Steer look and G-force movements are a MUST for me to get a realistic feel from LFS, its way to static otherwise.

Steer - look I find odd. One can probably get used to it but I'd say its one of those things that makes sims harder. One of the essential things in race sims is to know where the nose of the car is pointing (i.e. the yaw angle). With look/steer enabled, you sort of have to do some brainwork to figure out where the car is actually pointing as the view doesn't always resemble it.

Also when applying opposite lock, the head will turn the other way.. I'd like my view to be fixed, with only a bit of 'shake' for effect perhaps.

A more complex system might work a bit better, i.e. look based on something like a combination of lateral G force and corner radius..

the g force movements have an effect of decoupling me from the car ... the veiw shifts everywhere and i lose focus of where the cars pointing ... especially in the faster cars
also ever since the movement was clipped it looks very mechanical across curbs which makes me dizzy if theres a cockpit component right on the centre of the screen (rac)

and not having those movements made me realize how bumpy some tracks really are

On the contrary, having those movements made me realize how bumpy some tracks really are.
Otherwise a lot of the smaller bumps were completely filtered out by the suspension...

The way I see it, when you are driving for real, your head moves quite a lot, when you turn a corner, you instinctivly look at the "apex", by having some g-forces, not a big amount, and some small amount of "look when steering" (look to apex) makes it a whole lot less static and a whole lot more fluid.

I can post my settings if you fancy a try?

Quote from choxaway :

I don't play any games online......

Despite my moans, I still enjoy the overall driving experience, the realistic sense of speed and the 'normality' of the graphics - skies, trees, roadside rendering that don't look as cartoon-like as some games, but I feel disinclined to pay for and download the S2 add-on until I can see some increased sense of reality kicking into this game. For now I'll just have to deal with the A1's concrete fast cars and hope things improve with later patches.

Well you should thats where LFS excels .

As for reality this is as good as it gets. I would avoid racing against the AI, they're not human!

I think a big part of the problem is the lack of a sensation of speed -- but drive one of the faster cars (FOX, for example) and LFS portrays the speed quite well. So there really is no problem -- you're just driving a slow car, going faster than you should because as a racing sim that's what you expect, then being bitten by the car's actual performance when you get to a turn. The FOX is actually about the easiest car in the game to drive, for me.

Quote from AndroidXP :

On the contrary, having those movements made me realize how bumpy some tracks really are.
Otherwise a lot of the smaller bumps were completely filtered out by the suspension...

well you only really nocive them in something like the fo8 or bf1
but did you know that the inside of the turn at the end of the blackwood backstraight is very bumpy ?

Quote from danowat :

The way I see it, when you are driving for real, your head moves quite a lot, when you turn a corner, you instinctivly look at the "apex", by having some g-forces, not a big amount, and some small amount of "look when steering" (look to apex) makes it a whole lot less static and a whole lot more fluid.

the difference is in a real car i know exacly where my head is and feel every change in forces on it and can combine both these to get the comlete picture ... in a sim i have neither and with those movements i dont even know for sure where the cars pointing at

also in reality if i countersteer i dont look at the outside of the turn momentarily

Quote from Shotglass :

well you only really nocive them in something like the fo8 or bf1
but did you know that the inside of the turn at the end of the blackwood backstraight is very bumpy ?

Well, no, but that's more up to the fact that I almost don't touch Blackwood anymore (especially not with FO8/BF1), and I don't actively memorize such details. However, I just tested it in the XFR and yes it's actually quite noticeable, even more so with the head movements enabled. Seriously, just driving over the kerbs makes my screen rattle, while with disabled movement it's completely still. One can argue that a still image might help you with turn in accuracy or whatever, but I prefer the immersion, thankyouverymuch.

Just FYI, my settings are
1g head tilt: 1.00°
1g lateral shift: 0.020m
1g forward shift: 0.020m
1g vertical shift: 0.030m

I turn off all view movements - they give me a headache, make me slower and aren't very realistic at all imo. They certainly don't give me any more 'feel'.

Each to there own I guess, I just can't stand the static, fixed, "on a pole" feeling you get without them, blows away any sense of immersion for me.

I guess its the same as views, some people like the "wheels" view, and say it makes them quicker, I couldn't care less, I would rather be a little (a lot arguably) slower and have some sense of immersion in the sim.

But thats just me I guess............

One day I will find something both Tristan and I agree on............one day.............one day

Quote from AndroidXP :

Just FYI, my settings are
1g head tilt: 1.00°
1g lateral shift: 0.020m
1g forward shift: 0.020m
1g vertical shift: 0.030m

i had very similar settings until patch u-somethingorother came around and like i said earlier the curbs started to make me sick

Unfortunately the G-shift settings don't (last time I checked) transfer well in one case:

I had tweaked the g-shift for one of the road cars to what I felt realistic for a loosely supportive seat. Then going to the oval BF1 races(gasp, it was a strange time in my life), the g-shift would push you out of the the car's side restraints! (I generally stay away from the BFoval now, but at the time it really did provide some white-knuckled close racing with big-fields)

I use a mild amout of the g-shift for immersion, but i disabled the turn-look for the reasons already mentioned. It hurt my times, and felt too predeterminded for my liking.That said:

Going almost as fast on my G25 @ 1:1 900degrees, 3 pedal and H-shift and 22" ws lcd is a much more rewarding and immersive experience than the ultimate pace I had with a 200degree momo black and 17" 1280x768 ws lcd.

I don't use steer-look, or in fact lateral movement either because I find it harder to be sure which way the car is pointing. I use the up/down and forward/backward head movement though, it just seems more lively. It's generally turned down from default because in the formula cars you sometimes find yourself staring at a screen full of footwell if you go through a compression at high speed

Current setting:
1g head tilt 1.00degree
1g lat shift 0.000
1g forward 0.018
1g vert 0.007

I have to turn Steer-Look off, but the other head movements have to be on for the immersion factor.

Not realistic Tristan? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIPBU5TRrSo looks exactly like driving the BF1/FO8/FOX with the head movements on to me.

Quote from danowat :

I would rather be a little (a lot arguably) slower and have some sense of immersion in the sim.

But thats just me I guess............

Not at all...immersion wins every time for me

now that we have this discussion to get back to the original question ... have you tried wheels view yet ? it gives a much better sense of speed (on a crt)

Quote from The Moose :

Not realistic Tristan? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIPBU5TRrSo looks exactly like driving the BF1/FO8/FOX with the head movements on to me.

this video hat only very little to do with what alonso saw with his own eyes along the way

Quote from Shotglass :

now that we have this discussion to get back to the original question ... have you tried wheels view yet ? it gives a much better sense of speed (on a crt)

Don't start that debate up again, please!

To each their own.

Quote from sinbad :

Don't start that debate up again, please!

To each their own.

it was just intended as a suggestion to get a better sense of how fast hes going as im sure he just didnt realize it in the first place

Quote from Shotglass :

this video hat only very little to do with what alonso saw with his own eyes along the way

What do you want..Eye cam? Are you telling me that his helmet shakes but his head doesn't? come off it, that's as close to what the driver sees as you're going to get.
When I've gone Karting my head moves...when you go over a bump your head moves..it shakes a little bit. Having a small amount of head movement on in the game is far more realistic than not having it on. (not the Steer-Look thing though..that seems wrong)

Quote from The Moose :

What do you want..Eye cam? Are you telling me that his helmet shakes but his head doesn't? come off it, that's as close to what the driver sees as you're going to get.

no because your eyes and brain will keep the image you percieve way more steady than what you get with a helmet cam
you know your head is shaking but you dont see it which is something entirely drifferen than a shaking image on screen

Quote from Ball Bearing Turbo :

Please explain why a car would not act gently over the limit. It's not a train, and there are no tracks to fall off of. What is it in your mind that generates a large transient blast that sends you off into the distance with little or no warning? I don't comprehend this point of view, except by those who've been wrongly "trained" by ISI bs (not saying this is you BTW, just that the myth of rapidly declining lateral slip curves irritates me - as it goes against even simple common sense)

If you're cornering, the car obviously wants to continue in a straight line. Of course, you're asking it not to through steering input, and all the tires are responsible for coaxing the car to change direction. If you slowly approach the limits of the tire's adhesion, which happens to already be under a relatively "high slip condition", what on Earth makes anyone think they will "suddenly break loose"? They will simply begin to slip a little more, and provide slightly less adhesion because they are a little past their peak slip angle.

Sorry,we had this discussion before but IMO deggis pointed very well LFS biggest problem.

I had a few little nice cars(R5GTT,Mk1,Benz 190 Evo2) and in no way one of this cars got such a linear reaction above limit.I crashed one time the benz just because i got a sudden violent break loose even if most of the time it was really easy to drift with but in no way such gently(really never).

But most of the times it was done on the normal road and i just had the possibility to try a few times a real race track (Nords but only with benz) with better tyres but even in this case,they doesn t react linear and gently.

I can t imagine it s just the lack of G-force because they are sims who reproduce a bit better this feeling,not perfectly but better.

I only talk about the roadcars and can t comment about the openwheelers but i m sure Tristan could tell how they fell in LFS compared to reallife behaviour.

The main problem is this bit ice feeling at normal speeds and the really linear and not violent reaction of the car above the limit.With improvement in this area,LFS could be near to the perfection.

Maybe it s intentionnal from Scawen because of the big under 18 drifter community who i m sure couldn t drift so easily if it was like IRL but i don t think so since i m sure Scawen try to give us the best simulator.

Quote from Shotglass :

no because your eyes and brain will keep the image you percieve way more steady than what you get with a helmet cam
you know your head is shaking but you dont see it which is something entirely drifferen than a shaking image on screen

lol easy way to prove this is to just jump up and down in your chair and move around. not quite as destracting as the g movement in lfs, though i am using default settings myself... i'm about to turn them back off to see if my laptimes improve.

Quote from GHOSTRACER1 :

Sorry,we had this discussion before but IMO deggis pointed very well LFS biggest problem.

I had a few little nice cars(R5GTT,Mk1,Benz 190 Evo2) and in no way one of this cars got such a linear reaction above limit.

Limit? What limit?

Quote from wheel4hummer :

Limit? What limit?

Exactly... what limit.. You got to YOUR psychological limit but surely not the limit of those cars and certainly not the limit we are doing to LFS cars, and more often way beyond limit... People wonder why RAC or LX6, etc get so ass crazy, well it's because of redicolous speeds we are doing with those cars, they can't be driven like that and combine that with total lack of butt feel and no g forces... that's the result..

But i do agree that we lack some of those sudden uncontrollable spins you see in real life, for example the "7 seconds on the ring" video, or that Saab, Porsche whatever with that noob driving it on some American track that went on the roof... If someone can replicate those incidents in LFS i would love to see it...