Hi,

Ive just been looking at PCWorld.co.uk (whilst i was waiting for Niko to come back on msn) and a review centre and i cant really see anybody talking about LFS. There either talking about Gran turismo and Test drive at the review centre. Now to be onist i personly think that LFS is better than all these games put together but i think to my self what is the difference and how come there alot well known? The only explination of this is because i think that they are put on CD and in shops (compact disk) and people spread the word? But i personly found LFS quite hard to find through a karting website (which my brother told me about). Should LFS be put on CD and published in shops and be spread, and with a S2 Licence code inside to create an account? Then The LFS Community would definitaly become greater!

Thanks

Matt

Ive also added a poll just to make out what you think.

When S2 is finished, LFS will not be finished yet. Before LFS is completely finished I don't see many marketing activities taking place, rightfully so.

What a lot of people don't seem to realise is that games like GT4 are not games LFS needs to compete against. LFS will never be a game for the masses, as Joe Sixpack just wants simple racing games with a lot of silly features.
LFS is doing fine as it is, and although ofcourse every new player is welcome, I feel we need people on board who have a passion for racing simulation. People who think GT is a simulator don't belong in that category.

I don't think LFS will ever be released on CD in shops. Online distribution is the future anyway imo. After all, LFS is very online oriented.

Getting more players to LFS should not be a goal in itself, it should be a result of an ever improving game. For sure people who are into sim racing know LFS or come across LFS one way or the other.

What Joen said. People are agreeing with you a lot today, Joen.
EDIT: Though once S3 is out, I think it should be released in the shops... the devs ought to make a killing and they deserve it, most certainly.

Quote from axus :

People are agreeing with you a lot today, Joen.

Yeah, I'm stunned, what's happening to this place?

only when the game is completely done!

The problem is, It's really hard for me and others to get S2 if it isn't retail. . .

I'll keep trying though...

come with a £24 lfs coupon, great idea!

One thing that would be nice though is if the devs could sell LFS on CD through the LFS Shop or something. This could be nice for people with traffic limitation or people who just want to have a physical object. With a booklet, manual and additions like the music addon pack, skin viewer, maybe some high res skinpack or stuff like that. Oh and with a fold out poster with the devs on it to hang over our beds It would cost a bit more then ofcourse.

ok,

Just i thought if it would be better

Matty

Quote from joen :

People who think GT is a simulator don't belong in that category.

TBH, i dont agree with you there, GT4 is a great game, maybe not as good as LFS but there is not much wrong with it. (im gonna be flamed ) The physics arent as good but the overall theme of the game is great and gets you playing for ages.

Quote from niall09 :

The physics arent as good but the overall theme of the game is great and gets you playing for ages.

It may be good, but its not a racing sim.

LFS on CD on the site might be an idea. What would be great is when S2 final comes out to have a proper box set with a soundtrack CD and some posters or something

Quote from joen :

W
LFS is doing fine as it is, and although ofcourse every new player is welcome, I feel we need people on board who have a passion for racing simulation. People who think GT is a simulator don't belong in that category.

Why because they are wrong?
If they never tried anything better why would they think otherwise? I'm sure that many players here consider LFS as a very realistic sim only because they refer to other people who said so!
It's not what they think or know that matter but only what they are looking for! Anybody who's looking for realism in car's physics would be better here than in any other racing game!

Quote from niall09 :

TBH, i dont agree with you there

Damn, you ended my winning streak

Quote :

GT4 is a great game

Yes, it's a great game, I play it at a mate's once in a while. And it can be great fun playing it together with a beer and some chips. But it's no real simulator, despite of what the packaging says.

You know, sometime you just want to have some fast food. It can be tasty sometimes. But most of the time you just want a nice well prepared juicy steak. At least I do. You can guess which type of food LFS would be

So I'm not saying GT4 is a terrible game, it's not. But it's not worthy of the label simulator.

all imo ofcourse

Quote from Maelstrom :

Anybody who's looking for realism in car's physics would be better here than in any other racing game!

Have you ever been in a discussion with diehard GT fans? They can't be convinced there's anything better than GT. To them it is the most realistic racing game ever and they will keep thinking that until the end of time.

All I'm trying to say is that most people don't care about realism in a racing game. They just don't.
They want to have some fun virtually racing a car and that's it. And that's fine really, I don't expect everybody to have the same preference as me.
But people need to get it out of their head that LFS is ever going to compete with games like GT because they're simply in a different segment of the market, and that getting as much people in LFS as possible isn't necessarily a good thing.
If you don't get my point then we just have a different perspective on it. Which is fine

Quote from Smurfen :

only when the game is completely done!

Noooooo

A few months after it hits the shops, it will be in the bargain bins like every other retail game.... LFS is a different kind of game - it will never sell 'big', but it could last a long time, going 'retail' would just kill it prematurely. The devs should keep control of the sales, they will be able to make a reasonable profit for much longer that way.

Another reason is that they are small independant developers. To have a chance of competing in the retail environment they would need the influence and exposure that only a deal with major publisher can bring... not a good idea IMO (get sucked dry and spat out). It's well known that Scavier don't want to go down that road...

Quote from joen :

Oh and with a fold out poster with the devs on it to hang over our beds

Sold.

GT is a good car collecting game, but as far as driving is concerned, it's crap.

LFS is a great simulator, but as far as collecting car is concerned, it's crap.

They don't share the same markets, there is no point wanting them to compete. And the result would be pretty obvious, the one who spent the highest money in marketing would win. The quality of the product has a very limited impact on the sales when it comes to attract the mass. Only the niche markets are affected by such considerations.

S2 final on CD from the LFS shop sounds reasonable. S3 on CD/DVD at software retailers sounds reasonable. imo

Quote from col :

Noooooo

A few months after it hits the shops, it will be in the bargain bins like every other retail game.... LFS is a different kind of game - it will never sell 'big', but it could last a long time, going 'retail' would just kill it prematurely. The devs should keep control of the sales, they will be able to make a reasonable profit for much longer that way.

Another reason is that they are small independant developers. To have a chance of competing in the retail environment they would need the influence and exposure that only a deal with major publisher can bring... not a good idea IMO (get sucked dry and spat out). It's well known that Scavier don't want to go down that road...

LfS over Steam?

I'm not too keen on selling Lfs on cd's either.

What it really needs is some proper publicity when it's finished...Nowadays, nobody goes to the computer shop anyway and choose a game just because he likes the cover.

A nice publicity campaign with a link to the site would bring much more profit I guess...And no publisher percentages needed!!!

Yeah, I change my mind. Actually, I don't even know why I'm in this thread. I'm hungry and I need to go cook some chips.

:spam:

i think it should be put in stores NOW as an online game only.

it wont have this appeal or be technically the best for ever.
By the time S3 comes out, who knows what else is on the market by then, and how better.

Lfs is still only made by 3 guys and all we have today took 4 or 5 years.
For the big companies, 5 years is enough to produce 3 generations of games, and we are still in ALPHA.

What i am trying to say, you guys surelly noticed the heavy competition lfs got, starting from the last two years.
In the next 3 years, big names will be making way on what LFS helped to create in its best days.
Those best days were 2005 and 2006.

Today, in 2007 big companies are hiring BIG physicists to build tyre models and suspencion models for a console game (forza2).http://channel9.msdn.com/showpost.aspx?postid=314874
Its how serious its getting. Lfs should see the light of day before the big guys take over.

Quote from spyshagg :

it wont have this appeal or be technically the best for ever.
By the time S3 comes out, who knows what else is on the market by then, and how better.

And how exactly do you know that LFS won't be able to match whatever's out when that time arrives? Why wouldn't LFS improve along with it's competition? It has managed to do that so far (It's actually pulling ahead if you ask me). It may never look as pretty though, I'll grant you that, but I quite frankly couldn't care less as long as the physics and gameplay are up to spec.

Quote from spyshagg :

Today, in 2007 big companies are hiring BIG physicists to build tyre models and suspencion models for a console game (forza2).

And they still end up with, well shite really. If that's what BIG physicists buy you I think I'll pass.

Anyway, I voted no since internet sales seem to be working quite well as it is. As long as the devs can live comfortably off it, why change the formula? Distributing it online also prevents some big evil publisher from keeping XX% of the devs' earnings for themselves.

What I could see them do though, an something I believe Scawen has said they will, is doing some "real" marketing once it goes final (for both S2 and S3 really). There's still huge relatively untapped markets for a sim like LFS (The States and Asia come to mind) so getting the word out in the media could draw in a lot of new people.

Quote from spyshagg :

Today, in 2007 big companies are hiring BIG physicists to build tyre models and suspencion models for a console game (forza2).http://channel9.msdn.com/showpost.aspx?postid=314874

We heard the same kind of BS with GT 3 or 4! It's their way of doing marketing! By making their customers believe that the game is like reality but still they don't want to make them run with something discouraging. Keep in mind, it's a console game! It means that it is made so that it can be played with a joypad! It's pretty much where the simulation ends!