The online racing simulator
KPI and Scrub Radius
(10 posts, started )
KPI and Scrub Radius
I remember these two parameters being tunable in S1, along with track width.

how come this was removed? been wanting to ask this for a long time
Because they are usually something fixed in the design process and not adjustable in the pits.
that is true

but then most race cars have dampers that you can adjust for fast and slow bound/rebound (not possible here)

even on something as simple as the formula bmw cars, you can theoretically adjust the anti squat (tho the rules do not permit that); and let's not get into bump-steer lol

granted from the sets i've seen floating around (the wr) set, most people don't even know what parallel steer and caster does (6 degrees in a city track! *faint*)..but it'd be nice to have that available so those of us who do want to experiment, can
Quote from Borbor :(6 degrees in a city track! *faint*)

What makes you say that?
#5 - SamH
This stuff is STILL alien to me.

Serious question: Am I falling short, as a driver, if I don't understand this stuff and can't get my head around the effect these settings have on the car handling, or is it reasonable for me to turn around to the Bob Smiths of the LFS community and say stuff like "that was great, but I turned the wheel in T3 and it just didn't GO where I pointed it.. FIX IT!"?

From what I've seen/read, Schumaker is seriously on the ball regarding setup and effect. Are all F1 drivers like that? Do they need to be? Does Schumy even NEED a race engineer? If so, does he just take orders from Schumy? Are GTR-class drivers this hands-on "granular" when it comes to setting up their cars? I could really do with an idea of what's "expected" from me, as a "fast" driver.
Quote from SamH :<snip>
Serious question: Am I falling short, as a driver, if I don't understand this stuff and can't get my head around the effect these settings have on the car handling, or is it reasonable for me to turn around to the Bob Smiths of the LFS community and say stuff like "that was great, but I turned the wheel in T3 and it just didn't GO where I pointed it.. FIX IT!"?
<snip>

I compete in pistol shooting here in the US. One of the things a lot of people involved in the sport concern themselves with is the mass of their bullets and the amount of gun powder in the cartridge. Both numbers have a direct effect upon the recoil generated when firing (basic Newtonian physics, action reaction) and in all shooting sports, the more recoil, the harder it is to be smooth and accurate. This is especially true when you only have 2 seconds to recover after each shot.

At one time, I was told a story about a shooter on the US Marine pistol team who shot extremely well at a particular match. Upon being asked what kind of "load" he used (bullet mass and powder charge, as described above), he merely shrugged his shoulders. He couldn't care less about the details. He just walked up the firing line and pulled the trigger.

Now, granted, a lot of the guys in the sport (especially the military teams) have arms the size of my leg and therefore recoil does not affect them as much (this particular sport only allows one hand). Also, a gun is very simple compared to a car.

Still, it's something to think about.
What I noticed while I racing karts is that a fast driver is a driver that can feel the car. I was fast sometimes when I started, but when it was wrong it was way wrong and I was lost. As I got more experienced I had a built up knowledge of specific adjustments and how the could help/hurt both the handling or the other settings on the car...the more you know the better.
What I'm getting at is its not important to understand everything the car does, only what relates to what needs to be changed. A good driver will understand that a lack of turn-in can be anything from tire pressure and ride height to downforce or almost any other setting on the car. But a great driver will take into account that they cannot mess with the downforce because the balance is good in the more aero dependent corners and they cannot changed the ride height because the front of the car is 10mm from the minimum setting etc.
A race engineer is there to help and assist the driver. They have a better understanding for what is actually happening when a driver is frantically making funny hand signals and has no idea how to fix a specific problem. They understand the physics more and they use that knowledge along with the drivers feel and experience to come up with solutions. So, yes the best drivers know alot about whats going on with the car, it makes it easier and quicker to diagnose and communicate a problem with their engineer.
An understanding is important, but the feel is more important. If a driver can feel and pinpoint minute and specific setup problems he will be able to better target the correct change.
#8 - Woz
I would say having a feel for what the car is doing below you, how the weight is positioned and how that will effect your grip. Also knowing things such as what effect your control inputs will have on the cars balance and how that can be used to make the car do things that it would not normally want to is the key. A great driver can get the most out of ANY setup, its just some setups will make going fast easier for your driving style than others.

So while it does help knowing how to setup a car its only good for getting final extra bit of speed.

The story above about the pistol shooting sums it up perfectly, that person was just a great shot and could probably fire any pistol with any charge well.

Now that we finally have great default setups in the RACE_S sets I would love to have a server option for fixed set racing.
Quote from SamH :This stuff is STILL alien to me.

Serious question: Am I falling short, as a driver, if I don't understand this stuff and can't get my head around the effect these settings have on the car handling, or is it reasonable for me to turn around to the Bob Smiths of the LFS community and say stuff like "that was great, but I turned the wheel in T3 and it just didn't GO where I pointed it.. FIX IT!"?

From what I've seen/read, Schumaker is seriously on the ball regarding setup and effect. Are all F1 drivers like that? Do they need to be? Does Schumy even NEED a race engineer? If so, does he just take orders from Schumy? Are GTR-class drivers this hands-on "granular" when it comes to setting up their cars? I could really do with an idea of what's "expected" from me, as a "fast" driver.

Like kartracer, I race karts
but i also am a mech eng student and a FSAE participant.

personally, feel is important, but understanding is even more so IMO. if you can't communicate articulately to the engineer what the car is doing, then it makes it much harder for the two of you to come up with a setup together IMO.

all the great ones have a very in-depth knowledge on the mechanical side of things: MS, Senna, Prost, Mika and so on.
Michael Schumacher IIRC actualy doesn't understand setups very well. At least Rubens barichello does better. Sometimes MS's engeneers just copied Rubens' settings.

KPI and Scrub Radius
(10 posts, started )
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG