Quote from ATC Quicksilver :

They denied us the chance to see Schumacher show Hamilton that his aggressive driving is nothing in comparison to what a grown man with a similar attitude would do.

Jep, instead Hamilton had to race against this spanish guy...
This, erm, Alfonso Bonso or something? This one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDYBeYCcUFE

Alonso was such a nobody compared to Schumi and his
grown man attitude.

A Proper driver after having what happened to Massa would have gone out and got the fastest lap, what a joke. If he was in a lower grid car like a Red Bull or the likes we would see the real Massa. He can perform in the good stuff but 99% of current and ex F1 drivers -and actually non F1 drivers- could too.

Glad to see Alonso there actually, he really has won me over this season, he is a properly quick driver.

Quote from AdonisAmaronis :

Jep, instead Hamilton had to race against this spanish guy...
This, erm, Alfonso Bonso or something? This one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDYBeYCcUFE

Alonso was such a nobody compared to Schumi and his
grown man attitude.

Yeh but that was a fair and brave pass, I was referring to the dirty and aggressive blocking moves.

Quote from SAxor :

A Proper driver after having what happened to Massa would have gone out and got the fastest lap, what a joke. If he was in a lower grid car like a Red Bull or the likes we would see the real Massa. He can perform in the good stuff but 99% of current and ex F1 drivers -and actually non F1 drivers- could too.

Glad to see Alonso there actually, he really has won me over this season, he is a properly quick driver.

To be fair to Massa, he started off in Sauber. Hardly a top team.

As for Alonso, the 2009 driver market pivots around that guy. It just goes to show how highly the teams regard him.

Quote from samjh :

As for Alonso, the 2009 driver market pivots around that guy. It just goes to show how highly the teams regard him.

Except for the teams that have already said they don't want him, MacLaren, Ferrari, BMW, Williams, RBR, Toyota, STR and Force India

Having said that, i was reading the other day that there's been a few rumours flowing round the paddock saying that although Kimi has signed a contract with Ferrari for 2010, many expect that he may well not see it through. Apparently there is a clause in it that gives Ferrari the right to pay him off after 2009, and that had led many to think that Alonso will be at Ferrari in 2010. These rumours go on to say that Kimi was only given an extension to his contract in order to get him to agree to help Massa win the WDC this year. Obviously rumours are rumours, but far stranger things have happened in F1 before.

When did BMW say they didn't want him? And even if they did make such an explicit denial, I'm sure they'll think hard on it if Alonso offers to drive for them. BMW's Thiessen said he won't make a decision about driver lineup until later. Honda's Brawn wants Alonso (obviously), and I'm sure Flavio would love to keep him. So that's three teams who could be influenced by Alonso's decision, and all are holding off their 2009 driver commitments.

Others:
* McLaren and Ferrari already have good lineups;
* Williams doesn't have a choice (Rosberg's contract is still alive, and Nakajima is needed for the engine);
* STR can't pay Alonso's salary, neither can Force India;
* and RBR already has a good lineup in Webber and Vettel.

And then there is the market beyond 2009...

Nah, F1 has a history of playing political games with this sort of stuff.

Nothing i've read has even remotely linked Alonso with BMW. (so that probably means he's already signed a contract :tilt But no. The problem with Alonso is he simply will not join a team that won't give him number one status. Kubica has already committed to BMW and i can't see him ever agreeing to playing second fiddle to Alonso. Come to think of it, if Massa does win the WDC this year, i can't see him agreeing to it either. And Kimi...not in a million years.

Yeah STR and Force India would love him, but as you've said can't afford his wages, so they're a non starter. Honda ? would they really agree to a year by year contract ? I don't think they're that desperate tbh, could be wrong, but i'd be surprised if he was driving for them next year. So that really only leaves him with one option of staying with Renault next year. And, although i'm not an Alonso fan, i think that's probably the best thing he can do.

Renault have really improved in the later half of the year. And they've got some really smart guys in the team, so, with all the new regs for 2009, there's every chance they could build a very very quick car. Personally i think they'll be better off than Honda, despite Ross Brawns input.

[edit] Aaaacctually, i'll have to take some of that back after reading this http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?id=44126 would seem BMW might be interested in him after all even though he has said he'd like to stay at Renault because he "feels at home with them". But has also said he wants to be in the most competitive car on the grid. Interesting, very interesting...

Sooo.. the team radios Nelson to tell him that Alonso has pitted, and Nelson gently stuffs his car. Did Nelson just secure his 2009 seat with Renault?

Quote from SamH :

Sooo.. the team radios Nelson to tell him that Alonso has pitted, and Nelson gently stuffs his car. Did Nelson just secure his 2009 seat with Renault?

More likely for the rest of the season

I'm surprised that nobody's posed the question about Pat Symonds' ingenious pit strategy for Alonso. I, for one, wouldn't put anything past Symonds.. including, I'm sad to say, instructing Nelson to bin it at the appropriate time. He HAD just received a message from the pits to say that Alonso had pitted when he planted his car lightly against the wall.

I can't help feeling that nobody in the media is asking the question, not because there's no question to ask, but because it's a big question and an even bigger can of worms.

Quote from SamH :

I'm surprised that nobody's posed the question about Pat Symonds' ingenious pit strategy for Alonso. I, for one, wouldn't put anything past Symonds.. including, I'm sad to say, instructing Nelson to bin it at the appropriate time. He HAD just received a message from the pits to say that Alonso had pitted when he planted his car lightly against the wall.

I can't help feeling that nobody in the media is asking the question, not because there's no question to ask, but because it's a big question and an even bigger can of worms.

I'm sorry but that's just, hmm how to put it nicely, awkward. Surely Lonso benefitted a lot but at the time they were not looking to get the 1st spot for that and I doubt if four or fifth (which was more likely) was something they'd go for with that kind of stuff.

I don't like the thought of it either, but it is bugging me that nobody's asked the question at all, for it to be played out and dismissed. I have this desire to hear people who are authoritative on the matter, completely dismiss it and give good reasons why Renault wouldn't/couldn't have done it.

I'll admit that my suspicion of Renault goes way back to their Benetton days, when they were caught "cheating" a few times in a season.. and right up to last year, when they were found to be casually in posession of a load of McLaren bumf. That's probably very specifically why I feel the need to hear them "cleared". Not because I want to see them caught, but because I'm fed up with this feeling that something is dirty underneath there. It all stems from a general sense that it's not the clean and honourable sport I want it to be. I dunno.. difficult to explain.

Quote from SamH :

I don't like the thought of it either, but it is bugging me that nobody's asked the question at all, for it to be played out and dismissed.

i for one jokingly suggested that they shoudl keep piquet and crash him into walls every race but no one without a tinfoil hat would ever take this idea seriously

Personally, I think it's just a really huge coincidence. Especially when watching the video of his crash it seems like a relatively easy mistake to make, run a bit hot through the corner, lose the back end like a n00b without TC, and then plonks it in the inside wall too.

Quote from SamH :

I don't like the thought of it either, but it is bugging me that nobody's asked the question at all, for it to be played out and dismissed. I have this desire to hear people who are authoritative on the matter, completely dismiss it and give good reasons why Renault wouldn't/couldn't have done it.

Spanish press asked Alonso about it and obviously he said that no one would do that.
An accident it's an accident and it's always dangerous... maybe pressing a button on the wheel or stalling the engine in the middle of the track would be a more secure way

Quote from SamH :

I don't like the thought of it either, but it is bugging me that nobody's asked the question at all, for it to be played out and dismissed. I have this desire to hear people who are authoritative on the matter, completely dismiss it and give good reasons why Renault wouldn't/couldn't have done it.

I'll admit that my suspicion of Renault goes way back to their Benetton days, when they were caught "cheating" a few times in a season.. and right up to last year, when they were found to be casually in posession of a load of McLaren bumf. That's probably very specifically why I feel the need to hear them "cleared". Not because I want to see them caught, but because I'm fed up with this feeling that something is dirty underneath there. It all stems from a general sense that it's not the clean and honourable sport I want it to be. I dunno.. difficult to explain.

Pat Symonds has a very clean reputation in the paddock. He's a straight-shooter even if his boss (Flavio) isn't.

Plus, Symonds was only a small-fry in most of Benetton's days. He wasn't even in the team in the early 90s (he was at Reynard). He didn't become technical director until 1997 when Ross Brawn moved to Ferrari, and only got his current job in 2001 when Gascoyne left.

As far as a possible conspiracy regarding Piquet's crash is concerned, it's pretty daft. The risk is simply too great. The circumstances worked out this time, but it could have easily gone the other way. What if Alonso crashed out of the race too? And if both drivers managed to stay on track, they might have both scored points.

And for the Renault-McLaren spy thing, Renault didn't actually make any use of the information that the ex-McLaren engineer brought with him.

Quote from WMSC :

5.4. Independent IT experts (Kroll OnTrack) were appointed by McLaren and, with Renault’s agreement, were given wide-ranging access to Renault’s IT systems and have conducted in depth analysis of IT equipment used by Mackereth in particular.

5.5. With Mackereth’s agreement, McLaren’s IT experts have also searched Mackereth’s home computer for confidential McLaren information.

Quote from WMSC :

8.4. It is common ground between Renault and McLaren that Mackereth took a more significant volume of information from McLaren. This included confidential information as well as materials that were copyrighted to other parties (e.g. materials received while on external training courses), and Mackereth’s personal financial information. However, having heard the evidence it emerges that Renault never had possession or knowledge of the large majority of this volume.

8.5. About 15% of what was taken by Mackereth contained McLaren confidential information and was in Renault’s control or technical possession. Mackereth uploaded 33 electronic files (including 18 drawings and personal information) to an area on the Renault computer system which was accessible only to him. In addition, he e-mailed one file (a ’screen grab’ of a drawing) to his Renault e-mail account and brought in two hard copy drawings. However, there is no evidence of any McLaren documents or files being viewed or considered by anyone at Renault other than the four drawings referred to above.

Quote from WMSC :

8.7. The WMSC has concluded that of the four drawings actually viewed by Renault’s engineers, three were either of no use to Renault or were not in fact used by Renault. The fourth drawing (a drawing of McLaren’s so-called ‘J-damper’) was used by Renault in that Renault admits taking it into account in preparing a request to the FIA for a clarification of whether a particular hypothetical system was within the rules (rather than for the purposes of copying it). The fact that Renault fundamentally misunderstood the operation of the system suggests that the ‘J-damper’ drawing did not reveal to Renault enough about the system for the Championship to have been affected.

Quote from WMSC :

8.8. The McLaren confidential information brought to Renault was in the context of an F1 engineer changing teams. It was not ‘live’ information in the sense that there is no evidence of a flow of current information between competing teams. After leaving McLaren, Mackereth had no further access to current or updated McLaren information. Nor is there any evidence that Renault encouraged Mackereth in any way to bring the confidential information from McLaren.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/200 ... ault-mclaren-spying-case/

Lets face facts: It is hardly inconsistent for Nelson Piquet Jnr to be crashing into a wall.

Although it would not suprise me if Renault did rig the safety car, i'm so cynical over F1 these days that I wouldnt say anything is impossible. It's a show, a circus entertainment act, more than it is a sport.

The fact is Alonso was driving a blinder and deserved a win, and Piquet carear will amount to nothing more than what we saw at Singapore unless that race was indeed rigged, in which case should Renault's fortunes improve he might pick up the odd win as a supporting driver, but he'll have to learn how to finish a race first which involves not crashing and to be brutally honest I dont think he's capable of doing that - certainly not for two races in a row!

So even if it was rigged I wouldnt care. As i'm used to seeing rigged races anyway. You could argue it's nice to see some upstart getting away with it for a change :P

Quote from SAxor :

Glad to see Alonso there actually, he really has won me over this season, he is a properly quick driver.

Wheyhey, same here!

Just was looking of autosport.com and Ferrari say they are going for a 1-2 finish for each of the last 3 races but I think Hamilton will be aiming to win the next two races so he will get the WDC with one race remaining.

Quote from S3ANPukekoh3 :

Hmm... I think all ten constructors would like a 1-2 finish in the last 3 gps. If not, you really have ask why they even bother to race... Maybe thats why Super Aguri bailed out

No, they all should race for the best finishing position but Ferrari haven't really been on the ball this season have they, Mclaren hasn't had as much reliabilty issues or messing up in the pits, the crash doesn't count, I mean when they are in the pit box changing tires etc, Ferrari have messed up whereas Mclaren haven't. I think Hamilton will go for it these two races coming up and win the WDC with one race remaining, hopefully he doesn't get it all wrong like he did last year.

Quote :

I think Hamilton will go for it these two races coming up and win the WDC with one race remaining, hopefully he doesn't get it all wrong like he did last year.

It was trying too hard to wrap the title up early that blew it for him last year.

We already saw at Singapore that he's trying to think of the championship, else he'd have put his car infront of Rosberg at some point (whether he then left the circuit would be something only answered by him trying it, which he didnt).

Hamilton will take the win if it comes to him, but I think he has his eye on that big trophy (or a replica of it seeing as he drives for McLaren and they whore all the trophies) and will be more conservative and muted than we are used to seeing him.

Massa will buckle in at least one more race this season.

Quote from sam93 :

Just was looking of autosport.com and Ferrari say they are going for a 1-2 finish for each of the last 3 races

What a surprise.

Quote from Becky Rose :

It was trying too hard to wrap the title up early that blew it for him last year.

We already saw at Singapore that he's trying to think of the championship, else he'd have put his car infront of Rosberg at some point (whether he then left the circuit would be something only answered by him trying it, which he didnt).

Hamilton will take the win if it comes to him, but I think he has his eye on that big trophy (or a replica of it seeing as he drives for McLaren and they whore all the trophies) and will be more conservative and muted than we are used to seeing him.

Massa will buckle in at least one more race this season.

Hamilton in the end must of just wanted to finish with points in the end as he didn't start to push to get in front of Rosberg, Hamilton has deserved the championship this year as he drove amazing at Silverstone and no one can say he didn't, Ferrari have messed up a lot this season and I dont think Massa or Kimi dont deserve the title, I am keeping my hopes that Hamilton will bag the Championship, I wonder what peoples views will be when he wins it, I bet they still say he is rubbish etc... I think he will become a multiple world champion though.

Quote :

I wonder what peoples views will be when he wins it

They'll say Stirling Moss deserved it more. He's arrogant, prone to erratic behaviour on and off track, has a bad attitude, and is subject to moments of abject stupidity - whilst accepting he's bloody fast, entertaining to watch, will have a go when others wont, and makes the sport more enjoyable to watch whether you support him or want him to loose.

Just like they do right now, the thing is, all of that stuff is true so nobody is going to stop saying it any time soon.

If Massa took up international tiddlywinks I wouldnt miss him, I wouldnt miss Kimi either, but if Lewis left F1 there'd by a dirty great hole (where all the overtaking used to be) left by his absense.

Even the most ardent of Hamilton haters have to admit he does add to the spectacle.

Quote from Becky Rose :

They'll say Stirling Moss deserved it more. He's arrogant, prone to erratic behaviour on and off track, has a bad attitude, and is subject to moments of abject stupidity - whilst accepting he's bloody fast, entertaining to watch, will have a go when others wont, and makes the sport more enjoyable to watch whether you support him or want him to loose.

Just like they do right now, the thing is, all of that stuff is true so nobody is going to stop saying it any time soon.

If Massa took up international tiddlywinks I wouldnt miss him, I wouldnt miss Kimi either, but if Lewis left F1 there'd by a dirty great hole (where all the overtaking used to be) left by his absense.

Even the most ardent of Hamilton haters have to admit he does add to the spectacle.

Hamilton doesn't have a good attitude and is arrogant I will admit, but is Brits are arrogant imo. Hamilton is very fast and it adds atmosphere with his overtaking and such like. No one can deny that he isn't fast, when he first joined F1 he was fast I know some say its because he is driving a top teams car but you still need the talent to drive it quick. Piquet has been put into a Renault which isnt exactly slow as Alonso has proved by winning the WDC twice in a Renault and Piquet isn't quick whilst driving a Renault that with the right driver is a quick car, but saying that Piquet is crap So Hamilton has always been fast, I do think if he wins this years WDC it will give him a boost in confidence, even though he has a lot already, it seems that he still hasnt sorted out his confidence as he gets to the end of the season, he seems to get a little too nervous. Hamilton is always going to be at the front of the grid though and I think will be a multiple world champion, anyone agree?