Indeed, or even any raciunmg.
For me it's like this:
The head tells me the white car is at fault (I, sort off, know the rules)
The heart tells me the guy in the blue car should have his *** kicked so bla, bla, bla...
IMO there is something wrong with the rules in these kind of situations. I've always felt that when someone behind me manages to squeeze part of his bodywork in between before I reach the apex, it's my duty to give him enough room. If I would have done what the blue car did, I would have reached for my "sorry!" bind ASAP.
I like racing and I like winning but I play LFS for fun. A good race for me is a race with lots of overtaking and fighting for positions, if possible side by side. It's not that important how high I finish. I rather finish last of a group of three while all three are cheering how much fun it was, then finish first because in the hairpin I had officialy the right of way and number two is therefore now parked against the fence...
Besides, are these rules really stricktly implemented in LFS? It would be interresting to try that and see how much racing will improve... Probably a lot of exiting overtaking becomes impossible because you need such an enormous slab of metal in between there to have any right to hold your line that you might as well just stay behind. Sure there are lots of other ways to overtake but this is a basic overtaking move that is seriously hampered by the rules. I think the leader simply has too many rights in these kind of situations.
As far as real racing goes I have no hands on experience but from a spectator point of view I think this rule alone has done a fine job making racing a pritty boring thing to look at, honestly.
So the white car is at fault.
But the blue car is a lamer...
I would classify it as a typical Shumi move.
Sorry for the rant but this rule has bothered me from the moment I became interrested in racing.
The head tells me the white car is at fault (I, sort off, know the rules)
The heart tells me the guy in the blue car should have his *** kicked so bla, bla, bla...
IMO there is something wrong with the rules in these kind of situations. I've always felt that when someone behind me manages to squeeze part of his bodywork in between before I reach the apex, it's my duty to give him enough room. If I would have done what the blue car did, I would have reached for my "sorry!" bind ASAP.
I like racing and I like winning but I play LFS for fun. A good race for me is a race with lots of overtaking and fighting for positions, if possible side by side. It's not that important how high I finish. I rather finish last of a group of three while all three are cheering how much fun it was, then finish first because in the hairpin I had officialy the right of way and number two is therefore now parked against the fence...
Besides, are these rules really stricktly implemented in LFS? It would be interresting to try that and see how much racing will improve... Probably a lot of exiting overtaking becomes impossible because you need such an enormous slab of metal in between there to have any right to hold your line that you might as well just stay behind. Sure there are lots of other ways to overtake but this is a basic overtaking move that is seriously hampered by the rules. I think the leader simply has too many rights in these kind of situations.
As far as real racing goes I have no hands on experience but from a spectator point of view I think this rule alone has done a fine job making racing a pritty boring thing to look at, honestly.
So the white car is at fault.
But the blue car is a lamer...
I would classify it as a typical Shumi move.
Sorry for the rant but this rule has bothered me from the moment I became interrested in racing.
Basically, it is always better to be more careful, even if you may be right... I too back off one time more than necessary, to keep my car in a good shape before I would risk ruining my whole race... As I said, you wouldn't have proven any point but you're willing to be reckless just to claim you were right... 
But it's up to everyone himself how to handle such a situation... But I would't turn it the other way round like you mentioned... You just can't overtake someone on the inside if you're just at his rear bumper... The two cars would be side by side at corner exit (at best), but then still he has much to do to get past the other car... Isn't very useful either...
But it's up to everyone himself how to handle such a situation... But I would't turn it the other way round like you mentioned... You just can't overtake someone on the inside if you're just at his rear bumper... The two cars would be side by side at corner exit (at best), but then still he has much to do to get past the other car... Isn't very useful either...
Interesting, but I regret to inform you of two very important errors in your post.
The series shown in the video is held under RACMSA regulations (or whatever the RACMSA became when the RAC sold it).
The FIA, specifically Max Mosley, did actually want to introduce a rule whereby if there was any overlap the car behind had right of way. The rule was set to come into force until it was pointed out that the guy infront only has 1 pair of eyes and they are in the middle of the car. "Significant overlap" remained the rule, and it's the rule because it works
. Even with such favoratism to the car infront the last few seasons of F1 have been brilliant fun to watch.Agreed, but expect to see a lot of people disagree with the bit about F1 being exciting. I do, but I don't think many people really appreciate the depth of F1 and just want banging wheel racing and cool crashes.
On the side note, why has no one started a RIP Paul Dana thread? Normally we get threads dedicated to the lives lost in motorsport, but not this time :/ For what it's worth, my thoughts go out to his friends and family, I know how hard it is to deal with such situations.
Good points, guys.
The necesity to see and avoid is an important issue. I think that is more the reason for the rule than who has rights to the line. Unless you have a reasonable chance to see the other car, you can't avoid them. It then beomes a safety issue instead of an overtaking rule.
Lets face it. The white car was a lot faster. The blue car was blocking. They could block because they had a "right" to the line. He was not doing illegal or even unethical blocking, he was just trying to stay on his line. But he had to know the white car was there and trying to pass. In my opinion, he opened the door into that corner and was irresponisble to try and close the door after opening it. But, if you go by the letter of the FIA rules (I know it is sanctioned by another body), he might still have had the right to the line, but the vid is still not conclusive... to me.
From the other videos I have watched of this type of car, the type of sliding the blue car was doing is not normal. Either his car setup was crap, or he did not have the skill that he needed in that car. The rules are one thing, but if you know you are going to get eaten up, then you better be ready for people to try and pass you. Being right according to the rules does not magically unbend your car.
The necesity to see and avoid is an important issue. I think that is more the reason for the rule than who has rights to the line. Unless you have a reasonable chance to see the other car, you can't avoid them. It then beomes a safety issue instead of an overtaking rule.
Lets face it. The white car was a lot faster. The blue car was blocking. They could block because they had a "right" to the line. He was not doing illegal or even unethical blocking, he was just trying to stay on his line. But he had to know the white car was there and trying to pass. In my opinion, he opened the door into that corner and was irresponisble to try and close the door after opening it. But, if you go by the letter of the FIA rules (I know it is sanctioned by another body), he might still have had the right to the line, but the vid is still not conclusive... to me.
From the other videos I have watched of this type of car, the type of sliding the blue car was doing is not normal. Either his car setup was crap, or he did not have the skill that he needed in that car. The rules are one thing, but if you know you are going to get eaten up, then you better be ready for people to try and pass you. Being right according to the rules does not magically unbend your car.
i dunno.. i dont really find f1 racing boring. i watched the whole bahrain race from beginning to end.
hehe, I've watched every race (that I have had the chanse to see, which means the most of them) the last years, and the last season and the start of this have been great.
I just don't hope the new rules in 2008 will ruin anything.
Yeah, that makes sense. Should have thought of that before
So intelligent people like F1. When you don't like F1 it's because your too stupid to understand it... Worse, your a wheelbanger that just likes crashes................................
Got to love those simplified point of views. I wish the real world would be so simple...
I like everything about F1 except the gossip and the actual race. But last year was a exception to that rule. And this season looks to be even better.
But I dumped my TV cause it was standing in the way... #$%@%
Looking at the different points of view in this thread, when the fault in my opinion is quite clear, explains so many accidents in LFS.
I think LFS should come with a pdf of the racing regulations section of the blue book... Not that it'd help !
I think LFS should come with a pdf of the racing regulations section of the blue book... Not that it'd help !
so basically your saying that in that incident, the car ahead should of thought "Oh, well the person behind me wants to get past, so i better leave him lots of room and nt defend my position", what do you want him to? Pull over and stop? you would of thought the driver of the cam car would of had more sense!
The racing line was hard for me to determine as it seemed to me the blue car in front was 'all over' the place. The way they handled the cars made me just sit and wait for something to go wrong, had I not known it in advance something would happen.
When you happen to talk about my comment, I ageed with you. No sarcasm there
Huh? But it's two LX4's racing... oh... hehe
Those cars look like fun to drive
They already ARE fun to drive, just choose them if you got the chance to do so...
To you and colcob: did race (still do), finished races, never been warnbed or penalised. And I'd do the move anytime.
As for colcob: the point of racing is being entertaining to spectators/Wiewers. No public interest, no sponsors, no racing ...
1. st part: dod not know that, but I think RACMSA is under FIA.
2. F1 is booring. And as fopr 1 pair of eyes: if you're not 100% sure there's no overlap then act as there is overlap. Easy. Who do you blame in an incident? The guy who did not leave enough room.
NMo, more like: he's behnid me, attacking, I need to watch him carewfully. And if he lunges besides me, then I leave room. I canb still get him at the exit, cause he needs to take tighter line.
I race like that IRL and in LFS.
(Vain)
DELETED
by Vain
I checked up recently because I know the RAC sold it off a while ago now (the year after I last raced TKM and moved to Pro's where I didn't need that license), it's now just called the MSA and governs all National and Club racing in Britain. It is not under the FIA which is a corporate money making machine based in France which happens to be partially owned by a Brit, but the majority shareholder is Fiat.
So you've never raced then? Welcome to LFS.
Conclusion.
You are being chased by a dude thats faster than you, but he just can't pass. Then, because you don't know if he is inside you, you will give room for him in every corner? Yeah, thats entertaining.
Seriously, you can't just dive into an atempt like that, its dangerous and extremely risky.
You are being chased by a dude thats faster than you, but he just can't pass. Then, because you don't know if he is inside you, you will give room for him in every corner? Yeah, thats entertaining.
Seriously, you can't just dive into an atempt like that, its dangerous and extremely risky.
MSA is member of FIA and therefore it's rules must be in accordance with FIA rules.
And I have raced (as stated before) IRL and still do.
myyboss: yes, if I'm not 100% sure that there's NO overlap, I'll leave space (and squeeze him gently, just for fun).
Whose in fault?
(96 posts, started )
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG