the people that do hotlaps, obviously yes, otherwise they wouldn't do it...
what are you talking about azzak4? obviously if you have a way faster gear shift it's not gonna be faster, noob. it's totally gonna be exactly the same as a slower gear shift
The big difference is not in the difference of speed it takes to change gears between the different methods but that one method (AC) is in the 100% disengaged position for a significantly longer period than the other methods.
So even though the shift speed is similar the net distance traveled on the track is much different because the AC holds the fully disengaged position longer than it should resulting in lost acceleration. I think we covered this about 300 posts ago around July last year
This is one thing I really hope gets sorted at the next physics update then finally this thread can die
In the analyzer you can clearly see he's only winning time after upshifts .. Don't even bother to tell me there'se also a diffrence in teh speed line, because the speed line doesnt show the diff in line on the track .
It's just something i don't like about this game. I made a hotlap which was quite good, and now some wanker destroys the whole chart by using some kind of trick. I don't even know how to use.
And then i get shouted at and being accused of alot of things in the chatbox by him. Wtf what did i do wrong :P?
omg it's only useless hotlap which sovles nothing. I mean, I am not saying he's right at doing it, but only thing he won is respectable reputation to the future. And that hotlap still does not win him any race of any bigger importance.
Know I said it before, but even as I don't give a damn, the 1.5-3tenths is something, and I hope the lazy bums that canot be bottered to do it the right way (pefect shift, no heat on clutch by a button press is retarded) rot somewhere nice out of my sight.
If something is possible, you will do it no matter what? Well, it's possible to use speedhack too, you going to use that just because it's possible? You crack the game, because it is possible? You steal money, because it's possible? You kill a human, because it's possible?
This is so stupid, I'm out of here, thanks for showing your right colors.
lol i know what a macro is omg
Its 2 stupid for u ? why u start than ?
ahahaha but one thing i want tell ya guys, what u do here is now character assassination
but who cares .... i use my fu***** fingers to push one button, its the clutch and the other is my swapside shift up and down...
never use macros, because thats near cheating like my 2 buttons.
So pls
Autoclutch = 1 button to press
BC= 2 buttons 2 press
SO WTF!!!!!
I have more work, what u want
Do it or let it be!!!! and the best thing ever stfu!!!
Possible or not !?!?! is a speedhack legal??? no so pls man ahh ohh u say ur out ok... better so... bad end!!
It still proves my point, even if something is possible to do there can be morals and other "standards" if you want to call it that, that should prevent most users from using the cheap, or easy way out.
However, after seeing some replies here I'm safe to say that these morals does not apply to everyone.
Such a shame that this discussion is still brought up, and especially in this way. Personally I'm still all for making it 'more fair for 3-pedal users', but the 'ban button clutch' mantra is such a selfish, narrowminded, one-sided, arrogant view that it almost makes me lose faith in humanity.
Stop calling for button clutch to be outlawed or removed.
Start calling for a lower limit for the speed at which button clutch operates.
If there's something in relation to this topic that should be prevented, it's the potential use of a virtual 'fake axis'. A software device that acts like a real hardware axis, but can be made to switch between 0 and 100% literally instantly. I haven't seen (or looked for) any, but if software can fake CD, DVD drives - hell, even entire computers like virtual pc software do - faking a simple analog axis is probably not impossible either.
edit: Just to continue the latter point a bit. It's very easy to modify an actual pedal's response to work like a button clutch and still show up as an axis, but even faster. If you've ever had to adjust an axis of your MOMO pedals or joystick because the pots are worn and input keeps 'wondering', same kind of thing. DXTweak2 and possibly some drivers can do this, I remember seeing some options to that extent in the Logitech drivers, though nothing sophisticated like a visual graph.
NickC: pls define for me, what is cheat in one game?
mine: if you use external program (speedhack, or tweak or i don't know what), and with that you have a profit, that is cheat
OR
if you use the bugs of program ( example: barrier in lfs ), that is not excatly cheat, but not fair game
what live for weed (exelero) use in hotlap, that not cheat, you can so make a hotlap and upload, that is fair
off: if you have only keyboard for lfs, but other have g25, there is ( i think) profit, is this cheat?
just look at the analyzer and see where's he is gaining time. With autoclutch you have, just like in real life, a little fall in speed. The same happens of you use a decent clutch pedal. It doesnt happen if you use a Button
Maybe cheat is not the best word, maybe unsportsmanlike is a better description.
But it doesnt say anything about his speed, for sure it's a nice lap an he's a good driver. But ok Nuff said
And even Scawen has suggested to do such a thing to get more realistic clutch behaviour, so he must be a cheater too! omg the creator of the game is a hackzor
I use AC because I'm lazy to try use CL or BC, I know it is the slowest method of them all but am willing to accept that as it is also the laziest method of them all. Frankly that's exactly how I think it should be
The only criticism I have of the AC at the moment is how it disengages the clutch (at a millisecond level) when compared to both the CL and BC methods. If the AC operated more similarly to how CL operates I actually think the AC would give an unfair advantage, but I'm guessing the majority would be quick to shout that it is my choice to not use the AC in that circumstance. Well guess what
I think there is a case for it being removed. Autoclutch is a necessary evil, but button clutch is there for no apparent reason, it is still an automated clutch. It's certainly not realistic. It may be more difficult, but that's no reason for it remaining either.
Anyone who can use button clutch can use auto-clutch, and imo if you don't have a 3rd pedal then perhaps auto-clutch should (arguably) be the only option. Of course you should still be able to assign the clutch to a button.
People only use it because it is quicker, there is no extra fun or realism that comes with pressing two buttons instead of one. So probably if the devs do what you say in your second sentence, nobody would use it in this way anyway.
It's obviously there so that people without a clutch pedal can use a manual clutch if they want to do so. I want to do so, and I'd use a manual button clutch even if it was exactly the same speed as an auto-clutch. In fact, I'd use it even if it was slower than auto-clutch, provided it wasn't so slow it was impossible to race without burning the clutch.
Automated clutch, in whatever form is not realistic imo. Of the road cars, FZ5 might have paddles as option but that's about it. If there's want for realism, then automatic clutch should not be usable at all, except while using automatic gears.
I feel exactly the opposite:
- If you have a 3rd pedal, use it.
- If you don't, the only option should be manual clutch (button).
As long as the clutch isn't fast enough to gain time with (like if it was just slightly slower than the current auto-clutch), there's no problem.
- If you can't do either of the above, stick to auto-gears which has auto-clutch.
Auto-gears is more realistic than button clutch, so perhaps you're on to something there
I think we differ slightly when it comes to what we consider "using a clutch". People without a 3rd pedal cannot use a clutch any more than people who use mouse can use a steering wheel. A mouse is not a steering wheel, a key is not a throttle pedal, a button is not a clutch pedal.
Button clutch is not a manual clutch and using a button in conjunction with paddles behind the wheel is just weird. Surely it's not a case of attempting to recreate as much, or as many actions, as you'd do in the real car, because the 2 actions are so different there really is no comparison.
At least simple two paddle auto-clutch operation, despite being a necessary evil (as I said before) that allows you to drive cars with H-pattern gear boxes when your sim-kit does not have one, has some kind of real car, real life basis as the alternative control method. Something that people are familiar with. Paddle-shift (or any shift) plus button-on-the-wheel-digital-on/off-clutch does not.
then finally this thread can die 
.. Don't even bother to tell me there'se also a diffrence in teh speed line, because the speed line doesnt show the diff in line on the track 
?? 
...WHAT!?!