no supermassive... you just suck. the lfs community doesnt need immature people like you that cant take constructive criticism.

enjoy making others feel crap do we.... contructive critisism...yeah so you sayin my throttle control sucks is constructive is it...im not the immature one here

Quote from Iron :

Mainly driving the XFG (my pb with that is 1:33:92 btw), just ocassionally trying out the XRT, but got annoyed with it fast every time. First i used mouse for throttle/break too, and i thought it was because of the digital inputs that i couldn't keep the rwd cars from spinning. So i changed to joystick, but it didn't suddenly make me any better. So what i'm doing now, is driving the XRG, it's much easier since it doesn't have as much power as the XRT, but you still have to be cautious with the throttle during corners. I'll practice with it a little, then i'll see if i learned anything from it to help me drive the XRT properly.

That's funny. It's exactly my opinion in my early demo days.
I eventually got the hang of it. Now I compete in the STCC in the XRT and it's quite unspinnable to me. I can floor the accelerator out of tight corners and it feels most natural to me to modify the steering angle to the current level of grip the car has. (Actually this is the wrong technique, but hey, I'm the driver! )
So what I'm saying is that the beginning is really difficult. It's takes quite a while until you can feel the movements of a virtual car that gives you no feedback. But once that bit in the brain got the idea of getting the necessary information about the car from the ears and eyes it's a piece of cake.

Oh, and SuperMassive: Don't let the words of the unhappy get too close to you.

Vain

gabkicks....take notes from vain thats contructive critisism

haha tru i was just pissed at you saying drifting was gay, and then you suck at throttle control.

Quote from SuperMassive :

enjoy making others feel crap do we.... contructive critisism...yeah so you sayin my throttle control sucks is constructive is it...im not the immature one here

lol i dont suck at throttle control i actually drive round silverstone circuit (where i live not 5 minutes away ) and yeah driftin is gay IMO im not sayin no one should like it i just find it pointless

i still dont see why you should attack me.... im new im not gonna be that great yet on the throttle side no need to say i suck tho

Okay, let's get some ground rules down here. If you didn't want people to tell you what they think of the way you drive, don't post asking for help on it.

In point of fact, based on the replay you posted of your driving, it would be difficult to conclude that your throttle control was anything but crap. If that's not how you normally drive, then don't post a replay of you driving without any throttle control in the chicane. Post one with you actually using throttle control at all in the chicane. I don't get it.

Secondly, I'm glad you deleted at least ONE of your posts. You know which. Don't post like that again.

chicane...my replay didnt have a chicane in it......

origanal message edited that was wrong replay lol

Quote from Gabkicks :

no supermassive... you just suck. the lfs community doesnt need immature people like you that cant take constructive criticism.

Tristan's answer was something like "you have problems with driving in LFS because your driving sucks". That's hardly constructive criticism, I'd say...

In my experience (mouse driver, demo user) LFS has a pretty long learning curve. I started with the XFG, and it didn't take me long to drive it fairly fast. But the XRT was a big disapointment - I went fishtailing every 5 seconds. So I took the XRG, because it didn't spin as easily, and gradually learned to handle it. After that, the XRT was still a handful, but no longer the untameable beast I thought it was.

Like Glenn67 said, the thing with sims is that you don't get as many clues about the car's response. It takes time to learn to "read" them. And sometimes you just have to predict the response, because reacting will always be too slow.

Okay, I'll try and unmudify this thread...

Quote from wsinda :

Tristan's answer was something like "you have problems with driving in LFS because your driving sucks". That's hardly constructive criticism, I'd say...

Actually, the part that SuperMassive specifically took issue with (and quoted originally) was..

Quote from tristancliffe :

The simple fact is that those that complain most about it are the slow people who don't know how to drive. Those people that can drive, either in real life or in simulations, realise that driving correctly yields very correct car behaviour.
....
In short - it's your driving that is the problem. Sorry.

SuperMassive subsequently said some not very nice things, which he then deleted, but not before Gabkicks had felt drawn to respond directly to, with..

Quote from Gabkicks :

no supermassive... you just suck. the lfs community doesnt need immature people like you that cant take constructive criticism.

And, based on the content which was rightly removed by SuperMassive, I can't honestly condemn Gabkicks for his response. As a moderator, I try to smile from the wrist down. Sometimes that's difficult!

Now, given that we've all been looking at the wrong replay, apparently, I think SuperMassive is probably feeling a little embarassed (especially if he takes a moment to look over the replay we've all been basing our comments on), I reckon if SuperMassive would like to post a revised replay then we can all move on, recognising that the content up until now has all been...

Quote from Gabkicks :

no supermassive... you just suck. the lfs community doesnt need immature people like you that cant take constructive criticism.

There's nothing like "you just suck" that says constructive criticism. And don't even dare to think you speak for the whole community!

Blimey this thread got out of hand a bit.

F1 cars never spin at the start as they are driven by some of the worlds best drivers, not by someone who thinks that owning a Caterham somehow means they must be a good driver. If you tried 'throttle control' then you might get somewhere.

All of this is, of course, based on your original replay, in which you do not exhibit one iota of driving talent. If you were to post a new replay that shows some respect for car dynamics and traction circles then we won't post so condescendingly at you. That is all.

Quote from PLAYLIFE :

There's nothing like "you just suck" that says constructive criticism. And don't even dare to think you speak for the whole community!

Can I just clarify that Gabkicks was not, at that point, referring to SuperMassive's driving. It was to a written post, which is thankfully no longer with us.

Quote from SamH :

Okay, let's get some ground rules down here. If you didn't want people to tell you what they think of the way you drive, don't post asking for help on it.

EDIT: OK, I've decided to withdraw my post.


Hey, it could turn into a team iDi type hobby, where someone makes a post, where he insults everybody and everything. Then, deletes it and starts complaining to the admin that other members are harassing him :P


P.S. Since when do we have spell check?

There was no reason at all to attack on anyone. Damn Gabkicks :/
I'd still like to see the (right) replay and try to help you.

well as someone rightly put i am embarrased over the replay..it was first attempt at the car

and to all those i may have offended or whatnot im deeply apologetic, im here to make good racing friends and enjoy myself...

as for the owning a caterham comment..... i drive the silverstone track and in about 3 weeks time will be able to compete in the cups they have there so altho yes F1 drivers are the best in the world (other than Ide :razz if you watch it JPM in austrailia, thats what happens when traction controls off, he span it on installation lap for those who dont know, so the TC does have a big part to play.....

and yes there will be a revised replay coming up i just gotta have some tea n stuff and then i'll find and post it

so in a nutshell - sorry to all. TC is important, im new so im not gonna be great a throttle control and ide cant drive an F1 car, and there will be a replay in about 20 mins

In fairness I'd rate JPM no higher (okay, a little higher) than Ide anyway, so it's not a fair example really. I bet the Alonso's, Kimi's, Button's, Kovileimenananeenen's (spelling?) and Schumacher's (snr) would cope without TC a little better.

But anyway, owning and driving a Caterham can only be a good thing for driving talent (i.e. you can't fail to learn a lot), but nevertheless it doesn't give you an ability to state that the F1 TC is wrong. I drive an F3 car in real life (we're just building a new engine for it to give about 200hp instead of 160, starting today), and whilst I have learnt a LOT about driving from it, it still doesn't put me in a position to comment in any way on the ability or not for a TC system (or a basic computer simulation of a real TC system) to save oversteer.

Looking forward to the new replay, and then I'm sure we'll all get along like a house on fire, and help you utilise the car's potential more.

TC in this context = throttle control?

oh sorry TC = traction control

and tristan JPM was in contention for the drivers championship in 2004 i think 2004 anyway it was a three way scrap him raikkonen and somone else so come on even you gotta admit way way better than ide...

altho he wasnt the best driver i'll admit that

i had the same problem with you, when i first drove the XRT.

You need to learn to anticipate oversteer and correct it.

Use very small wheel movements and little throttle.

small movements

little throttle.

enter turns coasting (or keeping the speed constant using very little throttle) and exit turns with very very slight acceleration.

Quote from SuperMassive :

lol i dont suck at throttle control i actually drive round silverstone circuit (where i live not 5 minutes away ) and yeah driftin is gay IMO im not sayin no one should like it i just find it pointless

i still dont see why you should attack me.... im new im not gonna be that great yet on the throttle side no need to say i suck tho

you say drifting is pointless, but please explain to me how it is any more pointless than any other form of motorsport? some people look at circuit/oval/drag and rally and say the same thing.
i usually dont type anything if i dont have anything nice to say. its just i was super annoyed and i usually dont go on the internet when i am like that

There is one other aspect of a real F1 car that is missing from LFS. It is the reason you never see an F1 driver light up the back wheels at the start line.....

drum roll .......

Launch control.

All F1 teams use LC to get the perfect start and I am willing to bet that the TC system is disabled while LC is running as there would be a conflict between them. As LFS does not have launch control it would explain why you spin out the tires.

As for TC, no TC system will stop you from making mistakes unless you make it act like a real nag but the more limiting you make it the slower it makes you. This is the same as ABS, the more you make it able to handle lockups the less effective you will be at slowing the car.

To go fast you need to be able to hold the car on the edge of traction. If you use TC, ABS etc systems to make that edge "softer" you still need to know where that edge is and how far into it you can push.

i thought launch control wasnt allowed in 2006?

Quote from george_tsiros :

You need to learn to anticipate oversteer and correct it.

This is a good statement, but for our purposes in racing in LFS, it needs to be modified.

You need to learn to anticipate oversteer and use it. You learn to control and use it to rotate your car. Oversteer is your friend. Oversteer is fast. learn to control it and you are fast. Unfortunately, I have not learned as much as I should on controlling and using oversteer, thus I am not as fast as the fastest guys.

I was really confused at some of the comments. Thanks for clearing that confusion up, SamH .

here are the replays...yes replays, one is the origanal that exposed the problem... and the other is why i think its my gearin making it bad cos i can take the corner fine without losing it in auto gears

and driftin has just never appealed to me its no less of a motorsport I just find it pointless

btw replay 5 is manual gears and 6 is auto

critics welcome just dont say i suck