The online racing simulator
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Macfox
S2 licensed
From a 2002 perspective [rscnet.org forums], the game hasn't changed much since 2007. 2007 was a turning point for LFS. It's where active development essentially tailed off and community engagement followed.

It's positive to see it being maintained into it's 16th year, but it's a ghost town now.

I pop back "lurking" every now and then, with a glimmer of hope, that the devs will put some serious effort behind it or invite resources in to restore the game to it's former glory. However this year marks 10 years waiting...
Last edited by Macfox, .
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from MiniVan :I havent played for quite some time, I was wondering if there were going to be any continued progress updates of significance ever going to happen any time soon?

No. LFS in software terms is end of life. A few token updates, (that those in denial will point out) that aren't trivial, but add little to rejuvenating the "racing" game. It's been that way for nearly 10 years and certainly will not change.

I picture the devs sitting in front of BW TV's, working towards building the 1st colour TV, only they deny it's 2015, but hey we've got a tethered remote control and a manual in 100 different languages....We're getting there.

Rift support is a great example LFS development philosophy. A niche game, supporting niche hardware not even to market. Sure the concept is cool, but the "reality" is, VR support for looking at 2005 vintage graphics.
Last edited by Macfox, .
Macfox
S2 licensed
Agreed, but those that ignore the past, are destined to repeat it. Hence many still wait/whing/whatever, unaware of how LFS development was pre 06/07. Many of the concerns I voiced publicly back then were unpopular, but have largely come true.

As always after an update, there's a spike of interest. Being a content update, it will probably last longer. Long enough to turn things around? Probably not. But if we see a few more updates in close succession, then the devs will have turned a page and maybe they're serious about LFS being viable into the future.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from cargame.nl :Well.. I am here for today because I got notified of this Westhill buzz of course and after such a long time of hosting I sure want to experience the changes but I am uncertain about the future. Basically it's the state of the community which made me decide to pull the plug and I have extreme doubts the situation drastically changes after this Westhill release.. But... Be positive and drink some beer or something Taped Shut

Hats off to you for sticking at it for so long, given the state of the community. If it wasn't for CG and the a select few others over the last few years, the game wouldn't have limped on for so long. But you are right. Too little too late. You can not count on the devs for any support. The concept of community has always been a foreign idea to them. A community neglected and totally devoid of it's racing enthusiast heritage and littered with skeletons of past advocates of the game.

Releasing content now is a total joke given all the excuses about why it couldn't happen years ago. Zero faith! Sums up all that is wrong with LFS "content" development.

Anyway CG's departure is totally understandable and a great loss to remnants of the racing community.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Great to see another release on the content side and the end of the content hostage saga after 6 years.

Lets hope this will give LFS the much needed injection of life it deserves.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from Xenix74 :How often must Scawen say he working on S3.

About once a year.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Surely the popularity of other games (in the US) are a direct result of Advertising or mainstream publicity. I don't think it has anything to do with culture of needing to win.

LFS never reached a critical mass outside of the EU IMO. There were peaks around releases, but nothing really sustained for any great time. More of a timezone factor rather than anything culture wise. There were a few dedicated individuals who invested in servers to support non-EU competitions etc (for many years), but it never was more than a niche. They were probably responsible for a good percentage of license sales over the years too. It certainly would have made sense for the devs to invest (at any level) in these individuals/competitions, but there was nothing, not even any acknowledgement.
Macfox
S2 licensed
He's made a dozen or so posts (circa '10), but he deleted them. They weren't flattering and probably not really representative of him as a person, as is the case with anyone, when their buttons are pushed.

If he is active (in some form) then it's really disappointing he has chosen to withhold content. It really seems counter productive to let the game wither on the vine for 6+ years. In many ways it under mines Scavier's efforts.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from edge3147 :The fact that they continue to withhold new content over some concern regarding physics is just stupid.

When pressed a couple of years+ back, Scavier said it was up to Eric to release content. Given how long it has been since anything of substance has materialized, one has to seriously consider if he is still involved / active.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from dawesdust_12 :Problem is, if Scawen gives any kind of time estimation, everyone jumps on it like a slut on a dick....

Problem is the fanboys mouths are already occupying that space. Only way to get them off for a few short seconds is to dare question the state of the game and it's community.

It's really is the kind of complacency and ignorance that has contributed to the decline in interest in this game. As soon as anyone dares ask or questions progress... They're immediately set upon.... Attacked for being a demo'er or not playing enough or every combo...

The forum was once the heart and soul of the community. IMO it now serves many as a reminder to forget LFS.... "Nothing to see... Move along people."
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from Breizh :Bullshit.

LOL! There's no room here for faith. That ship sailed long ago my friend.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from Breizh :bombast

Bernie?....Bernie Madoff... is that you?

Quote from Breizh :And it's just coincidence that LFS progress and the number of attractive racing car physics models are both low.

That's primarily the result of a tiny sim market to begin with. Development effort in the physics area is a secondary factor, not the deciding factor as you imply.

Developing tyre physics to Scawen's aspirations (given the state of LFS after 6 years), is beyond one person, but that's not to say a modest team of AC's size (10 AFAIK) can't do better. In fact many argue it's surpassed LFS in that area.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Blasphemy... You ungrateful swine... How dare you speak ill of LFS... You insensitive clod... We don't care that you preceded Jesus or your perspective.

The glory days of RSC... Only a handful left now.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from yankman :I have the feeling Scawen has lost his motivation some time ago.

Can't be bothered digging up the quote, but he actually said something to that effect several years back. That I understand. But holding content ransom I cannot, especially since no progress is visible and no end in sight after years have passed. Apparently that decision is in the hands of Eric, but he's been recluse for years (from a LFS PoV) and the few time's he participated he's made it clear he doesn't GAFF. So the whole thing is pretty FUBAR.
Macfox
S2 licensed
It's all about compromises at the moment. Empty servers and stale content isn't my cup of tea.

I agree AC looks like the best candidate out of the bunch.
Macfox
S2 licensed
It's really sad to see an icon of indie game development, crash and burn this way, destroying reputation and leaving a bitter taste in so many investors mouths. Things are bad when the stalwarts and fanboys of yesteryear are spruiking the competition.

LFS has now reach a point where it has been stale longer than it was active. Clearly it's rather pointless investing in LFS or hoping for a return to any form of popularity. If it weren't for the vacuum of competition in the sim space, LFS wouldn't have staggered on this far. Competition from all sides, have eroded LFS's popularity and community. It's really hard to imagine license sales would support much more than bread and water at this stage, let alone the required time and dedication LFS needs.

Don't wait... Remember LFS for the revolution in sim race it was and move on, like the vast majority have done. They're plenty of options to choose from.

AC looks very promising. In its limited life, AC has managed to achieve remarkable results in the physics area. MP is all that LFS has on it really. Once that milestone is reached, I think it will focus the masses like LFS did and boast the thriving community.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from Becky Rose :In regards to the many years of delay and shrunken user base - its my view that LFS self destructed. But I don't regard the situation as unsalvagable.

Always get a good laugh, when I see such posts.

I made similar pessimistic comments many years ago and was shot down by the legions, many lacking perspective and ignorant of the LFS history.

Where are they now?
Macfox
S2 licensed
Oculus Rift cofounder and lead engineer killed... Truly sad... On the verge of making a massive impact in the industry only to be taken out by some idiot.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1079 ... 3-killed-by-speeding-car/

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/st ... nge_county&id=9122999
Macfox
S2 licensed
Nice. Was there any driving type demos? Where did you test it?
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from Waste Me :...they will not realise the next until the current one stops making money.

Apparently (to a few here) money is largely an irrelevant factor. I don't share that belief. Bit like saying you don't need food to live. Common sense demands accepting there will come a time, where it will be the primary factor, if this trend continues.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from Intrepid :
There is no wrong, there is not right. As long as you can continue with what you love doing, that's all that matters.

It's great you have an interest in business, but it sounds like you've done a cheap course on it that fails to reflect the realities of life.

Don't be so pretentious. Be less presumptuous about knowing the devs feelings and PoV. I'm sure if they wanted some speak on their behalf they would do it themselves.

You joke about realities of life. It should be obvious to the educated, but despite all fluffy and feel good hippie advice, there's limits in life, like it or not. While I wish the best for the devs in their pursuit, it's not sustainable at least in the current form. That much is obvious. If it's wrong to try and persuade a change for the greater good of the game, its fans and its future, then maybe it's already too late.
Macfox
S2 licensed
TBH, I doubt this topic has more influence than the front page of the website. If it did, then I'd say they would take action, but in doing so would probably draw more attention to it and alienate/split the community, making it worse.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Obviously you have a certain PoV and you welcome to share that. However it's certainly not widely accepted.

Being patronising and presuming of others rather than focusing on the topic doesn't really match the traits you seem to expect of others does it?

Couple of points. S2 isn't finished. Cost of the product is irrelevant. The devs set the price and the milestones. If that were the issue plenty would pay more for more? No realistic person is expecting a free lunch or to "enslave" the devs.

If well proven principles of business, that have served world for god knows how long, is narrow minded and ridiculous to apply to LFS, then I want some of that crack you are smoking.

The current approach is unconventional, largely directionless and undefined (at least to future and current customers). Absence of approach doesn't equate a clear approach. If it were clear as you seem to claim, we wouldn't see the typical "WTF is going on with LFS" sentiment/posts here...would we?
Last edited by Macfox, . Reason : typo's
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from cargame.nl :Millions of people decide to give less power then they are actually capable of. Doesn't necessarily imply they are unhappy, negative or whatever.

Regards of why, when or how, Eric's become a lightening rod for discontent. Some would argue the fairness of that based on their exposure to his interaction. Those that had the opportunity to see those posts would largely say he has a negative mindset towards the community and could careless what anyone here thinks of him or his work (ethic). The fact that he deleted his history though, hints he's does care to some degree. He's a man of mystery for sure.
Macfox
S2 licensed
Quote from col :That is true - but only for the early days. As the game became more popular over time, things changed, reception of new updates became less and less about constructive criticism and more and more just complaints and rudeness. It was only _after_ the community response turned sour in this way that the devs cut back on their interaction and stopped posting their hopes and plans, regular development reports etc.

Absolutely... What's happened, has happened. It's a tough experience for the devs. One thing's for sure, despite the varying opinion here on development, the overwhelming consensus is there's still a lot of passion in the community. Hopefully the devs can turn a page and turn it around in time for the better of LFS and it's fans.
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