The online racing simulator
Quote from obsolum :That's not really unrealistic. I reckon most people use something along those lines, except maybe a bit more force in LFS.

The reason is it's hard to fight with higher FF with one hand when out of control - panicly changing gears etc

Quote from libben :a FFB restriction wouldent work anyway. As long you can have it at 100 percent in lfs, u can have it at 5 percent in logitech profiler.

If I am correct profiler keep your settings in registry. Simple reg reader could work here.
Or Devs can get in touch with Logitech to make LFS and Profiler a friends
I don't understand how using a lot of FFB is realistic. Most cars have power steering these days, and once you get going, they are really quite easy to turn. For eg, in my car I have -6 degrees of camber, pretty soft tyres and a locked diff, but I don't get sore arms at all (it's really easy to steer around the track). I use between 5-10% in game in rwd cars, and 15% in fwd cars, with 100% on profiler. The only reason I use FFB is to feel kerbs and bumps, otherwise I'd probably turn it off.

Anyhow, Millie Sabords says that you have to use TC and ABS to be competitive. ABS - maybe, but AFAIK there's really not a whole lot of time in ABS. Maybe 3 tenths at the most on a hotlap, with corners that you can really take advantage of it (also depends on the car, and your previous brake settings etc). TC in most cases (except bf1, obviously) is slower. If you want less wheelspin, you can have a manual TC that cuts in whenever you want, and turns itself off whenever you want. It's a fantastic mod, and what's better - everybody uses it! It's called your right foot.
Try instead of fully backing off, or trailing off the throttle when you start to slide, just quickly back off then get straight back on it - like within a split second. If you trail the throttle the car becomes unbalanced. This method (sorta like a quite throttle cut, I guess) is great because your car stays on edge, and you get rid of some unnecesary wheel spin (you always gotta have some).
To top that off, use a low degree of rotation in your wheel setting so you can quickly correct too much oversteer, and voila! You're fast! It's easy.
Quote from pasibrzuch :If I am correct profiler keep your settings in registry. Simple reg reader could work here.
Or Devs can get in touch with Logitech to make LFS and Profiler a friends

The problem is not everyone uses Logitech wheels and not everyone uses the same Profiler. Hell, a lot of people don't even have the profiler installed! Although I'm sure in those cases the FFB settings are still stored in the registry somewhere.

Quote from [DUcK] :To top that off, use a low degree of rotation in your wheel setting so you can quickly correct too much oversteer, and voila! You're fast! It's easy.

I'll assume that you were joking with this statement, as that is exactly the point of this thread
Quote from [DUcK] :...
Try instead of fully backing off, or trailing off the throttle when you start to slide, just quickly back off then get straight back on it - like within a split second. If you trail the throttle the car becomes unbalanced. This method (sorta like a quite throttle cut, I guess) is great because your car stays on edge, and you get rid of some unnecesary wheel spin (you always gotta have some).
...

You mean like stabbing the throttle? I would have expected that to unsettle the car a lot more...
I'll try then

I did not imply ABS+TC would make me faster over 1 or 5 laps, but the assists make it easier to be consistent over a longer race - and low rotations at the wheel help correting the slides, saving tyres.
Point may be valid only for slowpokes / casual racers, not for the fast guys - but I am not so sure.
Quote from Mille Sabords :You mean like stabbing the throttle? I would have expected that to unsettle the car a lot more...
I'll try then

That's were a lot make the mistake, when you hear smooth it doesn't necessarily mean smooth control inputs. There are situations were very quick control inputs can still maintain smooth weight transfer and car trajectories which result in faster lap times. I've found this to be true in both LFS and iRental, but at my age is only something I can pull off successfully when I'm in the zone which doesn't happen all that often! Unlike young quacks that live in the twilight zone
Quote from obsolum : I'll assume that you were joking with this statement, as that is exactly the point of this thread

Nope, I'm not. I know that's the point - but I'm just saying it's not unfair since everyone has the option to do it

Quote from Mille Sabords :You mean like stabbing the throttle? I would have expected that to unsettle the car a lot more...
I'll try then

Kind of. I mean that once you're on full throttle, if it starts to slide then you can sort of 'stab' it, I guess. It's a technique Ayrton Senna used to use, I think. Instead of having to correct oversteer by countersteering and heating up your tyres, you can be on and off the throttle and it will keep your momentum going, and save your tyres.
Just think how TC would work - like a 'bap bap bap bap' sound, and try do that with your throttle when you experience oversteer. It can also work the other way, when you've just entered the corner and you feel it's understeering, just stab the throttle a few times to get the back around

Quote from Glenn67 :That's were a lot make the mistake, when you hear smooth it doesn't necessarily mean smooth control inputs. There are situations were very quick control inputs can still maintain smooth weight transfer and car trajectories which result in faster lap times. I've found this to be true in both LFS and iRental, but at my age is only something I can pull off successfully when I'm in the zone which doesn't happen all that often! Unlike young quacks that live in the twilight zone

Yeah, it's all about keeping the balance. That's the secret. You want to keep the car on the optimal slip angle at all times. When you're on the limit - it's like an art. You use so minimal steering and you have so much control in your pedals. It's really quite an amazing thing. You need to keep the car right on the edge of too much slide. So you're always correcting little minute slides, with either the steering or throttle - depending on the situation.
Realistic depends on the car being modeled. Formula 1 cars use relatively small steering movements compared larger and heavier race cars. Generally in real life, the steering wheel forces are much greater and the movement much smaller than the wheels that you clamp onto a desktop. Short of a chassis and a high end force feedback wheel, you're not going to duplicate the feel of the wheel of a real car.

In the case of left foot braking, it's possible to do this on many racing cars. It's done even in Nascar by some drivers on road courses. Racing transmissions can be shifted without using the clutch, and just a blip of the throttle is enough for a downshift, while left foot braking. Heel and toe might be nice to do, but it's no longer needed in most racing cars. The upshifts just require a bit of a lift. Some cars have no lift shifters which limit or cut fuel during shifts, both for H pattern and sequenial shifters.

In addition, the sedans modeled in LFS are antiquated by todays standards. Most modern cars have ABS, some have stability control, and some now have DCT (dual clutch transmissions), that offer clutchless, no lift shifts, or fully automatic shifting, with what is otherwise a manual transmission.
Quote from Ger Roady :Dosn't make sense
http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?p=1353796#post1353796

In what way doesn't it make sense? Ducky said he drove the car, he didn't say he left foot braked the car like Murphy. Murphy's car isn't his normal drive it was just a one of test drive, he normally drives a commodore cup car which is different again.

Scott just curious while we are on this topic if you know the regulations for the different (Commodore Cup, V8Supercars) serries and weather or not it specifies anything about steering sensitivity (deg of rotation) and also pedal layout?
Well, I find this thread funny.
I know a heck of a lot of people use auto clutch and sequential shifter, less wheel rotation, assists, etc. However I see no advantage to this. I can shift up and shift down far faster than they can and my clutch will last longer too. The degrees of rotation is just a personal preference in my opinion. If they can't react fast enough to correct and need less rotation, that's their problem.

I drive so my wheel is always 1:1 with the in-game wheel, full H-shifter manual clutch (yes, I heel-toe every downshift), my brakes WILL lock if pushed too hard, and absolutely no assists in any car.

Just keep that in mind when you are racing with me and good luck.

Edit: I read some more of the posts in this thread and I guess I am one of only a couple people here that are fast without any assists.
If I had two cameras (one for my pedals and one for my shifter and wheel) I would gladly show you how it's done. Well, G25 pedals suck so it is not really heel-tow, it is more like left half of my foot half foot is on brake and the right half on the throttle.
Rusty,

To keep the costs down, Commodore Cup ensures that all cars have tightly controlled parts. You cannot change the degree of steering rotation, and you may not build a 'pedal box' in your car like the V8's have. These must remain stock (of course, like I have, you can heavily modify your pedals to make your heel & toe as easy as possible).
Quote from Glenn67 :In what way doesn't it make sense? Ducky said he drove the car, he didn't say he left foot braked the car like Murphy.

Sorry, I misread it .I do not know Murphy and thought Duck and Murphy is one person
Quote from libben :I would like to see that they remove the options for other views then cockpit while racing, not being able to paddleshift with autoclutch and so on.

I wouldent let crashers and people with no serious attempt on racing clean and on equal terms ruin my creation for others.

I happen to use chase view and use the paddles to shift but I still am not a crasher and I definately attempt to race clean.

Shocking, isn't it?
Quote from skstibi :I can do the downshifts without the clutch for real and in LFS but the upshifts without touching the clutch and never lifting on a h-pattern? wtf...

Yeah well fist of all excuse my drunk posting but I just got home

Kk, well, in Commodore Cup, V8supercars and a lot of other racing seris', we use a gearbox called a 'dogbox' which contains gears that are 'straight cut' which allows us to shift without using clutch. The straight cut gears mean that they basically 'bonk' into each other, without having to bypass a synchro mesh, which a standard box would have. Anyone wants to help me explain it better - please do.
Oh and also, v8's now and pretty sure got introduced into the 'killswitch', which like kills the engine for a split second as you shift up, which means you don't have to lift up. The killswitch in a V8supercar is determinded by the weight force you put on the shifter, and once over I think 7,200rpm, you can pull the shifter at any time (flat out) and the engine will cut for a split second, allowing the drive train to be loosened so you can go up a gear, n stuff... yeah it might not make sense but I'm struggling to even see the screen atm
Quote from zeugnimod :I happen to use chase view and use the paddles to shift but I still am not a crasher and I definately attempt to race clean.

Shocking, isn't it?

Every sparrow is a bird. But that does not mean that every bird is a sparrow.

If you understand what I'm saying
Quote from obsolum :Every sparrow is a bird. But that does not mean that every bird is a sparrow.

If you understand what I'm saying

Well, yes.

But to say that the majority of people who use chase view and/or use the paddles to shift are wreckers/unfair drivers is ridiculous, don't you think?
Quote from zeugnimod :But to say that the majority of people who use chase view and/or use the paddles to shift are wreckers/unfair drivers is ridiculous, don't you think?

Yes, but that's not what he said, like I tried to point ou in my previous post

Every sparrow is a bird. Not every bird is a sparrow.

"Every" crasher/wrecker uses chasecam with a cheap wheel. Not everyone who uses chasecam with a cheap wheel is a crasher

Of course not every crasher uses chasecam, but I think it's safe to assume that the majority of people who have no intention on racing cleanly use chasecam and don't have a G25.
When I had the my G25 wheel on the desk I can not set more force as 40 at road cars and 15-20 at GTR cars due to desk instability. But when I have it installed to the cockpit I have 90% force setting at street cars and 80(90)% at GTR cars. Of course all other setting are realistic as it is possible. Most-Most-Most realistic.
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_nAuME7_f ... JIg/30112009%28012%29.jpg
Just for information:
I'm using G25, manual clutch and H-box. I do pretty well in longer races as for final position, but can't ever beat the fastest lap-times. So, when reading this thread, I thought I'd have a go on auto-clutch and paddles. It took me 9 laps on Blackwood to shave off half a second on my PB that had 3 weeks of training behind it ! Interesting.

Now, I will of course set my gearbox to H-box and full manual clutch again, but the test made me realize, I'm not that slow... as I thought I was. Also, I bet some of you fast guys are using manual clutch and H-box which I find very impressive ! But from many fellow racers I found out they were going auto-clutch and paddles (or even automatic gear-shifting).

So this experience told me, once again, that a better server-filter could be useful for "us" that have the option to use H-box and manual/analog clutch. It would simply make us all meet under the same hardware usage conditions (and driving attitude). As one above just pointed out, it could be a good idea to just create a G25-club (or similar hardware) wherein we are all prepared to enjoy the full of LFS... but dont know if it would work in practice?

Thx for reading, happy drivin!
Quote from Ingolf :So this experience told me, once again, that a better server-filter could be useful for "us" that have the option to use H-box and manual/analog clutch. It would simply make us all meet under the same hardware usage conditions (and driving attitude). As one above just pointed out, it could be a good idea to just create a G25-club (or similar hardware) wherein we are all prepared to enjoy the full of LFS... but dont know if it would work in practice?

I remember that an australian server did that using InSim. Here is the thread: NARA Full Simulation Host, G25 and Porsche.
Thanks m8! I'll check it out.
Manual clutch via a button should be faster than auto-clutch. On some cars in LFS, you can hold down the shift up button (or paddle) and nothing happens, but then tap the clutch button, which cause the actual shift to occur, which results in a very fast shift. IIRC, this works on the Formula BMW.
Experiment all G25'ers!

FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG