It was mentioned several times to implement rubbered race-line, which gives more grip.
It's of course good idea, but... does rubbered track really increase grip ratio? I found in old (1986) racing book in chapter about braking something interesting.

Author says, that in first laps the grip in brake-zone is great, but in the end of the race there is thin coat of 'rubber sand' from tires, which greatly decreases grip in such places (where tires are wearing out).

Anybody know whats going on? Is it about different ingredients in tires from 20 years past?

The rubber laid on the track should make the grip better, at least in dry conditions, I'm not sure how it behaves when wet. Could imagine it could make the grip worse, or the other way around, hard to tell without any real experience.

But the rubber bits coming off the tire, marbles, are indeed slippery but they usually end up off the line, but why not on it too. I suppose that's the 'rubber sand'.


I wish we had marbles in LFS some day too.

The racing line get's laid with rubber increasing traction, however when laying this rubber small beads break away and scatter OFF the racing line, this hughely decreases traction as the tyres are no longer completely in contact with the tarmac but rolling on top of these small "beads"

^ AKA "marbles"

This is only what i think is right from what i have picked up from watching motorsport -
I don't know about 20 years ago but in the dry rubber builds up ont he line and grip increases on the racing line, while offline the 'marbles' build up which reduces grip. In the wet though the rubber builds up on the line and (for some reason i don't know) the racing line less grip which is why the 'karting' line is quicker of going round the outside of the corners. Think back to Alonso in the wet at (iirc) Nurburgring.

On a hot day it may be possible for the rubber on the track to start to melt and become slippery. This certainly happens with tires, hard slicks rated for colder climates that don't normally have overheating difficulties, just that little extra heat makes the difference.

Great example of "marbles"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRv9iOIvu5Y

Quote from The General Lee :

Great example of "marbles"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRv9iOIvu5Y

where?

For those that talked about rubber line in the wet; Yes, the rubbered line is slippery. Haven't you even slipped on a wet rubber surface? Slippery as heck! Driving off the rubbered line is quicker in the wet. This was illustrated quite well at Mosport during the ALMS weekend. The saturday sessions were saturated with the precipitation that Hurricane Ernesto brought up north. All the cars were going around turn two on the outside line, which is scary in the best of times. Because of the rubber on the racing line, though, this line has more grip. I can't imagine how scary it musta been for some of those drivers on the Saturday!

Quote from SchneeFee :

where?

Alonso tried to lap Ralf on the outside (offline + marbles) but lost grip and slammed into the wall.

The video brings back some memories..

However - niot really that good an example of marbles on the tracks.

http://didnt.doit.wisc.edu/Photo/mishaps/Eliseo_marbles.jpg

Not a real good example either as there is a mix of graveol in it - but its the same effect but exagerated.

reallllllyyyyyy overdone there. what race was that?

Quote from Widdowmaker :

The video brings back some memories..

However - niot really that good an example of marbles on the tracks.

http://didnt.doit.wisc.edu/Photo/mishaps/Eliseo_marbles.jpg

Not a real good example either as there is a mix of graveol in it - but its the same effect but exagerated.

Wow thats one dirty corner:yikes:

Schumi at Monaco.

Quote from Blackout :

The rubber laid on the track should make the grip better, at least in dry conditions, I'm not sure how it behaves when wet. Could imagine it could make the grip worse, or the other way around, hard to tell without any real experience.

In the rain depending on how rubbered in the track is you often want to run off the normal racing line (karting line). This is because when the track is rubbered in that part of the asphalt is less abrasive and slippy with water on top of the rubber. Off the normal racing line is usually more abrasive in these situations.

Racing in the rain is just so much fun, one of the things I really can't wait to see in LFS. Being up in Scotland I've found myself out in the wet with slicks on many times and that's just so much fun. Although at the time your too busy trying to keep it on track while going quickly to realise how much fun it actually was

Quote from funnybone2 :

reallllllyyyyyy overdone there. what race was that?

What do you mean `reallllllyyyyyy overdone there` ?

It's real life, how can it be overdone? Some corners do often get very messey when you have a lot of cars on track with soft tyres. Not only are the cars throwing the rubber off to the outside of the track they are throwing debris as well.

Quote from keiran :

In the rain depending on how rubbered in the track is you often want to run off the normal racing line (karting line). This is because when the track is rubbered in that part of the asphalt is less abrasive and slippy with water on top of the rubber. Off the normal racing line is usually more abrasive in these situations.

Yeah, makes sense when you read it. Was wondering the reasons, but that really explains. It's a bit like ice, not that slippery when dry, but when wet and the water can't escape it kills you.

These threads always make me want rain too!
Could be some much fun, and painful....and messy.

Quote from keiran :

[...]Racing in the rain is just so much fun, one of the things I really can't wait to see in LFS. Being up in Scotland I've found myself out in the wet with slicks on many times and that's just so much fun. Although at the time your too busy trying to keep it on track while going quickly to realise how much fun it actually was [...]

Yeah, slicks+rain+2-stroke = fun

There was a good example of marbles last year at Montreal, Villeneuve went into the wall, I'll try find a video on youtube.

Quote from Greboth :

Think back to Alonso in the wet at (iirc) Nurburgring.

nope, that was the Hungaroring, but you got the last part of the word right

Quote from Leifde :

There was a good example of marbles last year at Melbourne, Villeneuve went into the wall, I'll try find a video on youtube.

Canada
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W57gjlFafS0

Quote from Widdowmaker :

http://didnt.doit.wisc.edu/Photo/mishaps/Eliseo_marbles.jpg

As a FIA licensed motorsport marshall (local class, so usually I'm the one with the broom... need to get to a national class license ASAP, I'm too lazy to jump over the armco and clean sh*t up, constantly looking over my back and praying they don't run me over) I can only say :wow: :faint2:

I can almost hear the radio: Post 13, yo've got two laps under yellow to clean this sh*t up! GOGOGOGO!!!

Quote from Yaamboo :

Canada
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W57gjlFafS0

Where did I say Melbourne? I never did!

wow... that would certainly make passing a bit different in LFS after a few laps...

GTR2 has marbles, i dont think you can see them but you can definetely feel them if you run a bit offline. only problem with that then is because of the point of no return you basically cant correct yourself. ive only ever corrected properly once in gtr2, in an LM prototype which is a lot more grippy than the usual cars though, whereas i can correct in LFS no problem. never tried it in the wet, although i imagine the rain would wash the marbles away anyway, taking away that disadvantage.

Edit: sorry about this post, thought i was in general racing >_<