The other day I was thinking about LFS and how the car types and tracks are starting to appeal to me less and less as time goes on. I long for a few new cars in new classes or added to existing classes and some new tracks. So I was thinking I would be willing to pay a small fee for regular content updates. A new car or two or a new track environment every few months would be worth it to me for an added fee per update. I see it has having a few benefits with perhaps a few drawbacks.

Positive:
1) Regularly added new content.
2) Additional source of income for the devs.

Negative:
1) The devs need to code a new way to add content that is secure and allows for people with different levels of purchased content to race together. Ideally, all users would have the content but be restricted to using only what they have paid for.
2) More help may be needed to release regular content updates, which is an idea the devs have been reluctant to embrace for reasons of their own, which I can respect.

I know this idea may be very unlikely to ever happen, but I just wanted to toss it out there to get the communities thoughts and feedback and maybe if the devs happen to see theirs as well.

Quote from Gimpster :

1) The devs need to code a new way to add content that is secure and allows for people with different levels of purchased content to race together. Ideally, all users would have the content but be restricted to using only what they have paid for.

That would be the problem, would take lot of time away from Lord Scawen from improving other things and making physics and usability and the experience better. This system you are suggesting isn't the way LFS is developt. It's about stages, if they want to add a car they give it free as a nice surprise. If they added a car in current S2 content and asked money it would be against the license agreement, they could get around releasing them as new version or changing the license agreement but that wouldn't be right and would piss people off. The devs have also said that they are financially safe and have the money issue covered, so there isn't need for extra money harvesting and I doubt they would ever go down to the EA level of greed.

I'd be willing to pay more to speed the LFS development process - similar to what you're suggesting, and just as unlikely to happen

I think the negatives outweigh the positives here. The current system seems to work just fine

Quote from Gimpster :

The other day I was thinking about LFS and how the car types and tracks are starting to appeal to me less and less as time goes on.

I haven't driven all car/track combos yet, so i'm Light Years away from your situation.

Yea, holy crap I haven't even gotten to reversed tracks, heck look at my statistics Course the rally courses are never used because I drive RBR :rally_dri for that.
Plus I have fwd-itis where I can't drive front wheel drive cars or else I break out in itchy rashy blisters and if I continue to race them, the blister break and :wow: thats a whole different story down a whole different dark and creep alley way.

Quote from Blowtus :

I'd be willing to pay more to speed the LFS development process - similar to what you're suggesting, and just as unlikely to happen

:iagree: (and would pay to speed things up)

Quote from Infiniti :

Plus I have fwd-itis where I can't drive front wheel drive cars or else I break out in itchy rashy blisters and if I continue to race them, the blister break and :wow: thats a whole different story down a whole different dark and creep alley way.

Interesting... someone else with this same disease! Found a cure yet, other than masses of RWD cars?

So how much for an addon track or car? 5€? 10€ 1€?

I would be ready to pay for an additional addons, like cars, tracks or just speeded up process. But how could it be speeded up by just giving more money to the devs? Aren't they working quite hard already (16 hours a day, 8 days a week ).

Maybe this could make it way for the licensed stuff? Those who want real life stuff have to pay for it. You could even have some special conditions for it, like the car is usable only online where the validity of the user can be verified...

But still it just more work...

EDIT: I don't get rashy blisters. I just feel very sick

Basically, more rwd cars. Truely is a chronic illness with only one medication. Well, maybe destroying fwd all together. Some scientists have been researching may end the infectous disease that way.
But best thing to do is for your kids is to raise them up on awd, that way they can work up an immunity against fwd, while getting rwd at the same time. Best of both worlds in a balanced diet me papi always said!

I am sure that once LFS is considered to be finished then any new updates could well have an extra charge placed on them, particularily if they incorporate new tracks and cars. But LFS isn't finished yet. It's work in progress. The Dev's arn't going to spend a hell of a lot of time making new tracks and cars untill they got the actuall simulation where they want it.

It not a matter of useing every track config and car compination its about having car and track combinations that appeal to you, and I have run out of them. LFS is a racing simulator yet only have the cars are race cars. The low end race class, which I feel is the most fun, also only contains FWD cars, the XFR & UFR. Scawen is the coder, what are Eric and Victor doing while they wait for S2 to be considered complete? Perhaps they could be working on new cars and tracks for release here and there.

I don't want to sound like an ass but the development of LFS is taking ages, granted there are no rivals in tearms of what LFS is but still, by the time LFS arrives at its happy place the rest of the world will have moved on and out paced it. Its ahead of the curve now, but how long will it stay that way?

Quote from Gimpster :

It not a matter of useing every track config and car compination its about having car and track combinations that appeal to you, and I have run out of them. LFS is a racing simulator yet only have the cars are race cars. The low end race class, which I feel is the most fun, also only contains FWD cars, the XFR & UFR. Scawen is the coder, what are Eric and Victor doing while they wait for S2 to be considered complete? Perhaps they could be working on new cars and tracks for release here and there.

I've heard rumours that Eric was working on the cars, but i'm not sure if he's doing the interiors, or new cars. I really want some new cars, but not as payed content. Not everyone can just 'pay' over the internet, it took me a year to find a way to purchase S2, and I'm not sure if I can do it that way again. I think if the Devs give us a new car, like something to race against the UFR and XFR, it should be done like they did with the Sauber.

I like the idea I just doubt its practicality. Development of new cars/tracks is going to be time consuming and the developers would have little time to do anything else. Ofcourse if the fees were big enough Scavier could employ a whole new team of developers just to do this but then they would need to be sure of the demand before doing this.

So -1 for me but a nice idea nevertheless.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

Having optional additional content would just fragment the multiplayer. Yes you might have a new car and a new track but if, say, only half of LFS users buy that content then the chances of it being used much in multiplayer are pretty slim. Already we see most servers gravitate towards combos that are perceived as "popular" because the server owner wants to feel that their server is popular. These people wouldn't switch to a combo that most people online don't even have available.

-1 from me.

But then it could also give the special content for those who want it. It is quite obvious that some people want more cars like LX8 or karts (for example). So these could be the cars that you could buy separately. I have no interest to drive neither, but I bet there are many who do. People like me wouldn't driven the cars online even if we had them. So the effect on multiplayer wouldn't be that big, if visible at all

But additional content with a price label on it defenately gets a from me. With good quality/quantity I see no problems. Rallycross pack? Prototype pack? Karts pack?

I don't think OPTIONAL add-on content is a good idea for the reasons mentioned above, i.e. fragmented multiplayer.

It is a good idea, but I just don't see a way for it to work well across the whole community.

Quote :

I would be ready to pay for an additional addons, like cars, tracks or just speeded up process. But how could it be speeded up by just giving more money to the devs?

Not saying I approve, but a third party drawn from the talent already in this community could theoretically produce an LFS expansion adding new content, and with the support of the devs (along with the necessary contracts to limit developed content to cars & tracks) could be included into the game relatively easily.

This would speed up content development and would ensure high standards are maintained. The talent definately already exists in this community, developers who have the expertise and the passion for LFS not to break the game.

As for whether an LFS expansion pack would be a good thing, that's another matter and i'll leave that to the philosophers.

*in yoda style voice* patience, you must learn patience!

Quote from mrbogeyman :

I don't think OPTIONAL add-on content is a good idea for the reasons mentioned above, i.e. fragmented multiplayer.

I think the whole idea of a "fragmented community" is not a risk as long as everyone has access to the content (ie: it's in a non-pay patch), or as long as the content is so good that nearly everyone buys it. Take a look at Halo 2 and it's add-on map pack. It didn't "fragment" the community because everyone who plays the game wanted those new maps.

I would like nothing more than to get some new cars and tracks in LFS (okay, I'd like a better clutch model more, but that's about it). If the devs release a stadium truck or a mountain pass track, I and my friends will happily play it for hours on end. Those of you who don't want to can feel free to keep running the GTRs on Aston, just like you've always done.

LFS is far and away the best race sim on the market, and I think the devs know how much we love it and how much we appreciate their hard work. But, even so, I don't think it's possible to have too much content.

Quote from Cue-Ball :

I think the whole idea of a "fragmented community" is not a risk as long as everyone has access to the content (ie: it's in a non-pay patch), or as long as the content is so good that nearly everyone buys it. Take a look at Halo 2 and it's add-on map pack. It didn't "fragment" the community because everyone who plays the game wanted those new maps.

I would like nothing more than to get some new cars and tracks in LFS (okay, I'd like a better clutch model more, but that's about it). If the devs release a stadium truck or a mountain pass track, I and my friends will happily play it for hours on end. Those of you who don't want to can feel free to keep running the GTRs on Aston, just like you've always done.

LFS is far and away the best race sim on the market, and I think the devs know how much we love it and how much we appreciate their hard work. But, even so, I don't think it's possible to have too much content.

You just said it wouldnt fragment the community yet go on to explain how it would fragment the community. You say yu and yur friends would race it but then go on to those who dont dont pay for it - which would cause fragmentation.
This idea gets a -1 from me because of fragmentation and also (maybe this is almost a selfish view) but i knew when buying lfs that it was an alpha but i bought it anyway, knowing that when the full S2 comes out i will have it, like an investment thing. So ive bought S2, though i would gain more cars/tracks etc i dont see why i should have to pay again. Another reason for -1 is if a car/track is released that is popular then server will run that almost forcing people to stop playing lfs or buy update as alot of servers they cant access. Thirdly LFS is a world wide game, there are people of all ages playing and because of this could everyone afford to buy updates.

For me if i had to buy updates for LFS, though it is a great game it would put me off. Dont get me wrong i will happily buy S3 (when it finally is made lol) but thats because its the next instalment.
So all in all a big -1 from me.

I know that if there was a required fee to play LFS I would simply stop playing it, so -1 from me too.
Even if the game was finished I'd say no to a fee, because you can't even claim server fees when the races are player hosted.

Independant software developers make games because that's what they love doing. Most games in alpha stage are still funded by the devs, so in this case both the players and the devs are lucky that the cost is being subsidised and that we can play it.

Quote from Cue-Ball :

mumble mumble a mountain pass track, mumble mumble

:lovies3d:

Quote from Greboth :

You just said it wouldnt fragment the community yet go on to explain how it would fragment the community. You say yu and yur friends would race it but then go on to those who dont dont pay for it - which would cause fragmentation.

So you think that LFS should only have one car and one track? Because that's the ONLY way to have a "non fragmented" user base.

Fragmentation is just a fancy word for "nobody wants to drive the combo I want to drive". The only time this becomes a problem is when there are so many combos that you end up not having enough people to fill any of the servers OR you have third party add-ons which prevent people from connecting to the servers that they'd like to play on (think rFactor). And the only people that seem to complain about this are the ones who play on or host servers with popular configs (GTRs on Aston, for instance). As long as everyone has the content, there's no such thing as "fragmentation". The combos that people want to play get played - the combos they don't want to don't. Simple as that.

Don't forget that for every new car or track you add, not only are you adding a new combo to the game, but you're also expanding the scope of the game and making it more attractive to people who might otherwise not play. You could make an argument that adding a NASCAR style car to the game would "fragment" the user base. I would argue that adding that car may very well add a few hundred new players to the game that otherwise wouldn't play.

Give the users as much content as you can and then let market forces decide which ones get played.

Oh ok, so your saying yes the game would be more fragmented but thent he addons would bring new people so would cancel out?

Quote from Cue-Ball :

Give the users as much content as you can and then let market forces decide which ones get played.

As it stands the 'market' seems to have decided on gtr aston, gtr blackwood, bf1/f08 Oval to name a few. So add new cars or tracks and the market may decide on those being the the chosen combo but if people dont want that then the number of servers becomes very limited.

Quote from Cue-Ball :

Fragmentation is just a fancy word for "nobody wants to drive the combo I want to drive".

Thats not how i meant it. Take it to the extremes, say there 1000 tracks and 1000 cars and everyone with different preferences would you ever get a full server? yes the more popular ones would get played but the players would be more spread out than they are now.

Quote from Cue-Ball :

As long as everyone has the content, there's no such thing as "fragmentation".

Thats just it though, not everyone is going to buy the same addons. Say someone relesed a nascar i wouldnt buy it but you might. Someone could make a gokart id buy and you would for example. This would happen with every addon making people either buy addons they dont want just to play or not play.

This is only my opinion though, im not saying its right. I was simply saying i personally wouldnt buy addons i would leave lfs. Also the addons would be available to the community, so yes it may attract more people but i just think it would fragment the server even more.

Quote from Cue-Ball :

Give the users as much content as you can and then let market forces decide which ones get played.

Totally 100% Agree

The more styles of racing that exist in LFS the better. My dream is one day it'll encompass at least all forms of 4 wheel motorsport, or at least the major ones.