I wander if this might be like 2005 where McLaren ran heavier in qualifying compared to the Renault at pretty much every GP.

The first leg of qualifying was mighty close with four drivers sharing the same half a tenth of a second. It's only 4 tenths from 1st to 2nd and in this qualifying we have no idea whether that's raw pace or a little less fuel. McLaren are 4km/h slower on the straights to Ferrari.

Coulthard was disappointing Webber did a great job to take 7th.

Quote from Sketchyrollin564 :

Your point?

You still need to be able to see clearly.

Exactly, so having the full whack of Sun in your eyes isn't going to help either is it? I think your forgeting that in a race car you're sitting very low. I'd be surprised if drivers even notice it while they are racing.

Quote from Becky Rose :

The McLaren does not appear to be fast in a straight line at all, I wonder if Hamilton and Alonso will be able to make any overtakes if they aren't on pole.

The worst part as well is they can't do anything to the engine till 2010 (if I remember correctly) So they will have to work on the aerodynamics of the car. I'm still a bit concerened by this engine rule, hopefully no teams have a problem lasting 2 GPs or they are pretty much screwed for years to come

The two olds in the title are a typo

It has been over three decades since the greatest racing cars on the planet came face-to-face with the world's most challenging circuit. On 28th April the BMW Sauber F1.07 will become the first Formula One car for 31 years to grace the Nürburgring's legendary Nordschleife track. Nick Heidfeld's journey into history will be the highlight of a full day in the Eifel mountains with the BMW Motorsport racing arsenal.

As BMW Motorsport Director Mario Theissen points out: "This day is our way of saying thank-you to the fans for their support. The same weekend, the Nürburgring Nordschleife will also play host to the VLN Endurance Championship. Around a third of the drivers in the race will line up in BMW models, which helps explain why BMW Motorsport is one of the partners in the VLN. An average of 25,000 spectators will follow the action at the world's most thrilling circuit. BMW is a longstanding partner of the Nürburgring."

"With BMW Driver Training, BMW Adventure World, our "Ring Taxi" rides and the Performance Center all based at the circuit, this is a kind of second home for us - as well as the scene of victories in all disciplines of racing. The Formula One car's laps of the Nordschleife will be the highlight of a day devoted to BMW Motorsport. Nick's demonstration will not be about setting records, but a tribute to a unique race track - one which is inextricably linked to the heritage of BMW Motorsport."

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Source: http://f1.gpupdate.net/en/news ... _old_nurburgring_circuit/

Quote from mr_x :

First of all... everyone has their own opinions on the Tourng Cars vs F1 debate, and I can see that you're expressing your own opinions.

Exactly, so saying "Bah, F1 whats that?" Wasn't really called for... Otherwise you'll get people with opposing opinions

Quote :

You'll find that drivers get punished fairly and equally. Rob Collard last season comes to mind after he had a bit of wreckless driving. Jason Plato has been called before the stewards alot of times, the one driver who doesn't get punished enough is Matt Neal... because he makes it look like the accident was the other drivers fault, when it was his.

I can clearly remember watching BTCC in the last couple of years where a particular French driver was on a wreck fest and nothing happened. I can remember plenty of times where this has happened. Was it Silverstone where Matt Neal was forced off the track and at the end of the race he sped up to catch who ever it was and slammed into there car on the slowing down lap?

Quote :

Anyway, "People who aren't into racing are attracted to it because of the smashing of cars." well I can tell you now, that's NOT the reason I love it so much (and you should know how much I love motorsport), I love it because it's close and very competitive. I certainly wouldn't call it banger racing, yes there's contact, but you get cars separated by a couple of centimeters that are all different shapes, performances etc, it's going to happen. I love the fact I can get close to the action. and it's unpredictable, absolutely no idea who's gonna win the next race.

Cars separated by a couple of centimetres doesn't have to constantly result in half spinning cars out or ramming up there rear end. Shows a lack of ability to judge the braking points. Watch any national level karting and you'll see kids from the age of 8 racing at 60mph bumper to bumper with minimal contact. Why? Because huge amounts of contact is punished. Google Video - Motors TV karting and you'll see racing with 5-6 karts seperated by cms and very minimal contact.

Quote :

When was the last time it cost under £20 to get into an F1 meeting?? when was the last time you could walk around the paddock between races at an F1 venue talking to drivers watching the teams at work??

That's a rather silly point, really. BTCC is cheap as it's not popular enough to justify a large ticket price nor has the facilties, which you are probably basing on Silverstones ticket prices which are one of the most expensive on the GP calendar. I can guarantee there are more people in the F1 paddock than the BTCC, doesn't mean it has free access. How would you fit everyone in the paddock? F1 is too high profile to allow that, lots of equipment would get stolen and drivers would constantly get harassed by people.

Quote :

the only reason why you think that move was 'fantastic' is because it only happens a couple of times a season.

Nope, was fantastic as he kept pushing against the odds from last on the grid. He set the move up perfectly and had a lot of balls to run a couple of centimetres apart at 180mph where the danger of clashing is far greater than in tin top cars.

Quote :

smacking the rear end around to overtake isn't the norm... not in the slightest, I can only remember 1 such incident last year, and the driver got penalised 30 seconds for it. Door handle to doorhandle racing is what you can expect from the BTCC, mainly because it's held on the tight British tracks. There's occasional unfair contact, but door rubbing has happened year upon year. I'd love to see you drive inches off someones rear bumper at 120mph and not hit them :P

Well I'll watch in anticipation for the first rounds of the BTCC to see if your right. I can almost guarantee Plato and co will ram the rear end of a few cars to get past. I've driven bumper to bumper with an average speed of 50mph, topping out at something like 70mph, maybe a little off that. No brake lights either, and out of 3 years I only ever spun one person and that was in the wet.

Quote :

You'll actually find alot of drivers do aspire to be there, Jason Plato has raced in the BTCC since 1997, Matt Neal has been racing in it for every year since 1992/93, if they didn't like it then how come they're still there? A few of the top drivers have been asked about WTCC drives (Jason Plato, Matt Neal, Colin Turkington, Tom Chilton), the reason why they don't go there, because the BTCC is properly run, not by the FIA who are there to destroy motorsport. If drivers didn't aspire to be there, then how come there's 27 cars confirmed for this season and no doubt more will join before the end.

I've never come across anyone aspire to reach the BTCC. Funny you should mention Chilton as I seem to remember him wanting to go to the DTM but that feel through and he ended up having to go back to the BTCC.

Quote :

I can guarentee that if you put F1 drivers in touring cars they really wouldn't do well at all. They'd be awful... hitting each other all the time and blaming it on someone else. (Nigel Mansell anyone?). Infact it's something I'd love to see just to see how bad they are without driving aids.

Considering for the majority of F1 drivers the first car they drove with electronic aids is an F1 car I think they'll be okay at handling what is really a low powered FWD (majority) car to what they are used to. I'd put money on an F1 driver being able to drive a BTCC car better than a BTCC driver could an F1 car.

Quote :

F1 = alienated things that shouldn't be called cars, electronic driving aids, several brake pedals, electronic gear changes, electronic this/that/other, driver just presses the pedals and turns in the direction they want to go, car does the rest.

Alienated? I think the look amazing and so do the general public since they attract the crowds from what I saw at the Autosport show. Several brake pedals? That's new. An F1 car is still hard to drive on the limit like any race car, even harder than most due to the high G Forces they have to put up with for an hour and a half.

Quote :

BTCC = real looking cars in race spec. 3 pedals, a gear leaver, a steering wheel, 4 wheels, an engine, and a bodyshell. The driver does all the work.

Matter of opinion really. To me BTCC cars don't look like race cars, they looked like Riced up street cars that I see on the road. Gear levaver? It's still sequential, only different is they have a little leaver to pull back and forwards over a paddle on a rocker. They are hardly doing much more work than a F1 drivers is, are they?

Quote :

BTCC is run by Alan Gow (and the MSA), he knows what's good for the BTCC and what isn't. He doesn't go making stupid decisions, he makes decisions that improve the racing and improve the spectacle while keeping it as accessable to the public now as it has ever been, if not improving it. And another great thing is, on the BTCC forum, Alan Gow has his own section where fans can ask him questions and he will answer them the best he can.

Doesn't make stupid decisions? I seem to remember there being a race to be as slow as possible to finish 10th. Then they brough in a lottery system. I wouldn't even want to particpate in a championship at club level with rules like that.

Quote :

the main point is... everyone has their own opinion of what's good and what's not, people like Tourng Cars, people like F1. But to say that people who like touring cars aren't true fans of motorsport, shame on you.

No one did say that from what I can see. I've stated BTCC doesn't punish the destruction derby style of Plato etc because it also draws in the crowds of people who aren't particularly interested in good racing.

I know of people who go to the BTCC to watch the support races and see some class drivers who have potential to move onto better things. How many drivers move onto better things in the BTCC? Thompson and Yvan don't seem to be getting on hugely well in the WTCC.

I'll got out of my way to watch F1, GP2, MotoGP and WRC.

Quote from duke_toaster :

JP makes it entertaining for me

Entertaining, not good racing.

Reason the BTCC organisers don't punish the destruction derby driving? Brings in the crowds. People who aren't really into racing are attracted because of all the smashing of cars makes it entertaining, like the people who watch `banger racing.` BTCC has gone dramatically downhill. I remember a time when I was really excited at going to Knockhill to see it.

F1 however, totally different story. Raikkonens move on Fisi was fantastic and I literally jumped off the seat as it was happening. Never have I seen such good overtaking in the BTCC. Always results in one car being barged out of the way, that's not racing in my books. Smacking the rear round to aid an overtaking move is not overtaking, yet that is the norm in BTCC.

I'm embarrassed to have BTCC as Britain's premiere motorsport, how many drivers aspire to be there? Very few, the ones who usually end up there are the ones who couldn't get a seat in the WTCC etc.

I'm sorry but I'd rather watch F1 over a bunch of second rate drivers going banger racing

Quote from Crashgate3 :

I still think £140 is a bit steep for a wheel unless you start to take LFS very, very seriously.

I guess you've not seen the prices of the BRD wheels

Keiran

Quote from Leifde :

@everyone - I was supposed to be karting this weekend but that doesn't look so hopeful anymore, I think my chassis is bent

A little tip if you don't know is to measure the corner weights of the kart. Get hold of 4 bathroom scales (preferably the same as they need to be the same height, we bought ours from Argos) and lay them on a flat surface. Sit the kart on top (obviously with engine etc), sit in it and get someone to take the readings all the way round. If it's bent you'll find one corner of the kart with a lot of weight on it. That's what I used to do and it's what I did when locating where to put my seat and ballast weight.

This is of course if you don't have access to the proper equipment

If it's bent, ouch! My Dad's chassis was bent and we spent so many hours jumping on a bar, with a few heavy mates and the first outing with it the thing sprung back to its bent shape.

Keiran

No, one of the conditions for LFS Tweak to be allowed for V was that it could not be used by demo users. You must own a S1 or S2 license and I don't see the devs changing their minds anytime soon.

Quote from josemspain :

I dont like the speed of wheel.. the last version was better

Doesn't matter whether you like it or not I'm afraid. Thats how it works in real life and tbh I don't even notice. I keep my eyes in the direction I want to be going.

Without looking at the replay (no access to LFS here) are you pointing out the realistic speedos?

Might have to try that myself, don't have sat nav but someone may as well use the railway lines while the workers are on strike Whats the speed limit on the railways?

Quote from Nathan_French_14 :

I hate the BF1 also, as its easy to make up for lost time in that car

Heh....

Surely if your racing quick drivers then it's just as hard to make up for lost time in any car on any track...

I can bet it's the new sounds, you don't realise how much information they give until they are changed.

You really think Scawen would change the physics without documenting it? Not to mention how online play would be all to pot and replays out of synch.

Quote from Arsenic_Fox :

Im thinking maybe they should make it so that you could turn that off?

I mean, you dont need to have bits and pieces, id just like to see the tire be flat at the bottom ^^

How would you work turing off damage for some but not others, surely that is unfair?

Also if you have a puncture the tyre does go flat visually... One thing I love about LFS is when you have a flat tyre and try drive the car it actually feels and moves like it has a flat tyre.

Quote from bbman :

It's not incompetence either... They just didn't know better because they couldn't be bothered to read what they're actually buying...

Quote from bbman :

:rolleyes:

Please read the thread to understand the situation, specifically Scawen's post.

Keiran

Never required to ask for extra unlocks.

People just need to engage the brain before doing things. I have two copies of LFS on my system and LFS unlocked on another computer for LAN play.

Remove the limit and people will have no problem with sharing their license. IPs are a waste of time to track people, all they have to claim is they are using a dynamic IP.

Keiran

Yes, you can get the lapcount from the pb and then work out the mileage.

Quote :

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?action=pb
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(get all online pb's of a racer)

requires: &racer=<racer>
optional: -
returns: <track> <car> <time> <lapcount>

Is there not a video going about where Tom Cruise couldn't figure out how to open the door to let his passenger out. Can't remember where they were going, who it was... yea basically can't remember anything so may have made it up

Think he means about racing cars in reverse gear around the track... Which I don't think would be possible without having a program on each clients computer.

As MAGGOT has said, as long as it is in the same household their isn't really anything wrong with that. LFS is still installed on one computer, there is a reason for being able to create more than one player on a license

On the other hand if it's installed on three computers then yea, they'd be breaking the license agreement.

Scawen told us quite a while back their were something like 30 000 S2 licensed users if I remember correctly? If that's right then I'd imagine it's gone up a fair bit since then.

It will be your firewall. You must set the rules up to allow the LFS.exe. Otherwise it will be blocking the connection to the master server (i.e the heart of LFS online)

Every test patch you install you will need to re-allow the LFS.exe to connect as the firewall picks up on it being a different .exe.

Keiran

Definitely no way, -1 from me.

You don't go bidding on eBay or calling people in the middle of a race or even a track day... You go on LFS to race, if you wish to send family vacation photos you load up your preferred software for sending emails, not LFS.

It's also another distraction, some people are bad enough at leaving their cars on the track while talking on MSN, causing yellow flags and even getting in the way of overtaking moves.

How many people actually use the SMS messaging system integrated into LFS? I doubt many do. The only use I can see of it is *maybe* if someone goes away from their computer in an endurance race you could have F keys set-up to send them a SMS to get them back to their computer.