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WMD used in Iraq AGAIN
2
(50 posts, started )
Quote from wheel4hummer :I decided to remove my post. By posting that, I don't want to add to the America bashing.

Geezer, you can't pick fights with people and then get upset because they respond. The only person throwing insults around was you (in the post you have now deleted)

And then to turn it into "America - the abused minority" is just plainly manipulative. Turning a news story, in which innocents have genuinely been injured, into some kind of personal drama is distasteful which ever way you look at it.
Quote from sweetreid :Thread over.

I would also agree that criticizing Bush jr. is not america bashing, because Bush only represents at best, 49% of the nation, and he pretty openly resents the chunk that's greater than 51%. I'll stop there cuz it's pretty off topic.

and just to point this out, you're saying represents which.. is correct

controlling wise, he only has about 5% at best
10% to congress,
and the remaining 85% to the people

@blackout, you'll see plenty of bashing just look around at some of the political threads.. i've always seen at least one person bash in each thread
99% of the time its been about Bush too
Quote from XCNuse :controlling wise, he only has about 5% at best
10% to congress,
and the remaining 85% to the people

+1
Not a WMD but I do believe it's a biological warefare weapon.
Quote from DTrott :Not a WMD but I do believe it's a biological warefare weapon.

Chlorine gas? It's a chemical weapon.
Chlorine gas. I got a nasty dose of that years ago.i had these clod/ flu symptoms for days.
Gotta give credit where credit's due. it's a cheap and highly effective tactic.
wonder when they're gonna start using ammonia?
Every country in the world has the capability to make a chlorine bomb.
MacGyver can make them ffs!
Using this to justify the preemptive invasion of Iraq four years after the fact?
Give me a break...
#33 - th84
Quote from XCNuse :and just to point this out, you're saying represents which.. is correct

controlling wise, he only has about 5% at best
10% to congress,
and the remaining 85% to the people

About all I can say to that is.... LMAO!!

Recent poll's show that 70% (or so) of all "the people" want our troop's home now.... where are they?

Bush's approval rating (from "the people") is somewhere around 35% (last I saw anyway) and who is still sitting in the "big chair"? I could go on and on with stuff like that.

And tbh, American's dont really deserve the bashing they sometime's take here, but Bush deserves EVERY bit he get's. He's a moron. If we would have stayed at home and took care of our own problem's... (rather than putting ourselves even more in debt which my grandkids will have to pay the bill for, and for what?)...., or finished what we started in Afganistan, we wouldnt even be talking about this. We pay way to much attention to everywhere else, all the while our own country is going down the toliet quicker than a Britney Spears album.

I dont watch neither FOX or CNN, they are both full of shit and are only out to fill their own agenda's, very much like our President.

And FTR, I dont consider that bomb a WMD, but I bet ole GW would like everyone to think it was. I have to agree with "The Moose", I thought GW had started a thread here. Very misleading.
Quote from wheel4hummer :So much for there not being WMDs in Iraq..... The terrorists are using chlorine gas bombs once again! And here is the article from a liberal news station, just for you guys.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17659270/

You'd be slightly less unbelievable if you didn't sound so much like Bill O'Reilly. Even then, nobody'd believe you.
Quote from th84 :American's dont really deserve the bashing they sometime's take here,

I just wanna back you up there. The vast majority of Americans are good and honest people. People just like anywhere else in the world. Just trying to get on with their lives and make the best for themselves.

When attacking US foreign policy or the press, or having a go at Dubbya, people should make sure they're not attacking American citizens. As th84 points out, most of them are probably of the same opinion as you.
Quote from th84 :About all I can say to that is.... LMAO!!

Recent poll's show that 70% (or so) of all "the people" want our troop's home now.... where are they?

the people dont have control over current situations, we only control what is brought to us

back in the olden days this was possible due to smaller communities and not having a major leader

a direct democracy can only be but a limited directness when you get a few million people trying to vote.. so hell make it simple and they only vote every few years on what they prefer to happen, if we were 100% direct it would be chaos and wouldn't work out right

as for debt... screw it! the only reason our economy is so forward is because of our debt, look at europe, they are right below us in debt, and i mean... RIGHT below us, every country is in "debt"
if we weren't in debt right now our hundred dollar bills wouldn't be worth more than the cotten and fibers its made out of
#37 - th84
No doubt, we would be in debt no matter what... but notice I said "for what". I would rather be in debt and see something come of it... rebulid New Orleans, stop all the medicaid, peachcare and social security cut's, help the elderly with prescription drug cost's, etc, etc..... all of which have been altered due to this war (occupation) in Iraq.

I didnt say that the.....errr.....?war? has put us in debt, but it damn sure hasnt helped. That 400 billion (or whatever it is now) would have come in handy in several other area's.
i guess, makes sense, the only thing thats really bugging me is taxes being payed on illegals and whatnot

new orleans though.. twice thats come up, its being worked on, but you can only rebuild an entire city so fast

i think all the media is just attracted towards war and all that crap more than our own homeland

as for CNN, i still haven't heard anything about the shooting in there, have you heard anything about it?
Quote from XCNuse :i guess, makes sense, the only thing thats really bugging me is taxes being payed on illegals and whatnot

new orleans though.. twice thats come up, its being worked on, but you can only rebuild an entire city so fast

i think all the media is just attracted towards war and all that crap more than our own homeland

as for CNN, i still haven't heard anything about the shooting in there, have you heard anything about it?

Uh the media is attracted to the same things sit-coms and reality TV is.
That's Ratings and the resulting revenue generated from the advertising.
the higher the ratings, the more they can charge for commercials during that time slot.
The media is biased. Only they aren't trying to slant political views as much as they are trying to pander to target markets. If the target market is in a certain demographic that has a tendency for a particular view, then it would not make sense (as in Dollars and cents) portray events in a manner that is opposing to that of the target market.
Like on certain networks they'll describe a car accident as well a car accident, unless one of the cars was a SUV. then they will highlight the fact that one of the cars was a SUV. forget who caused the wreck or even if the SUV was a major player in the accident, there was a SUV involved and ppl that hate SUVs , and there are a lot of them, are more likely to watch the story than if they left out the fact that one of the cars was a SUV. Sounds totally stupid, but that's show-biz...oops unbiased reporting.
Quote from wheel4hummer :that is why democracy sucks. Too much government control.

You're right. Every democracy should switch to being an autocracy right away. We don't want to put too much control in the hands of an elected government.
#41 - JTbo
Direct democracy indeed will never work, if it would work then we would not need laws, but people just can't think what it best for all unfortunately.

In other countries they do take actions so debt does not at least increase over 2 billion $ each day but in US congress or whatever seems to ignore and they fund wars with debt and bury country deeper and deeper, which is very sad, imo, for people living there and also people living in western world as at some point markets do realise that it is not possible to continue so and after that 100$ won't get even bread

Sure our country has been idiot too, they saved one company that made bad calls and that did cost so much that we could have paid our whole debt away, but no they saved that company and as company was quite bad shape it was sold to Telia really cheap, so can't say we would have any better politicians, at least they don't understand anything from business and this kind of bad decisions cause services to be cut and so on, same as in US bad call spending to war when they could get invest to their country and get lot more taxes when economy boosts up and then they could spend when they do have what to spend, that is much cheaper than spend debt money.

All guys living in US might be interest from this for example, you can make change when you keep noise and get others to keep noise, they have to change policy if enough people tells that to them so fill their mail boxes etc.
#42 - SamH
It must be at least a BIT embarassing for GW, that the greatest capitalist nation (USA) is currently entirely financed by loans from the largest communist nation (China). Without loans from China, the US would be looking at a depression like it did in the 1920s. It still might be
Quote from XCNuse :new orleans though.. twice thats come up, its being worked on, but you can only rebuild an entire city so fast

I have no doubt if it was New York instead of New Orleans the situation would be entirely different.
Quote from Serpentine :I have no doubt if it was New York instead of New Orleans the situation would be entirely different.

hmmm... Do you know anything about "Newawlins" besides news broadcasts and pictures of Mardi Gras?
Don't blame the US Gov't for their problems. Blame the state & local ones.

You're right in how the situation would be different if the ravaged city was New York, just not because of what you think though.
They shipped a whole bunch of katrina evacuees here. The crime rate shot
up over 25%. They piled those people on buses to get them out, yet you don't see them getting buses to bring them back. When they got their FEMA money, did they try to get a decent job and housing? nope they bought bigscreen TVs and dope. and no this ain't a few bad apples doing that and getting all the attention, this is almost half of them doing that.
When you look at the list of contractors being used by the state of LA. to
"rebuild" the city, you'll notice how so many of them are related to state gov't politicians. The place is one big corrupt mess. It always has been.
When the state got money 20 years ago to upgrade the levies, the state diverted the funds to make roads and parking lots for Casinos. and those parking lots and casinos were built by? yep political cronies. Hell some of the companies were owned by the politicians themselves.... Are y'all getting the picture yet?
Most of people don't realize this, but it was New ORLEANS and not New YORK that was the birthplace of the American Mafia. but they really couldn't compete with what was already in place there. I think they have the Marcelo family there, but I don't know the exact name. Not that that has anything to do with what's going on now, but hopefully it'll clue you in as to how things "work" over there. Also, Brittany Spears is from some where around Shreveport.
Probably been posted but I can't be arsed to read those long posts, but when chlorine gas mixes with water it turns to hydrochloric acid. Water can be found in the eyes, mouth and innards. And that my friends (I don't have real life friends anymore ) is why chlorine gas is so bad.
Quote from Serpentine :I have no doubt if it was New York instead of New Orleans the situation would be entirely different.

if that happened to new york the whole world will be in trouble
think.. great depression all over again.. yes it would too happen and dont you say no it wont, look how much damage occured after 9/11

as for FEMA.. fema messed it up even worse, they are also partial to blame for the even more chaos they caused, which HUD had to come down and clean up the mess they made
Quote from nihil :I, personally, do not think its a very helpful term. Its used by various governments in the way that you used it: as a buzzword to shortcut any rational debate and make ideological assertions about the world appear to be 'facts'.

Quote from DTrott :Probably been posted but I can't be arsed to read those long posts, but when chlorine gas mixes with water it turns to hydrochloric acid. Water can be found in the eyes, mouth and innards. And that my friends (I don't have real life friends anymore ) is why chlorine gas is so bad.

CL2 + H2O -> HOCL + HCL

Hypochlorous acid plus hydrochloric acid. Hypochlorous acid is just as if not more dangerous biologically, and will oxidize the crap out of your mucous membranes and innards.
Oh dear, to get back to the thread topic, those naughty freedom fighters ( sorry, evil terrorists ) have dared to use a chlorine bomb against the forces of good..........

Unfortunatily, the forces of good, ( or the evil invaders, depending on your point of view ) have made it clear to the world that they don't give a flying f#@% for the Geneva Convention or any weapons treaty so why they are getting upset when others behave with the same regard to international weapons treaty's that they do.

Faluga is a case in point, I have US Military documentation that actually names those who chose to use phospherous weapons on civilian targets ( Shake & Bake was the local discription ) as well as those who carried out other war crimes.

The sad point is that America is supposedly a civilised country that preaches liberty and tolerance for all, sorry guy's, that's not how your seen in much of the rest of the world.
And if you want us to believe that it's just shrub, try impeaching the @#^! for warcrimes instead of pretending that it's not happening.

The following is a report from Doctors for Iraq which details some of the atrocities that the US carried out in the name of freedom.

Illegal heavy weapons used inside Falluja
During both sieges of Falluja the US army used different types of weapons and ammunition
causing random widespread damage to civilians living in crowded areas. Some of the
weapons used are illegal under the conventions of warfare.
These weapons have been used in densely populated areas and districts, even with prior
knowledge that civilians remain in these areas the US army used these weapons.
The majority of victims affected by these attacks were women and children. Doctors for Iraq
documented the usage of these weapons through interview with members of the organisation
working in the city, eyewitnesses, families of victims and through photos and video footage.
Doctors for Iraq is concerned about all aspects of the attacks on Falluja. The use of illegal
weapons is just part of our concern. The entire military action and all its horrific
consequences on thousands of civilians will have a long-term impact on many generations.
All violations of international law must be investigated equally and thoroughly.

Chemical agents and Napalm
During the second siege of Falluja- US soldiers used chemical agents such as white
phosphorus and napalm inside the city. Doctors for Iraq gathered information at the 2time
from doctors working in the area and some eyewitnesses showing the aftermath of these
chemicals being used. Recent media reports show how white phosphorus was used inside
Falluja. At the time the US military denied using any chemical agents- now they admit to
using white phosphorus but deny the use of napalm.
Napalm is gel fuel bomb that explodes when it reacts with the ground producing a huge fire
with substance that sticks to exposed skin causing it to burn on impact. Napalm produces
heat as fierce as 300-350 c he napalm bomb produces smoke that irritates and damages the
repertory system – in some cases it can cause suffocation. Doctors for Iraq is trying to
establish if white phosphorus has been combined with napalm to produce a lethal bomb that
can generate e heat of up to 3000c
US soldiers prevented aid workers from entering the city- they were only allowed inside
Falluja three days after the end of the siege which raises questions as to why there was a
delay. Aid workers and doctors gathering bodies from inside residents’ homes after the siege.
Many of these bodies were of women and children who had died in their beds and in their
homes without any bullets entering them. Many of the bodies showed signs of suffocation.
Doctors for Iraq / Dec. 12th 2005
Doctors for Iraq has photos and footages of bodies with significant burns to exposed skin. In
some cases only the bones remained as all the skin had melted away.

Cluster bombs
Cluster bombs are illegal and cannot be used in densely populated areas. These huge bombs
are dropped from the sky and fragment into smaller bombs that can spread over a wider
distance. These bombs are highly dangerous as each small bomb produces a massive shell
that has a devastating impact on the human body. Some of these bombs don’t explode on
impact and can be activated after they have been dropped which is why so many victims of
cluster bombs are children who come across cluster bombs. As a doctor I saw the results of
these bombs – and how they destroy the body’s vascular anatomy and how it’s almost
impossible to repair the damage to the body.
The cluster bomb was used during the first and second sieges of Falluja in areas crowded by
civilians such as Jolan quarter in the north east of Falluja and Shoda quarter in the southeast.
As a doctor I remember the third night of the siege of Falluja when the US army was facing
difficulties entering the Jolan quarter of Falluja- they used cluster bombs and I and my fellow
doctors ended up trying to treat people shattered into pieces by these bombs. The majority of
patients that I tried to treat were women and children.

We mustn't forget the napalm used in Vietnam either. How about the vast quantities of Agent Orange (thanks, Dow Chemical Co.) used to defoliate enormous areas of jungle in an attempt to smoke out the VC? Sure it wasted a million acres of jungle but also gave thousands of GIs (and untold numbers of Vietnamese people) cancer. BTW - it didn't work.

Maybe a mention of the WMD Iraq used against Iran in the 80s is in order as well. Ten seconds googling will tell you that WMD was supplied to Iraq/Saddam by the US. Another few seconds googling will find you a great picture from the same era of Donald Rumsfeld shaking Saddam's hand. How about the gas used on the Kurds? Same vendor.

Back in time now to 1945. The only two nuclear weapons ever used in war were dropped by the USAF onto whole cities. Not content with a lengthy and vicious firebombing campaign of civilian areas of Japanese cities (which rivalled the Luftwaffe's blitzkrieg and eclipsed the firebombing of Dresden by the RAF), the US choose Hiroshima and Nagasaki to get obliterated by two massive bombs with cute little names.

If Saddam even had a sniff of WMD capability in 2003 (and it's common, public knowledge that he did not, regardless of his other hideous activities) and he decided to use it against the US, that would be considered an "own goal". Rather like the CIA training Osama bin Laden to kill Russians in Afghanistan, only to see him turn around years later and turn his hatred towards those that helped him and the mujahadin humiliate the USSR...

So when you say "WMD used in Iraq again", don't forget where Saddam obtained his original WMD from - y'know, back when he was the US government's friend and ally. Don't forget who used napalm and Agent Orange in Vietnam and uses white phosphorous and depleted uranium in Iraq today and never forget who dropped the first two (and only) nuclear weapons ever used in an act of war. What's the biggest worry here? Some opportunistic insurgents letting off a chlorine bomb against some poor unfortunate soldiers who were lied to and bullshitted by their commander-in-chief and shouldn't have even been sent to their country? Or a militarist mega-nation with $400 billion to spend on weapons each year (and is the world's biggest arms dealer), a history of illegitimate aggression against other nations and a history of WMD usage including nuclear bombs and which refuses to rule out nukes when discussing action against Iran - a country which has not threatened the US at all and couldn't defend itself if they attacked?
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WMD used in Iraq AGAIN
(50 posts, started )
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