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Grand Prix of Monaco 2013
(124 posts, started )
Those shits like Maldonado, Grosjean should be kicked out of the show. Enough is enough. Many talented racers are already waiting in a line to get to F-1. Give them a chance. Those two pillocks had too many occasions on destroyin' others' and their own races.
Quote from Dennis93 :I even believe you was whining about that when people did that to you, but then again, You've always been a bit of double-morale person

Y u do this kimi fan

It was being forced off track on exits I had/have a problem with, never came across anything like this incident while racing.
& since when?
Quote from Seb66 :Y u do this kimi fan

It was being forced off track on exits I had/have a problem with, never came across anything like this incident while racing.
& since when?

I'm quite neutral in F1, But I'd rather see my cousin in that seat than Seriguseless Perichass..
If you look at the front angle replay (head on coming into the chicane) you can see how overly defensive of a line Kimi was taking after Perez had already committed. Very similar to the famous Prost/Senna @ Suzuka, if not nearly as important.
Quote from Mustafur :
I would say Kimi is still probably equal best driver on the grid with Alonso.

Grosjean is making Kimi look better then he really is.. Kimi is more like at Massa level and lucky to be in what is probably the best car of the field.

Also his passes on the last laps was mainly cause he had fresh tyres and a better car than the people in front of him. But ofcourse he deserves the credit he got for those moves.
Quote from DeadWolfBones :If you look at the front angle replay (head on coming into the chicane) you can see how overly defensive of a line Kimi was taking after Perez had already committed. Very similar to the famous Prost/Senna @ Suzuka, if not nearly as important.

It's pretty obvious from any angle that Kimi squeezed him into the wall in a "crowding of a car beyond the track limits/abnormal change of direction kind of way" or however it's worded. It's not a defensive move, and it's certainly not a normal turn-in to the corner either.

Perez needs to stop risking everything and banking on the fact that other drivers don't want to be taken out of the race, but in this case, even if he was going too fast to make the chicane and might have hit Kimi anyway, this actual accident was caused by Raikonnen.
Well, it's F1.

F1 is a driving sport, entertainment.

Perez should be promoted,

he may be crazy, but sometimes events like those can even do better show for this noble species.

Like in the past... Senna, Prost, Schumacher and others times... We are all missing them. We will miss Perez season sometimes on future.

Let boys race as fast as they can. :eclipsee_
Quote from sinbad :Perez needs to stop risking everything and banking on the fact that other drivers don't want to be taken out of the race, but in this case, even if he was going too fast to make the chicane and might have hit Kimi anyway, this actual accident was caused by Raikonnen.

This
Quote from ChristijaNL :Grosjean is making Kimi look better then he really is.. Kimi is more like at Massa level and lucky to be in what is probably the best car of the field.

Also his passes on the last laps was mainly cause he had fresh tyres and a better car than the people in front of him. But ofcourse he derserves the credit he got for those moves.

Its all opinion without proof.
Hm...I think it's a good move from Kimi, try this again in any race and you will get the same wall to the face is the message.
Quote from ChristijaNL :Grosjean is making Kimi look better then he really is.. Kimi is more like at Massa level and lucky to be in what is probably the best car of the field.

*Watches 07 review again.

Nope.
Quote from sinbad :It's pretty obvious from any angle that Kimi squeezed him into the wall in a "crowding of a car beyond the track limits/abnormal change of direction kind of way" or however it's worded. It's not a defensive move, and it's certainly not a normal turn-in to the corner either.

Perez needs to stop risking everything and banking on the fact that other drivers don't want to be taken out of the race, but in this case, even if he was going too fast to make the chicane and might have hit Kimi anyway, this actual accident was caused by Raikonnen.

Yup.
Well if it is Kimi's fault then you need to take this incident as an example what overlap means. Perez had just his front tire next to kimi's rear tire. In my books that already is a definition of dive bomb.

I know I'm biased in this by being a finn but at the same time I just don't know how the perez move can be seen to be anything else than a dive bomb? At the apex he did not have overlap and that should really be the end of the discussion.

All I see is that kimi takes a bit vague line into the corner but doesn't really make two moves. Perez is way back so kimi turns in when he would normally do. Just one move on the straight like the rules allow. Perez is going too fast back away from his divebomb and as a result pokes his nose into the gap that is no longer there and hopes he can use kimi's car as a brake when they get to the apex. The rear tire of kimi's car collides with perez's'z front tire and sends perez into the wall and rotates kimi towards teh wall as well.

The way I see it was a divebomb kimi failed to avoid. It is of course a good idea to get out of the way when someone divebombs you but if you don't get out of the way that should not make the whole incident your fault.
I think what people are saying is Perez is mostly responsible, however Kimi shouldn't put himself into danger by allowing that gap in the first place.

A divebomb in itself isn't always wrong imo. If you succeed diving your way into a position of sufficient overlap at turn in, then all the credit to you. In the same time it's fair you take the blame when you commit to a move where the other party has to actively avoid you.
The telling evidence is the onboard camera of Perez. He has absolutely NO approach angle into the chicane from where he tried. Even if he had a gap, he'd haffto go straight on through the chicane as he would hit the side of his car on the barrier (or slow to about 3 kph);
Quote from DeadWolfBones :If you look at the front angle replay (head on coming into the chicane) you can see how overly defensive of a line Kimi was taking after Perez had already committed. Very similar to the famous Prost/Senna @ Suzuka, if not nearly as important.

Quote from sinbad :It's pretty obvious from any angle that Kimi squeezed him into the wall in a "crowding of a car beyond the track limits/abnormal change of direction kind of way" or however it's worded. It's not a defensive move, and it's certainly not a normal turn-in to the corner either.

Perez needs to stop risking everything and banking on the fact that other drivers don't want to be taken out of the race, but in this case, even if he was going too fast to make the chicane and might have hit Kimi anyway, this actual accident was caused by Raikonnen.

Wow..

Let's not forget who put who in what situation.

Both cars come out of the tunnel, Perez is 6-10 meters back, commits to a move, Kimi moves out of racing lines surprised anyone would try from that far back, Perez Steering back towards Kimi and finally makes his final move to get along side Kimi. The speed difference is great and therefore as Kimi is progressively making his way towards HIS apex ( Let's not forget that Kimi has every right to take the corner HOWEVER he wants, This is by the rules, not by my opinion ) Perez gets squeezed. Now I will ask you again, who put who in that situation? Perez put himself in a position to get squeezed, just like you wouldn't walk in on an ongoing robbery of some sort.

Kimi may have caused the accident, but it will always remain as a FACT that it's Perez fault, Simply because he was too far behind.
Quote from dawesdust_12 :The telling evidence is the onboard camera of Perez. He has absolutely NO approach angle into the chicane from where he tried. Even if he had a gap, he'd haffto go straight on through the chicane as he would hit the side of his car on the barrier (or slow to about 3 kph);

Yeah I think another key point is Perez wouldn't make the corner himself even if they didn't touch. But then you can also say it's point we can't prove.
The divebomb at that corner can be a great tactic as you don't really need to overtake in order to overtake. Just get alongside and the other guy has to bug out across the kerb and then he lets you past. His only alternative is to close the door which makes for a big risk.

I wonder if there is a way to reprofile the corner to allow a bit more room. Or go back to the pif-paf of the good old days - impossible to overtake so no more issues!
I think they should split the corner and let them choose either to go left or go right.
Or just get decent stewards who can tell the difference between cutting the chicane to avoid an inevitable crash (Alonso) and cutting the chicane because it's just easier than trying to turn in whilst being overtaken safely.
Quote from JJ72 :*Watches 07 review again.

Nope.

They were also teammates in 2008 and as u can see not much between them.

Grand Prix of Monaco 2013
(124 posts, started )
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