Quote from lovretta :

Every Dire Straits studio album Luckily for me as i'm big fan of the band.
Their second album Communique as a great example, because it features some songs which require a lot of dynamic range, for example "Where do you think you're going

Thats what they we're all about initially, they we're a relaxed and refined band, something different amongst all the electronic, overproduced crap of the time. Sultans of Swing works really well because the drums are quite prominent, not drowned out by everything else. Although perhaps they went a bit naff on the last album.

Most modern rock is all about guitar and vocals, the rythm section takes a back seat.

Quote from 5haz :

Most modern rock is all about guitar and vocals, the rythm section takes a back seat.

if you like focusing on rhythm sections, i think you're listening to the wrong bands

Quote from george_tsiros :

if you like focusing on rhythm sections, i think you're listening to the wrong bands

What'cha mean? I just don't like rock music that has no bass to it, all parts of the band should be able to be heard well IMO, not drowned out by one or two parts.

Quote from The Moose :

However, the lossy files do have a 16.2khz cut off. But, the good news is, your speakers may not handle much above that, or your hearing may not recognize it anyway, that's why it was picked for the cut off for mp3."

Super, so it's still designed for a shitty sound system, just in a different way... perhaps this fellow has never heard of harmonics?

It happens because it sells records. The same reason that duff vocal notes are nudged into pitch, hiss from the signal chain is chopped out of guitar parts, silence is inserted in between staccato bass notes, and so on.

It works on some records and could be argued to improve them, but more often than not it's undesirable. I have to say I do appreciate records that are just well recorded in the first place and you can hear the room the instruments were played in. I've been listening to the first G. Love & Special Sauce album a lot this week and that's a great recording.

But don't blame the music industry, blame the artist. If the artist gave a toss about this stuff he/she/they wouldn't be letting a studio do this to their recordings, and arguably they wouldn't have anything to do with big labels. But of course they want to maximise their record bux so they sell their material to the majors and let them do what they do to produce a hit from it.

We used to call those people sell-outs back when we had an actual indie scene.

I am totally against the loudness put into music. It makes everything in the song a giant :thumbsdow I like hearing the drums!

:drummer: :headbang:

Quote from thisnameistaken :

It happens because it sells records. The same reason that duff vocal notes are nudged into pitch, hiss from the signal chain is chopped out of guitar parts, silence is inserted in between staccato bass notes, and so on.

This is exactly what the loudness is for. I actually took my walkman with me today with a few Red Hot Chili Peppers songs from the Californication album. I had a few of the unmastered songs and a few of the mastered songs. Obviously, the unmastered songs kept pretty much everything: the hiss, pops, clicks, echoes but it had great dynamic range at a lower volume. The mastered song was a muddy mess but it was quite loud and those audio "artifacts" were gone.

So I gave a few of my friends a listen. A lot of the people chose the mastered one because it sounded "clean" and had more guitar and voice. They also felt that the song had more volume in the parts where they cared. They didn't like the unmastered version because they felt that it was unnatural for the bass and drums to come out strong and clear. A few who chose it said they liked that muddy sound because it gives a certain mood. The unmastered one was chosen by only a few people. They noticed that the unmastered version was more dynamic and though they didn't like all of the audio "artifacts" they felt it was much more enjoyable than the mastered version, which some of my friends hated because they thought it sounded like it came out of a crappy radio.

So what "thisnameistaken" is saying is very true, at least with my sample. By the way, the ones who liked the unmastered version were more devoted musicians and one audiophile of my school.

Wow, just noticed the DM CD vs GH3 comparsion.

/me is away to buy GH3 right now.

Quote from Shadowww :

Wow, just noticed the DM CD vs GH3 comparsion.

/me is away to buy GH3 right now.

Heh never thought guiter hero will actually have any contribution to the music industry.

Quote from JJ72 :

Heh never thought guiter hero will actually have any contribution to the music industry.

Offtopic, but: I'd say Guitar Hero is doing more for the music industry than many people realise. Take my 15 year old brother. Guitar Hero has so far opened his eyes for the good old classics in music, gotten him interested in playing an instrument, resulted in him buying and playing a (real) guitar, buying and playing a (real) drum set, and him now playing in a band of sorts with a few of his mates, also raised on Guitar Hero. I'd say more people enjoying and playing music is entirely a good thing...certain horror-stories involving compulsions to buy effect-pedals for one's bass excluded of course.

your brother would have entered into the whole music playing deal whether he saw it on guitar zero or whatever.

it's not the game that did something. your brother did.

Quote from wien :

Offtopic, but: I'd say Guitar Hero is doing more for the music industry than many people realise. Take my 15 year old brother. Guitar Hero has so far opened his eyes for the good old classics in music, gotten him interested in playing an instrument, resulted in him buying and playing a (real) guitar, buying and playing a (real) drum set, and him now playing in a band of sorts with a few of his mates, also raised on Guitar Hero. I'd say more people enjoying and playing music is entirely a good thing...certain horror-stories involving compulsions to buy effect-pedals for one's bass excluded of course.

I agree with all of that apart from the compulsive bass FX buying, which I heartily approve of.

Quote from george_tsiros :

it's not the game that did something. your brother did.

Of course it's him, but ignoring the influence the game had seems a little simplistic. This is a kid who listened mainly to mainstream hip-hop (not the good kind) prior to being introduced to Guitar Hero. Even if the desire to play music may have been latent in him, so to speak, it was the fun he had in the game that gave him the motivation to pick up a real guitar and give it a whirl. Sometimes that's all it takes.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

I agree with all of that apart from the compulsive bass FX buying, which I heartily approve of.

It's... beautiful.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

I agree with all of that apart from the compulsive bass FX buying, which I heartily approve of.

im getting a horrible vision of you playing music in a similar way as wesely willis does by pressing buttons at random points far off beat

Quote from wien :

Of course it's him, but ignoring the influence the game had seems a little simplistic.

hmmm

i mean, the deciding factor was your brother himself. guitar hero was a coincidence. suppose there wasn't guitar hero. your brother would still have the bug inside him. he would perhaps later on see this and get the initial enthusiasm. or listen to an old Rush album and be mesmerized. or just see someone bang some drums

dunno if you get the idea

Quote from george_tsiros :

i mean, the deciding factor was your brother himself. guitar hero was a coincidence.

Are you trying to argue that our experiences have no influence on our future behaviour? He had it in him, hence him playing GH in no way influenced his desire to play a real instrument?

Yes he had it in him, that much is obvious. Yes he may possibly have started playing regardless. What I don't get is why that is important? In this particular instance GH was the thing that provided the motivation. Why do you feel you need to argue that point somehow? Lots of people live their lives without realising their potential. If GH can get some kids off their asses and into garages so they can realise theirs, isn't that a good thing?

Why are we even arguing about this?

Quote from Shotglass :

im getting a horrible vision of you playing music in a similar way as wesely willis does by pressing buttons at random points far off beat

While angrily commanding the listener to commit acts of bestiality.

Since i'm not a big fan of metallica, i didn't actually heard how bad it was.

I found this example http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRyIACDCc1I
sorry if some of you posted it, but i just cannot believe my ears!

What the **** they were listening to when they pulled this through limiter? Those distorted guitar parts at the end of a video! This is unbelievable.

Some of you posted that he gave dynamic-rich records to a friend and they said "it sounds like it comes from a cheap radio". Well retail Metallica album sounds like they took mastered version (let's imagine it is the one found in GH), played it on some system VERY loud, while recording that with microphone. Then they sad "yeah, this is how it was suppose to sound like".

I wouldn't call this ordinary "make it loud" effort. This is in different category, more like "something went horribly wrong".

..seems like it was their own fault, not the audio engineer. I guess there isn't one who would sign his name onto this.

Does anyone know of an application that can analyze mp3 files (or .wav, .wmv) and display a graph like the one Crommi posted on the previous page? I'm asking because there's this album by a band I like, and from the very first time I listened to it I felt like it was mixed/mastered way too loud. It really bugs me everytime I listen to it.

The thing is, I've pointed this out on other forums to other people and none of them seem to notice it. So now I'm wondering if it's just me My guess is those other people's hearing is probably messed up from going to too many concerts without wearing earplugs. So I'd like to analyze a few songs from that particular album and then compare it to some other songs from previous albums and compare the results to get my point across.

Try this http://audacity.sourceforge.net/

Quote from obsolum :

I'm asking because there's this album by a band I like, and from the very first time I listened to it I felt like it was mixed/mastered way too loud.

Maybe i'm misunderstanding you, but... Loudness doesn't mean it's a "loud" recording.

Quote from The Moose :

Try this http://audacity.sourceforge.net/

Terrific, thanks a lot Stu! This should illustrate my point nicely

Quote from jibber :

Maybe i'm misunderstanding you, but... Loudness doesn't mean it's a "loud" recording.

Yeah I know, bad choice of words

be sure to analyze a .wav of the music, as mp3 won't have all the detail of the CD

the loudness war is the one thing that has stopped me buying the new Flaming Lips album