I've been wondering - should I report anyone for misconduct or just gross cases?
This is because, for example in CTRA race1 you can hardly defend your position (i.e. use defensive driving by braking in the middle of the track, "closing the door", etc) when your opponent doenst have overlap simply because most drivers dont understand that if they havent got the nose to the door of the other car, they must back down even on straights. This results in crashes and the lead car being spun any time you try to close the door on someone. Granted, closing the door all the way to the wall in a straight isnt exactly nice to do, but at the very least on the corners...

Should we be lenient of these crashes and only report the real wreckers, or is there no problem in flooding the report system with reports of non-overlap crashes, drivers recovering with no care of incoming traffic, blue-flag ignorers, etc?

I'd tend to report eveyrone, but I'd guess a flooded report system is also no good.

EDIT:
Nice would be to when reviewing a replay, check the reportee for the whole race, and also penalize him for any misconduct on the replay he sent - would make people think twice before going on a revenge run in the same race as they got taken out

My personal opinion is that if you try and close the door on someone who has even a tiny overlap on a straight, then you are to blame if there is an accident. In a corner however you could take the racing line if they don't have an overlap, however I usually conceed a position if I know I am slower than the guy behind.

I don't tend to report much except what I consider serious or intentional, in fact, in the 2 reports I have raised one guy rejoined into the pack causing havoc, and one guy was wrecking/cutting blatantly on purpose.

I'm also pretty sure that it has been posted somewhere that the expected driving standard changes with the servers. Obviously you can expect a bit more 'careless' driving on the lower servers, but on the higher ones any crashes should really be 'racing incidents' only.

I agree with all of you

It's very rare that I raise a report. It has to be pretty blatantly deliberate. Even in many of those instances, I don't bother unless I'm feeling really put out by the injustice of it.

The most important thing to do is get a copy of the replay first. Either get the X-System to email it to you while you're creating the report, or grab it from the CTRA site when you're editing. Watch the replay from the view of the person you're reporting. Often this is really the only way to properly determine if malice was involved (or in higher servers, lack of racecraft etc). I raised a report yesterday.. I was hopping mad. Came to watch the replay before filing, watched it from that guy's view and from his seat only to find that it was as much my fault as his. Report deleted.. simple

As drivers climb up the CTRA's tiers, more subtle offences should be reported. If someone consistently takes bad lines into corners, and this results in outages for other drivers, it's worth reporting. We certainly wouldn't ban a driver for lacking race-craft, but we would have no hesitation in pulling them aside and explaining the problem. The advantage of filing a report is that it places the impetus on the CTRA admins to address the problem rather than creating a conflict in the server. Of course, if the driver refuses to see the error of his ways and persists in reckless behaviour, over time he may have difficulty making further progress on the CTRA. That's what the system's about

I dont report at all. (hmm looking at my CTRA i did report 2 people). Well if I did that then you should be a real piece of work getting me that frustated. However I am a strong believer of education. By putting in a report on someone I think you must be fair and straight about it. Tell the guy why you did it and what you believe is wrong.

Lately I get the impression people start raising reports for most stupid things. The report system is to my point of view for those who really fecked up and needs to get punished for it. But i only do it after I told someone several times he is wrong and what he is doing wrong.

I the worst case i take a replay go offline and watch the replay several times from different racing positions. I just dont wanna report someone for a minor incident. Why ??, bcus getting points and therefor gaining your license is a struggle. It talkes a while and a lot of dedication. If you are silver and up you have prooven to me youre dedicated and knowing what the rules are.

To me getting to silver is the hardest part on CTRA, and its seperated the guy who is commited and the one whos not.

Sure dumplings occur on the higher licensed servers aswell. But to me on those servers is the respect much higher and people are more willing to listen.

So if your asking me, dont use it until your a 200% sure youre right and it isnt a minor incident.

Nice to know it isn't just us mere online racers that have problems with overtaking, blocking racing lines etc. You guys might find the following an interesting article.

http://atlasf1.autosport.com/99/san/tytler.html

I also found the following on a site defining rules in a Caterham 7 series.

My opinion is that if you are attempting to overtake, then you are the one who must make a clean manoeuvre whist the person being overtaken should not be restricted from continuing at race speed. i.e., just because you get 1/3 way past, it doesn't mean you can continue into the corner knowing the lead car is going to need the space that you are now blocking. If the speed difference between the cars isn't enough for a clear pass, then unfortunately the guy at the back has to stay close and pressure, without (much ) contact the lead car into a mistake allowing for an over take.

Quote :

Driver Etiquette:
Your driving is expected to be the highest standard for the protection of everyone involved. Drivers will be observed and judged for safe driving by the events Race Chairman, Chief Steward, course officials and peers. If any driver is driving in a careless, unsafe or erratic manner, they will receive a black flag. They must immediately report to the hot pit area for a conference with Chief Steward or his designee(s). If given a second black flag, the driver will report to the hot pit for another conference with the Chief Steward and then return to the paddock for the remainder of the scheduled track season. If given a third black flag, the driver will return to the paddock and be excused from remainder of the weekend. If there is any car contact with another car or other object, the responsible driver will be excused for the remainder of the weekend. They may also be subject to further review and possible additional penalties.

Unacceptable driving behavior includes chopping, blocking and car to car contact. Chopping occurs when an abrupt return to the racing line is made after passing another car. Driver should provide a comfortable margin before moving in front of a car they have just passed. Blocking is intentionally moving away from the normal driving line in order to prevent a passive maneuver by a pursuing car. This is not acceptable. Along that same line, passing maneuvers should never force another car off the racing surface. When making a close pass, the overtaking car should decelerate enough to be in control enough to allow side by side racing through the next corner of necessary.

In addition, the car in front has the right of way and need not yield to the car behind. However, if the car ahead is clearly much slower than an overtaking car, as a matter of sportsmanship, the slower car should yield the right of way to the much faster car when it can be done safely. The responsibility for the decision to pass another car and thus for the safety of the pass, lies with the overtaking car. Pass must be completed without requiring the overtaken driver to take evasive action to avoid contact with the overtaking car. This does not relieve the overtaken driver for any responsibility. Both drivers must be alert (i.e., constantly checking frontal field of vision and mirrors) and be observant to what is occurring around them at all times. It is the responsibility of the overtaken driver to maintain a consistent and predictable line of course of travel so that an overtaking driver will not find himself committed to the passing line only to have the overtaken car suddenly swerved into that line, resulting in unavoidable card contact.

Quote from Stigpt :

I've been wondering - should I report anyone for misconduct or just gross cases?
This is because, for example in CTRA race1 you can hardly defend your position (i.e. use defensive driving by braking in the middle of the track, "closing the door", etc) when your opponent doenst have overlap simply because most drivers dont understand that if they havent got the nose to the door of the other car, they must back down even on straights. This results in crashes and the lead car being spun any time you try to close the door on someone. Granted, closing the door all the way to the wall in a straight isnt exactly nice to do, but at the very least on the corners...

If you are doing this on race1 you should expect to be crashed.
In fact if you do this anywhere on a CTRA server at any level I think you might get reported. How is braking in the middle of a straight any different than say weaving around?

Applying your brakes going down the straight is commonly referred to as "A brake check" . As far as I'm concerned it is bad forum. As for "closing the door" if you close the door when someone is beside you (Yes technically you are in the right) but is it worth crashing both of you to keep the spot and have to wait until the next restart?
How about on race1 you tell the other driver about overlap. Then if they persist you can report them.
Closing the door can be done without crashing, but it take finnese that few drivers have (me included).
I've seen both types of "Door closing" one is done with style and the overtaking driver has lots of time to react and backoff. The other is a hack job where the driver being passed makes a sudden cut to the apex and takes out whoever was beside them. (Technically acceptable but morally questionable I think)

Just my two cents. I have to post somewhere because Sam keeps cleaning up the fun ones!!

Todd, I have a feeling what he means is moving to the middle of the racing line in the braking zone to defend any overtaking, not just braking on the track itself. I hope that's what he means anyway!

Quote from yeager :

Todd, I have a feeling what he means is moving to the middle of the racing line in the braking zone to defend any overtaking, not just braking on the track itself. I hope that's what he means anyway!

Oh OK I read it wrong then

Sorry my bad!!

i see people weaving all over on SS1, especially on the longer straights and it drives me round the bend. I know this is to break the draft, but it also creates a certain level of uncertainty in the car behind, is he gonna swerve back now, or now, maybe now, oh crap, he zigged when I thought he was gonna zag.

I nearly reported a guy for it on KYGP the other day, I was trying to get by him for a couple laps, and the lines through the corners would not allow it, and his driving on the banked sections was all over the place. looking back, I should have reported him.

Race on the Race1 server with the expectation that the person you are running against does not have a clue and you won't be far wrong =)

While you would be right to defend your position the person you just threw the block on has no clue really in Race1 on what that meant and how they are supposed to handle it and it will usually end up with someone being spun. On race 1 something like this shouldn't really be reported.

On race two these types of manuvers are encouraged, to a degree, and on race two drivers are expected to handle these situations a with reasonable level of control. If someone is not handling the situations properly than a report would be acceptable.

I think your hitting a good point that we need to clarify. What type of reports are wanted for each tier. We have some basic rules up but we do not have anything that goes into that much detail IIRC.

As for the admins reviewing the whole replay, sorry that is out of the question. We started doing that in the beginning and before you know it your looking at a good 30 minutes to an hour for each replay depending on all the incidents and thats just not realistic. If you want us to review multiple incidents please make a note in your submission, then we will review them, but only if you initally put the time in to record the laps and sectors involved if not the corner, we simply do not have the time.

Quote from NoPistons :

i see people weaving all over on SS1, especially on the longer straights and it drives me round the bend. I know this is to break the draft, but it also creates a certain level of uncertainty in the car behind, is he gonna swerve back now, or now, maybe now, oh crap, he zigged when I thought he was gonna zag.



I nearly reported a guy for it on KYGP the other day, I was trying to get by him for a couple laps, and the lines through the corners would not allow it, and his driving on the banked sections was all over the place. looking back, I should have reported him.

For me the weaving is not a huge deal, until you think of how many people do it. Because nobody has really done any reports on weaving on the straits nobody really knows that it's against the rules. I think this should be enforced from the rirst tier of servers and please make a report so people can get the hint that it is not acceptable behavior for any racing.

Quote from NoPistons :

i see people weaving all over on SS1, especially on the longer straights and it drives me round the bend. I know this is to break the draft, but it also creates a certain level of uncertainty in the car behind, is he gonna swerve back now, or now, maybe now, oh crap, he zigged when I thought he was gonna zag.

I remember a while ago in F1 they mandated that the lead car was allowed to make one decisive move off the driving line to try and prevent the car behind from getting a decent draft. To be honest I do the same... as I lead onto the straight, I make at some point one clear move off the line and then return to the line as I approach the corner. Nobody's ever complained... mostly because they usually pass me when I make the move

Quote from Viper93 :

On race two these types of manuvers are encouraged, to a degree, and on race two drivers are expected to handle these situations a with reasonable level of control.

And the STCC broadcasts are full of drivers making defensive moves on the line... surely if the "top" drivers are driving defensively, then us mere mortals are allowed to follow suit

I totally agree with Race1, you can't really expect any level of respect or understanding and take everything with a pinch of salt.

Quote from yeager :

I totally agree with Race1, you can't really expect any level of respect or understanding and take everything with a pinch of salt.

I think some drivers may be experiencing rude awakenings, on Race 1, fairly soon. A couple of times, now, I've seen people in Race 1 suggest that it's okay to drive badly in that server. To knowingly drive poorly in a CTRA server, below your own standard, is likely to bring with it some serious penalties. The same rules exist across all our servers, and an experienced driver is going to get some hefty penalties if they're driving to standards below THEIR licence levels.

The rules texts may seem to be geared towards the servers, but that's because there is a presumption that only Copper and Bronze drivers will drive in Race 1. The expectations in the CTRA system are placed on the driver and refer to his experience and licence level, not the server on which he or she races.

I've seen more crashes caused by cars backing down while alongside on straights, than crashes caused by drivers not backing down. If you back down then the cars behind will see that, and either slow down or try to pass. If they slow down it creates a chain effect, and eventually someone will be caught out. I always leave room for a car, even if it has a tiny overlap and isnt gaining much down the straights. Sometimes I might give them a squeeze to let them know I won't be giving up the position easily, but I never cut them off. Depending on what racing you watch you see 2 extremes, BTCC block block block cut cut chop chop chop. However some of the lower levels where people pay for their own cars, you see people with no overlap being given the room to pass.

As for reporting, I don't report unless something really irritates me, like a driver 6 laps down crashing out a lead car who is on the last lap.

Quote from SamH :

A couple of times, now, I've seen people in Race 1 suggest that it's okay to drive badly in that server.

In any race on any server someone actually saying you can drive badly is pretty silly. CTRA does a good job using the X System to enforce some rules which everyone abides by and provides an excellent arena for great racing. Of course when that system isn't there a temporary sense of anarchy sets in

However Race 1 is always going to have a certain degree of unpredictability due to those who are not fully versed or bought into the CTRA license mentality. So I don't expect the same level of professional driving that i'm hoping to engage in when I get to silver I've noticed that first corner pile ups are now rare on the BF server where as I enjoy the challenge to avoid the less experienced drivers on Race 1

I treat Race 1 as unorganised street racing where you don't really know who you are racing against and have to drive appropriately. Most of the time I don't commit fully on the first few turns, avoid everyone and then pick my way through the definite mess that ensues. Most of the time i'm driving from the back of the field to the top 8 places simply by being careful. Sometimes I get a massive shunt from the back and I have to just count to 10 and rejoin and have a practice race. On the UF BR server however i'd never have a chance with that attitude.

EDITED:
And to add Sam in direct response. What the rules are defining and what I expect are totally different. The rules are accurate and clear and in Race 1 people should be driving to their best abilities, however what I expect from people most of the time is very different

I agree with everything you say, yeager

Race 1 is an all-comers server. We have no control over who joins, only who stays. It's inevitable that there are going to be some racers who struggle to grasp the whole racing/sporting concept. The good drivers will graduate, thanks to the way the qualy/grid system works, and the poor ones won't. At least, they won't until they get good. A lot of drivers that I have a lot of respect for have cut their racing teeth on the CTRA servers and pwnd me thoroughly since

i agree with yeager as well, i will often take t1 carefully on race 1 and end up better for it, and i see that most people are very new to the system and lfs in general so i take that into acount, and i may moan abit to myself about an incident but most of the time they dont bother me

same as yeager - on straights = squeeze, on bends with no overlap= shutoff quite aggressivly, his nose near the edge of my door = space at apex.