The online racing simulator
Mods Technical Assistance
(379 posts, started , go to first unread)
Quote from Snoop.DriftEra :For example, I need 2-sided windshield. I have two copys of same windshield with triangles faced different sides. But when I delete some cutouts in Editor, it merges all the points when i exit [Model Edit] mode and I get a mess with Normals.

As in your case you don't want to use the double sided triangles, you must use a different smoothing group for the inside and outside surfaces.

Quote from Snoop.DriftEra :Here's another example on screenshot: I need my fender to have a cut (see normals coming out of "one" point at the body line?; in fact there's two points in same place that each belongs to their own surfaces. But the whole fender can not be divided by smoothing groups. This screenshot made before I made a cleanup. After cleanup Editor screws everything up and make surface solid with no cut. How do I bypass it?

As the points in the same location will be merged at some point, you do have to use a different smoothing group for the top and bottom surface.

I understand, you have found a rare case where the smoothing groups are hard to use, because you want the top and bottom triangles to have a different smoothing group at the seam, but the same smoothing group rearward of the seam.

I think the only solution is to use different smoothing groups for the top section and the bottom section, and use extra triangles at the rear where the top and bottom section meet. By making the extra triangles co-planar where they meet, they will end up with the same normal.
Quote from Scawen :As in your case you don't want to use the double sided triangles, you must use a different smoothing group for the inside and outside surfaces.


As the points in the same location will be merged at some point, you do have to use a different smoothing group for the top and bottom surface.

I understand, you have found a rare case where the smoothing groups are hard to use, because you want the top and bottom triangles to have a different smoothing group at the seam, but the same smoothing group rearward of the seam.

I think the only solution is to use different smoothing groups for the top section and the bottom section, and use extra triangles at the rear where the top and bottom section meet. By making the extra triangles co-planar where they meet, they will end up with the same normal.

It's not a rare case in modeling. My whole model was made that way and i spent hours (years in fact)s to make it look as close to real photos as possible.. And now a need to make it again because of shared vertices? And even if I did, it will look not as it supposed to anyway.

Sadness.
Well maybe you have misunderstood me. I didn't explain very well, but can't do without diagrams.

Anyway another method could be this:

Down in the crack at the point where you want the break in smoothing, set that to two rows of points (as you created anyway, but then they are combined automatically) but separate them by 1mm. Connect these with a very thin surface of triangles which are in a separate smoothing group.
Quote from Scawen :Well maybe you have misunderstood me. I didn't explain very well, but can't do without diagrams.

Anyway another method could be this:

Down in the crack at the point where you want the break in smoothing, set that to two rows of points (as you created anyway, but then they are combined automatically) but separate them by 1mm. Connect these with a very thin surface of triangles which are in a separate smoothing group.

It's a good method, I could do that on modelling stage if I wasn't spare triangles for LFS's polycount limit.
But.. first of all: If I add some extra triangles, so what's the economy? Wasn't that shared vertices made to force us to spare some extra PC resources/file size? If not, then why can't we bypass this pain?
Second: I see some mods with all the edges are broken. Those mods are BUGGED, and LFS's engine is ok with that. But when i need to do same thing ON PURPOSE in few places here and there - i can't, because of auto-weld points. Why make us suffer, Scawen?ShrugSmile

Let me give you another example. I have a wheel arch. It has a surface INside of interior and it has a surface OUTdoors, under the fenders. They share same coordinates, but it is two different surfaces, that has to be dirty from outside and clean from interior. So they need two different mappings and different normals. Two sided faces can't have two mappings on different sides, correct me if i wrong.


Another question:

I've made four configurations of my mod. They all have same attachments as a chassis and suspension. But only one configuration has them non-deformable, others three can damage. How do I make them deformable or not? I want to use that option.

[Later that day]
I found some consequence: LFS and EDITOR crashed on that third configuration that was able to deform some attachments. But it happens after I deleted some unused triangles from another attachment. Also it crashed before on same configuration if i do not include XRR Shifter Knob in it (MOD based on 0.6U XR VOB mod).
I've tried ClenUp options as Scawen offered before (and it helped before), but no luck this time.

Also how can i sort default setttings. I want Stock to stand up in list. I tried anything, but still have [Kyoto] first in list and [FS6R92A] is second (i thought F goes berore K in Latin alphabet. Uhmm).


Another question: Is it possible to make rims chrome?(rims, not spokes) I did not find rim mapping in rim editor.

Excuse me for huge text rain and thank you for help.
Hi! I've made a mod based on 2020/2021 F1 cars, but as we all know these cars have huge amounts of aerodynamic and also dirty air, in lfs I noticed dirty air/draft works from 0,3 thents gap or lower, irl it works from a much longer distance and the problem is that if dirty air would be like irl there wouldn't be problem because you would feel when you start to lose downforce, but in lfs only works from 0,3 thents then when you start losing downforce it's a very big loss of downforce and is almost impossible to keep the car of track, wanted to know a little about how dirty air works in lfs and also if there's a way to decrease the dirty air.
This picture shows why do I need vertices to be separated and it shows how impossible to use smoothing groups on opposite faced surfaces that use same coordinates but different textures (example: Motor shield ,front strut towers and wheel arches).

06U - LFSCarImp - Good
07U - LFSEditor - Not good

[SOLVED]


Solution:
Quote from Scawen :
- CTRL+SHIFT and click on a triangle.
- Then assign that group of selected triangles to a smoothing group.
- Clear selection
- CTRL+SHIFT on another group and assign that.

Quote from Amynue :This does indeed work great on freshly imported .vobs. Sadly the mod I'm currently working on already got smoothed by the LFS Modeller long ago and I've done too many changes to the model to now import the .vob again.

I had to re-import my model and assign all groups while model is un-smothed automaticaly.

Also I found that two opposite-faced triangles can have different texture and share same points, just has to be in different smoothing groups so normals look nice (not the same as two-sided faces). It can be used on outer and inner windows, exactly what i needed!
Attached images
S13_GEN3_104.jpg
Quote from Snoop.DriftEra :This picture shows why do I need vertices to be separated and it shows how impossible to use smoothing groups on opposite faced surfaces that use same coordinates but different textures (example: Motor shield ,front strut towers and wheel arches).

06U - LFSCarImp - Good
07U - LFSEditor - Not good

Never heard of LFSCarImp. Was it able to import a model's UV map into the LFS format? As not being able to do that is IMO the major point limiting quality and performance of LFS mod cars. And also related from my experience on RD, the spotting of ripped car models. People ripping cars very very rarely altered the UV map the models came with (from Forza, NFS etc), making spotting and comparing them really easy.
HELP!

1)
Why does my brake calipers appear only at Right side?
[SOLVED]
It has to be:
"Mirrored subobject: [yes]"


2)
How can I adjust calipers position? I need to move calipers deeper inside the wheel. Moving [В] point affects nothing except modeller view.
[SOLVED (Kinda)]
I moved them with 3d points, but it's only visual. Offset in suspension settings moves them with wheel, wich is not right since wheel must have it's own offset, independent of caliper).

3)
How can I replace Main Object's model without losing data?
-If I delete old body in Main object's mesh and try to merge car body from sub - i lose lights, colors, skinning and layers (all merges to 1 layer).
-If I try to replace Main Object directly - I lose all previous subs such as brakes, steering wheels, etc etc, but lights, skin and layers are ok.
Is there a compromise?
[SOLVED]
-Save sub as separate 3D object. Open it separately. Split parts it into subs. Assingn each part to required layer. Save all subs as seperate 3d objects, deleting all unused layers mesh. Load main model. Create new clean sub. Import required 3d object to new sub. Select MAIN. Highlight the layer you want to merge part in. Merge into main. Repeat for all parts.
-Reassign all cloned materials (mappings) to previously existed in MAIN to make lights and skin work.

4).1
Headlights made in attachment [A], it's layer is used on all configurations, but works only at one configuration.
[SOLVED]
Polycount limit (65535) exceeded for current car configuration = lights won't show up.

4).2
Lights worked before I've add LOD2 with working light mapping into Main object.
[SOLVED]
1)Cloned material names in different subs. For example: model can contain only one single "l_head" mapping for the whole model in any subobject. In my case I had one in Main and one in Attachment, so only one (Main) worked.

5) REDO
[SOLVED (Not sure)]
In case you didn't know like i did:
Ctl+Z = Undo / Ctrl+Shift+Z = Redo
(I thought that redo does not exist. Does not work everywhere expected anyway.)

6)
Can objects swap driver sides without flipping texture?
Example: My model has different side mirrors for driver and passenger sides. When they swap driver side, they flip the skin texture. Do I have to create separate mods for JDM and USDM car version because of it? (Mirrors are in the Main object)

For non SKIN cases this method works:
Quote from Scawen :If the mapping name starts with U_ then it doesn't flip.

7)
Game crashes on some car configurations. Some layer combinations cause LFS to crash, for example the XRR shifter layer cause game to crash if it's OFF (XR VOB mod conversion). Also game crashes if I delete some of this layer's triangles or delete it completely. The final model is under 60K polycount. How can I debug it?

8)
Game crashes after I have duplicated all windows in main object and flipped them to have separate inner texture for windows with more transparency. If I delete one of them (inner or outer windows), game does not crash. It does not crash though if I use double-sided material on any of them. The final model is under 52K polycount. This is different story to point "7)" and happens on config that did not crash before. I have no idea why does it happen.
[SOLVED]
The overall textures megapixels limit (5Mp) was exceeded too much, by 30+ Mp. Window texture was the last drop in this limit.

9)
Center points error. Edges are not belong to it's points.
-It has to be like this:
https://www.lfs.net/attachment/334353
-But it is like this:
https://www.lfs.net/attachment/334354

* * *

ACCAkut , nah it didn't. It used the same LFS methods, but you had to type all coordinates by hand and virtually imagine what you do. No preview. Nothing. You type digits, go to LFS and see. And on and on and on. And also if you screw up with some materials you can throw away your VOB and start from scratch again. Now you can imagine which pain I went through with this mod)))).

Lack of UV mapping is bad for mod converters, but is good for LFS. You can increase decrease/model polycount without mappimg each part/LOD model separately. Mapping is always at the same place. So the model can evolve with time just by adding more triangles to it without remapping.

I really have to take my hat off to Scawen and Team that many things in LFS are made very wise. And many things are implemented just now for public been noticed by us, modders, long time ago. Of course we push a lot of hate either because many things are unusual and inconvenient for what we got used to.

*Added* Also this may be interesting for you, not actually a UV, but looks like well-known method of mapping for most 3D artists Wink https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VI5qkYtuM68
Attached images
lfs_00000026.jpg
lfs_00000027.jpg
@Snoop Ok, thanks. And its not bad for converters, but for any from-scratch-creating 3D artist that learned his craft before starting to mod for LFS, its just so 100% against the grain. Been messing with a few game engines over the years and while they all have oddities, I haven't seen any that threw out UVs. Yeah I get this system has its upsides if you're going into it totally uneducated.. I may call the decision to go down this specific route brave, but never wise.
Little trick I found: in Blender you can fine-tune position of steering wheel and dashboard right in Blender, as if you were testing them in LFS.
For example, If you use str_lx animation as start, set camera FOV = 90 degrees and camera coordinates
X = Xdriver
Y = Ydriver + 0.215m
Z = Zdriver + 0.87m
str_*another* different, don't figure out yet
Quote from Snoop.DriftEra :HELP!
5) REDO
[SOLVED (Kinda)]
In case you didn't know like i did:
Ctl+Z = Undo / Ctrl+Shift+Z = Redo
(I thought that redo does not exist. Does not work everywhere expected anyway.)

That's kinda weird way to do "Redo" function, usually on most Windows app it uses Ctrl+Y 🤔
-
(Snoop.DriftEra) DELETED by Snoop.DriftEra : unimportant off-topic information.
Hello guys sorry if i ask wrong here but i'm kind of newbie; where i can ask moderators/admins if x mod is compatible on lfs public mods or if "x" is denied to publish mod. Thankies! the x is: https://skfb.ly/6xMFP
I think that model is not allowed to be used, because:

1) there does not appear to be a copyright license stated
2) the person who posted it states they are not the owner of the model

Unfortunately the original source is not given so the origin of this model is not clear.
Ty sir, now is clear; can u recomand me a good place where owner posts their mods for sell? Thankies so much!
I can't really... my understanding is the the model websites are infested with illegally ripped models from other games, mixed in with a few legitimate models. It's not easy to know which models are legitimate, even if they claim to be.

There's a thread which lists sites that sometimes have suitable models, and some sites that do not (because e.g. they do not even have the concept of a license, or they have a license that does not allow use in LFS).
https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/97013

Blacklist of some already known illegally ripped models:
https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/98538-Blacklist-of-sources-with-illegally-ripped-models

Some other discussions:
https://www.lfs.net/forum/518-Discussions
Trying to understand units of measure in dashboard texture.
It's 512*512px centered, and X and Y coordinates of speedo and tacho are unitless fractions of half (256px) of texture (see attachment).
One unit of dimension of multi function display is 1/64 of whole texture width 512/64=8px

But radius of speedo and tacho does not correspond to fractions nor pixels.
Attached images
clocks.jpg
This thread is dead
Hello. I'm trying to send a modification of the car. Please tell me why I can't download the file "XRT_DIMON86.7z" ? Writes error:


Vehicle mod archive * :
This mod has been exported from the editor with the wrong name. It should be XRT_DIMON86
When we have seen this in the past, it means the user has not exported the vehicle with the correct name from the vehicle editor. Please make sure the export name is exact when you type it in the editor. You can't rename the .7z file after export.
thank you!
Guys, how long does the "Pending review" of my mod take?
You set it as hidden review. That is very much not recommended. We have a public review system which is designed to reduce the workload of the reviewers. Nearly all "private review" requests are rejected. The reviewers are community volunteers and they have a lot of mods to look at. This is why we have a public review system.
Fixed it. Please consider my mod. Thanks.
I don't know if this belong here but, there's people using private / deleted mods online thanks to some cheat engine script. This worries me a lot since it can bother on some mods devlopment
We believe the exploit that allowed private / deleted / old version mods no longer works after changes we made on Tuesday. If you see any such mods being used, please let us know the mod name (and an MPR if you have it) so we can look into it.

Mods Technical Assistance
(379 posts, started )
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