this stupid selfish veiw.
And when you can`t win the discussion, what you do then?
Then you start to point out my perfectly known bad grammar, in a personal attack in hope that I might get sad and leave the discussion, well, I have nothing against personal attacks, special not regarding my language, I`m not speaking english as mother tounge, and I`m not good in english. I mean, I can`t speak a english sentence without getting half of the sentece wrong. But when that is said - I guess thats the way you dicuss, you don`t discuss, you saying that everything you don`t agree with is wrong, and when that fails - then you start attacking the people who wrote it, so they maybe will leave the discussion.
Way to go, I have readed some of your answers before to people, special when you starting flaming people for language or typing, it`s just disgusting, and I`m glad there are not many people like you on this forum.
You want a discussion? Are you kidding me? If you insult people then you cant demand a discussion. Besides, youre still stuck with informations based on hearsay. End of conversation superman.
Why did Scawen bother putting a RAC in the game? I don't drive it, so it's gotta be time consuming. Heck, let's get rid of the XR GT, I don't drive that either, it's too slow and its rims look iffy. Btw, seeing that only 1 out of 50 servers use the forced cockpit option why did Scawen bother wasting his time on that? -_-" /rant /sarcasm
I vote yes, as I sometimes I find myself quickly changing views to see cars around me, and obviously that can be dangerous. Oh, and it wouldn't hurt to have it as an option, much like how FCV is a server option?
totally agree. I hate to quote myself but i think this sort of fits to your reply.
maybe not just two buttons but a little menu to decide which options should be forced off or remain enabled. Papyrus NR for instance did it the same way and take a guess, its also a hardcore simulation. But more then that it fits the needs of almost every kind of preferences, up to a given level of course.
